Munkul
Jack of some trades, Master of none
- Messages
- 7,370
- Location
- Cumbria
Bit of a tale of woe, but also it might be a bit of a journey, so I thought I'd start a thread on it
Before any of you get started and tell me how rubbish it is/I am, you have to remember, I'm not a machinist by trade, and never will be! I have college training only, and wanted a large capacity lathe with a short bed, for general repair and project work, and I can't see me ever needing accuracy of more than 1 thou. I also have plenty projects on, and really just wanted a lathe I could jump on and turn stuff, not a machine that needs a load of time.
But anyway...I picked up this M400 from a farmer out by Newcastle. He said his generator didn't have the power to start it (it's a 10hp motor, to be fair) so it had just sat taking space up for a year.
Mechanically, it seemed ok on first glance. I noticed the missing gap bed plug, but the low price, and eternal optimism won, and I took it.
It came with a 10" 3-jaw (it works, but could use some new jaws) and a 12" 4-jaw, that looks in very good condition. A Dickson toolpost, 3 holders, a fixed steady, and a handful of knackered tools.
First start-up in my workshop... the motor made a racket! So I replaced both motor bearings.
Installed, and levelled with a standard level, not a precision one onto some 12mm flat plates.
Slots in nicely behind my jig table, up against the wall... made to measure!
Then we cleaned it up... started looking less of a bargain... the bed was clearly worn at the chuck ends. The saddle wouldn't move past halfway towards the tailstock... eventually realised it wasn't the rust on the ways and shafts, it was the keeper strips! Backed them off and the saddle was free to move all the way. The cross slide and compound slides seem fairly tight and well-adjusted.
First test cuts were not encouraging. 4 thou over the first 4 inches.
I made up a coolant tray and did another test cut, with the centre supporting it. This was a bit better, but still jumped up 2 thou at the chuck end. Roundness was as good as could be, though. (I think in thou, but my mics are metric!)
Biggest problem I see here is the slight ridges in the finish... it's not an even pattern, and it jumps 2 thou. I looked at the rack, and it's badly worn. I have a strong suspicion that the pinion and rack are causing this.
At least the tailstock alignment is good!
So... been talking to a few people about what to do with it... Clearly it's had quite a lot of work and abuse to the saddle and bed, and needs a re-grind. I have already acquired a gap plug from another machine, if I do go down this route.
Pros:
It's a very heavy machine with tons of capacity, speed and power
It has a full metric/imperial screwcutting gearbox
Headstock sounds good (that is to say, no worse than any other Harrison/Colchester!)
Cons:
Needs stripped down and a bed grind to get any sort of repeatable accuracy out of it
Needs the rack turned around and probably the pinion turned or swapped for a good one as well
Needs some new jaws for the 3-jaw (£400 for a set of new Burnards! ) and no outside jaws for either chuck
Leadscrew LOOKS in good nick, but have no way to measure wear on it...
cross slide power feed doesn't hold itself
missing the changewheels for Diametric and Mod pitches... not exactly a dealbreaker
Next things to do are to clean up and fit the 4-jaw chuck (I've hard to order a 14mm hex to make a key from) and to investigate the rack and pinion.
I'm quite keen on spending some money on this machine, I've kinda got it in my head that I could plough more than I paid into it and it'll still be far superior than anything else I could buy for the price... assuming the headstock and apron/crossslide don't have any nasty gremlins waiting around the corner to catch me out
I've been talking to @pressbrake1 about this, and it sounds like it would go like this:
1. I strip down the saddle and headstock, and send the bed and plug to Blue Diamond for a regrind
2. I then send the bed, headstock, saddle and tailstock down to Essex for Clive to work his magic on, to build up and scrape in
3. He sends it all back up, and i rebuild it and align it all
I served my time as a mechie fitter, but it's gonna be a steep learning curve... and expensive, too So I haven't came to any final decision yet.
Before any of you get started and tell me how rubbish it is/I am, you have to remember, I'm not a machinist by trade, and never will be! I have college training only, and wanted a large capacity lathe with a short bed, for general repair and project work, and I can't see me ever needing accuracy of more than 1 thou. I also have plenty projects on, and really just wanted a lathe I could jump on and turn stuff, not a machine that needs a load of time.
But anyway...I picked up this M400 from a farmer out by Newcastle. He said his generator didn't have the power to start it (it's a 10hp motor, to be fair) so it had just sat taking space up for a year.
Mechanically, it seemed ok on first glance. I noticed the missing gap bed plug, but the low price, and eternal optimism won, and I took it.
It came with a 10" 3-jaw (it works, but could use some new jaws) and a 12" 4-jaw, that looks in very good condition. A Dickson toolpost, 3 holders, a fixed steady, and a handful of knackered tools.
First start-up in my workshop... the motor made a racket! So I replaced both motor bearings.
Installed, and levelled with a standard level, not a precision one onto some 12mm flat plates.
Slots in nicely behind my jig table, up against the wall... made to measure!
Then we cleaned it up... started looking less of a bargain... the bed was clearly worn at the chuck ends. The saddle wouldn't move past halfway towards the tailstock... eventually realised it wasn't the rust on the ways and shafts, it was the keeper strips! Backed them off and the saddle was free to move all the way. The cross slide and compound slides seem fairly tight and well-adjusted.
First test cuts were not encouraging. 4 thou over the first 4 inches.
I made up a coolant tray and did another test cut, with the centre supporting it. This was a bit better, but still jumped up 2 thou at the chuck end. Roundness was as good as could be, though. (I think in thou, but my mics are metric!)
Biggest problem I see here is the slight ridges in the finish... it's not an even pattern, and it jumps 2 thou. I looked at the rack, and it's badly worn. I have a strong suspicion that the pinion and rack are causing this.
At least the tailstock alignment is good!
So... been talking to a few people about what to do with it... Clearly it's had quite a lot of work and abuse to the saddle and bed, and needs a re-grind. I have already acquired a gap plug from another machine, if I do go down this route.
Pros:
It's a very heavy machine with tons of capacity, speed and power
It has a full metric/imperial screwcutting gearbox
Headstock sounds good (that is to say, no worse than any other Harrison/Colchester!)
Cons:
Needs stripped down and a bed grind to get any sort of repeatable accuracy out of it
Needs the rack turned around and probably the pinion turned or swapped for a good one as well
Needs some new jaws for the 3-jaw (£400 for a set of new Burnards! ) and no outside jaws for either chuck
Leadscrew LOOKS in good nick, but have no way to measure wear on it...
cross slide power feed doesn't hold itself
missing the changewheels for Diametric and Mod pitches... not exactly a dealbreaker
Next things to do are to clean up and fit the 4-jaw chuck (I've hard to order a 14mm hex to make a key from) and to investigate the rack and pinion.
I'm quite keen on spending some money on this machine, I've kinda got it in my head that I could plough more than I paid into it and it'll still be far superior than anything else I could buy for the price... assuming the headstock and apron/crossslide don't have any nasty gremlins waiting around the corner to catch me out
I've been talking to @pressbrake1 about this, and it sounds like it would go like this:
1. I strip down the saddle and headstock, and send the bed and plug to Blue Diamond for a regrind
2. I then send the bed, headstock, saddle and tailstock down to Essex for Clive to work his magic on, to build up and scrape in
3. He sends it all back up, and i rebuild it and align it all
I served my time as a mechie fitter, but it's gonna be a steep learning curve... and expensive, too So I haven't came to any final decision yet.
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