A question for the drillbitists

[graffian]

HSS cotter pin drill and a simple guide/bush?

 

[sako243]

@8ob - is this preventing you coming west? If not and you can bring the hubs with you then we'll pop up to Roger's (half way between Guy's place and mine) and he'll have them out whilst we drink a cuppa (you'll like his workshop - and no you're still not getting his shaper, I've had first dibs on that!).

I'm all for DIY, but I think I might be reaching for the Yellow Pages and "general engineers" - clamped on a locating bush on a decent sized mill and clock it round for each bolt - repeat for each hub - once set up, should be reasonably quick. Remove the remnants, drill out, helicoil, done.

Or days with a drill press, even a big 'un . . . and wasting time that could be spent better elsewhere.

Trouble is @8ob has a better equipped workshop than most of the "general engineers" in Surrey. Trouble is he can't find most of it.

 

[Johnnybravo]

@8ob - is this preventing you coming west? If not and you can bring the hubs with you then we'll pop up to Roger's (half way between Guy's place and mine) and he'll have them out whilst we drink a cuppa

I would love to see this . Either you drink very slowly or serve tea in 44 gallon drums …
Ive done probably 10 or 12 of these hubs over the years. None were done in a cup of tea‘s time….

 

[Johnnybravo]

I could use the new discs as a drilling jig if I spun up some drilling bushes, I can cut the broken bolts down with the gas axe. I have tried to mill off the top of the bolts but they are way to hard for any of the cutters I have here.

There are four of these hubs to do.

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Pm me if you want me to do them for you. They are time consuming so you would need to prise open your wallet..

 

[Johnnybravo]

cut off as low as you can arc weld above so you get loads of heat into that bolt

should be the same method for those types of bolts to remove them

GLWTS….

 

[Johnnybravo]

Or just send them to Johnny bravo, by the time you've cursed and sworn at them you might as well have paid him

You need special swear words or the bolts don’t listen
More than happy to take them on as a paying job.

 

[Johnnybravo]

The trick with decent carbide is to get it spinning so fast it doesn't have time too break.

The trick with decent carbide is not to use it when what you are drilling can move or snag. Doesn’t matter how fast you spin it,if the bolt you a drilling out moves,your decent carbide,( or not decent carbide) gets put back into kit form instantly….

 

[Johnnybravo]

Done loads of them, so many it makes me shudder just looking at the pics, what you have there actually looks real good.
You have enough shank left there to either weld an m8/10 nut onto and undo that way or use one of the tapered stud removal tools, 5/16-8mm is the size you need.
When they are real bad you have a bolt that the shank is so waisted, as you undo the head it shears off leaving a ****ty little stub, then its a tapered chisel to remove the bulk of the remains, die grinder to get the remains flat, then dot punch and drill away.
Think the bolts are std M8 8.8 Iirc tightening torque was 30nm ie nowt special
It sounds real bad but the new holes do not have to be perfect so long as the bolt tightens it will be just fine, ie the work would make an engineer cry but will hold just fine.

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Highly unlikely your insurance company would take the same stance of ,”the new holes do not have to be perfect” should your truck be inspected following a serious accident with loss of life…..
We are not talking about a 1ton chav mobile here,we are talking 15 -20 ton plus….

 

[Agroshield]

Highly unlikely your insurance company would take the same stance of ,”the new holes do not have to be perfect”....

Highly agree with your remark above about carbide. It is seen as the magic material but for any less than optimal conditions (not so rigid machine, not so rigid workpiece, not so uniform material) its brittleness counts against it. At least when it does break off in the hole, its ability to shatter at a glance helps you to remove it.

You are strictly correct in what you say, but I think the bolts only locate the disk, just like the countersunk screws on a car disk. It looks like the big notches transfer the braking force. I do not think 12 M8 bolts in shear will do much when the brake pads grip the disk. Compare and contrast the size of those bolts with the ones holding the wheel on, which transfer the braking force to the ground. Even if every bolt is removed, once the caliper and pads go over the disk, it cannot go anywhere.

