Isocyanate free 2k paint

  1. old yellar Member

    why use a hardener with your high build attall?
     
  2. Daz1968 Member

    Messages:
    532
    Uk
    It won't set without a hardener but I could use upol p88 high build but wanted to try 2k as its better, but with the unibinder is better than p88 but not as good as with proper hardener as it still softens when over sprayed with high solvent top coat where a true 2k hardener once the paint has gone off it won't be effected by thinners at all as it is a chemical reaction I believe similar to how body filler goes off.
     
  3. veesix Member

    Messages:
    21
    UK
    How would the people who have used the Valspar uni-binder compare it to cellulose? I was originally going to go for cellulose but this uni-binder looks interesting.
    Cheers.
     
  4. Daz1968 Member

    Messages:
    532
    Uk
    I think it will be easier to apply than cellulose as only 2 coats required and both done in succession of each other after flash time. I am going to try it on my mini when weather picks up.
     
  5. Homeworker Member

    Messages:
    12
    Oxfordshire
    Well i sprayed some 2K primer + Unibinder earlier. It seemed to come out very 'bitty' as old paint with hard bits in does. It's given a texture very similar to that of stone chip from a Shlutz gun does. I'm not sure if it was sufficiently thinned. I made it up as per instructions for 2K primer 4.1 20% thinners. Can anyone recommend how much more it needs to be thinned? It had started to flatten out a bit as I was leaving the workshop, but I haven't had a chance to check how its gone off
     
  6. Daz1968 Member

    Messages:
    532
    Uk
    I think I added about 30% thinners to get it to lay flat, the unibinder is a lot thicker than 2k hardener, first time I painted with it and followed instructions as well as being textured it took far to long to harden off for sanding
     
  7. Homeworker Member

    Messages:
    12
    Oxfordshire
    Thanks for that. So you stuck with the 4:1 (Primer:unibinder) ratio, but upped the thinners? How long did it take to go off? I noticed it was still soft even after about 10-15 minutes.

    Did you also find that the unibinder was a struggle to get it to mix with the primer? I found i had to work it pretty hard to get a homogenous mixture, otherwise the unibinder sort of stuck all together. Is it worth heating the unibinder before mixing it in in a simialr way to stone chip paint?
     
  8. Homeworker Member

    Messages:
    12
    Oxfordshire
    Well i thinned the mixture more today, around 35%. Went on much better and smoother. I also sprayed a very thin layer of pure thinners over the panel too, which helped even more. When rubbed down it was perfect
     
  9. El Donkey Member

    Messages:
    33
    Staffs, England
    I assume this is drying just as clear as the existing clear coats. As I am not in a position to use iso I have been trying 1k acrylic. Going to try another brand this weekend but the upol is giving a darker tint when layed than the existing clear coat.
     
  10. Daz1968 Member

    Messages:
    532
    Uk
    Are you trying to lose the clear on a flat panel as that may be difficult, the small amount of upol 1k clear I used I blended on a curve near a corner and that was ok, was just practicing on a car wheel arch panel I had. I just found it did run easily but put that down to my lack of practice
     
  11. El Donkey Member

    Messages:
    33
    Staffs, England
    The runs I have sussed, I put on light.coats, setting the flow lock on the gun to be.sure as more than a gentle wet coat does run. Or worse, cooks the base coat.

    I have blended on some strong curves which does help but in other areas where not possible a shadow can be seen when viewed at an angle.

    I've not tried with 2k so not sure if this also happens. The 1k definitely gives the paint a darker tone. I am using silver, probably not such an issue with darker colours.
     
  12. the snooper

    the snooper getting older by the day

    Messages:
    20,384
    Location:
    Hull UK
    are you using the correct thinner ie not cheap celly thinner that has a tint to it as that darkens the clear coat
     
  13. El Donkey Member

    Messages:
    33
    Staffs, England
    The upol is ready for use. I'll attach a pic to give an idea. Not a great area to try and blend but the quarter panel has very wide pillars and did not want to clear a whole area in 1k when the painted area was only the size of a playing card plus the base blend. The stripes are the lighting not on the car as taken with a phone camera but that is the effect when seen at a sharp angle. Straight on you cannot see it so assume the 1k has a different refractive index to the original clear coat.

    That or I'm doing something wrong but no idea what.
     
    • 20130403_192922.jpg
  14. the snooper

    the snooper getting older by the day

    Messages:
    20,384
    Location:
    Hull UK
    do I take it the is the blended area
     
    • 20130403_192922.jpg
  15. El Donkey Member

    Messages:
    33
    Staffs, England
    The corner of the arch is where I painted but as that is curved the pic has only picked up the area you marked. That is where the blend ends. Its not quite as bad as it looks, with the spot light on and the camera effect has exaggerated a bit but it will be noticeable in sunlight.

    this pic is of a full wing I cleared, the top of the wing is original paint as the base blend only goes up half way. Its not been flatted/polished yet but you can tell a difference.
     
    • 20130403_193111.jpg
  16. the snooper

    the snooper getting older by the day

    Messages:
    20,384
    Location:
    Hull UK
    don't know if its just the camera but is the base a good match ?
    base coat always looks darker with clear on it and from those picture it looks to have a redish tint to it
     
  17. El Donkey Member

    Messages:
    33
    Staffs, England
    The red is just the camera phone not adapting to the bright lighting well.


    The base is a bit light but has blended up from the arch quite well. The top of the wing is the original base/clear with the 1k on top (scuffed wet with 2000)

    At some angles it is the same as the 2k bonnet and others it has a hint of blue/grey.

    The best way to describe it is like newspaper where the 1k is like a damp patch changing the colour of the dry paper if you see what I mean.

    I dont know if this tone will fade or get worse. The wing was painted last week. The panel gap breaks it up a bit but this is why the blend on the rear quarter is more obvious.
     
  18. Homeworker Member

    Messages:
    12
    Oxfordshire
    So i've been having more trouble with this. When spraying the colour coats, using the unibinder hardner, i'm getting really bad solvent pop. I have taken to spraying very light coats and waiting for it to flash off. Problem is I can't lay enough paint on at a time to get a smooth coat. I'm thinned down about 45-50% as the unibinder is very thick. Any ideas?
     
  19. Homeworker Member

    Messages:
    12
    Oxfordshire
    Well an update.

    I've decided to sack this off as I'm having far too many problems with it. It's fine when I use it with primer, drys and sands lovely although does need thinning substantially. However, as mentioned above with the colour coats, I was plagued with awful sovent pop. On top of this, the paint won't dry. I sprayed a panel about 2 months ago, and its still soft!

    So I rubbed the colour coat, with solvent pop, smooth and primed again. However, the primer 'cracked' when sprayed over the colour coat which made a total mess of the whole car. If I spray colour onto colour its fine, and when I use normal 2K and spray this onto colour then its fine too. There's obviously something in the primer thats reactin, but I don't know what. When I spray the primer (with unibinder) onto standard 2K colour coat all is fine. It's a bloody nightmare.

    So to summarise, I'm using unibinder and 2K primer but normal 2K colour coat. Not ideal but i'm now out of time and I know I can spray 2k fine.

    Anyone had similar issues with it not drying/reacting?
     
  20. langy

    langy langys rodshop

    Messages:
    6,099
    Location:
    London

    Why are you using the unibinder ???
     
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