 

[8ob]

Here is where I am with this, I mounted the hubs up on my mill and there is not enough height under the quill with a short drill in a chuck/ collet chuck with a milling cutter to do the job. There is enough height on both my drill stands if I can find suitable drill bits, it wouldn't really matter if these holes went out to m10 but ideally I would like to be keeping them m8. The bolts are only keepers, the rotational forces are taken up on the drive lugs. Cant have the truck off the road too long so I will do one axle at a time. @Johnnybravo could you PM a price per unit and some idea of timescale, I can get them down to you or you can collect from doggers paradise

Bob

 

[sako243]

I would love to see this . Either you drink very slowly or serve tea in 44 gallon drums …
Ive done probably 10 or 12 of these hubs over the years. None were done in a cup of tea‘s time….

I was rather expecting Bob to get lost in Roger's scrap pile for a good few hours first then he'd be distracted by the workshop and eventually he'd get around to realising his tea was cold but before he'd get there Anoush would have cooked us all some delicious biscotti before a meal of roast lamb. Then he'd eventually remember to make a fresh cup of tea and finish that just as the last bolt was being drilled out.

But this is a guy who has the ability to make his own drive gears and hubs for a 45t excavator in the barn workshop out back. I phoned him up a few years ago asking if his lathe was big enough to bore out the centre of a flywheel I wanted for a Land Rover. He said hold on, I'll go and check I can't remember if it's a 4 or 5ft capacity I've got... He came back a few minutes later and said 5ft, I asked if he was expecting me to want him to turn the whole Land Rover at once...

 

[Woody.v8]

I don't know what sort of money they charge but @8ob but worth an ask .
https://www.cvhubs.co.uk/services/daf-wheel-hub-services/

 

[Johnnybravo]

@8ob
Pm sent

 

[Mikes]

GLWTS….

Being a quiet, innocent person, I had to look that up - definitely not to be confused with GLWS. Think I furthered my education.

 

[Trevorleach]

Highly unlikely your insurance company would take the same stance of ,”the new holes do not have to be perfect” should your truck be inspected following a serious accident with loss of life…..
We are not talking about a 1ton chav mobile here,we are talking 15 -20 ton plus….

I am sorry to tell you the heavy commercial world is far from a perfect place.

How the original discs are fitted the bolts are of little importance after a few years, I have seen many a truck with some of the bolts missing, or rotten so thin as to be useless.
From new the bolts hold a spring clip which retains two flat wedges, the wedges both locate the disc and dissipate the heat the brakes produce, they actually modded the wedges later on as to much heat was getting to the wheel bearings.

The only hgv discs that are easy to change are the scania ones.

 

[8ob]

Being a quiet, innocent person, I had to look that up - definitely not to be confused with GLWS. Think I furthered my education.

I seem to spend my life deciphering/Googling nerdy pooter speak

Bob

 

[Johnnybravo]

I am sorry to tell you the heavy commercial world is far from a perfect place.

How the original discs are fitted the bolts are of little importance after a few years, I have seen many a truck with some of the bolts missing, or rotten so thin as to be useless.
From new the bolts hold a spring clip which retains two flat wedges, the wedges both locate the disc and dissipate the heat the brakes produce, they actually modded the wedges later on as to much heat was getting to the wheel bearings.

The only hgv discs that are easy to change are the scania ones.

Granted, I am not that naïve. However, suggesting bodging a job involving truck brakes on a public forum probably isn’t a very bright idea , now is it? …

 

[bricol]

Trouble is @8ob has a better equipped workshop than most of the "general engineers" in Surrey. Trouble is he can't find most of it.

That's the impression I got

I was working on the theory that it's a working truck that's not currently earning any money, so the quicker it gets sorted, the better.

If you have to spend a week finding the gear, buying the tools, spend the time doing it, that's you not earning anything either . . . when a few quid (relatively) to someone with instant access to the equipment and tools . . .

 

[taxi ray]

Would you not be better off finding an axle from a commercial breaker, a lot easier replacing an axle or even the hubs, and then you would have some spares to fix at your leisure.

 

[Trevorleach]

Granted, I am not that naïve. However, suggesting bodging a job involving truck brakes on a public forum probably isn’t a very bright idea , now is it? …

Maybe that is how you took my writings and made them fit our own thoughts?
Granted that is how some people think, I of course cannot stop what goes on in peoples minds, naive or not.