hand held speed gun

[RaceDiagnostics]

One of the roads on my route home from work in Edinburgh goes along ~1/2mile 20mph road (the road is not narrow or busy or near a school, but it is lined by £1M mansions). Anyway, since Kim's incident, I have been sticking to 20, no one else does as I get overtaken every night now, even by cyclists!

Driving at 20 feels very, very slow and creates a lot of angry drivers behind me, when Edinburgh council expands this to much of the city next year I just can't see how it will work out.

 

[skotl]

One of the roads on my route home from work in Edinburgh goes along ~1/2mile 20mph road (the road is not narrow or busy or near a school, but it is lined by £1M mansions). Anyway, since Kim's incident, I have been sticking to 20, no one else does as I get overtaken every night now, even by cyclists!

Driving at 20 feels very, very slow and creates a lot of angry drivers behind me, when Edinburgh council expands this to much of the city next year I just can't see how it will work out.

Yep - it's a total disaster.
I'm in Queensferry, which was one of the first to get it, and the polis have been clear that they will not be enforcing it so you see people overtaking the small number of vehicles that are adhering to the 20 limit.

 

[skotl]

My understanding is that many driving offences do not require corroboration by a second officer.
To return to the topic of speeding, in Edinburgh the camera vans are manned by a single person, and that person is a civilian employee of the police service - not even a police officer! - and they only need the photo evidence.

Just got this from a friend of mine, who's a serving police officer in Glasgow (on the topic of speeding, specifically, in Scots' law);

"Doesn't have to be a cop, a "credible witness" supported by cctv or still photo etc, would suffice to give you corroboration, in the exact same way that Joe public with a dash cam or mobile phone would provide evidence to corroborate their account. Speed cameras are another obvious exemption"​

 

[zx9]

One of the roads on my route home from work in Edinburgh goes along ~1/2mile 20mph road (the road is not narrow or busy or near a school, but it is lined by £1M mansions). Anyway, since Kim's incident, I have been sticking to 20, no one else does as I get overtaken every night now, even by cyclists!

Driving at 20 feels very, very slow and creates a lot of angry drivers behind me, when Edinburgh council expands this to much of the city next year I just can't see how it will work out.

Many London boroughs are proudly boasting that they are 20mph boroughs, thankfully most of the TFL red routes are still 30.
I have to say that I find it very hard to concentrate driving at 20MPH, I get board driving in just two gears and will admit to spending far too much time with my eyes on the speedo not on other road users or predestrians.

 

[skotl]

Many London boroughs are proudly boasting that they are 20mph boroughs, thankfully most of the TFL red routes are still 30.
I have to say that I find it very hard to concentrate driving at 20MPH, I get board driving in just two gears and will admit to spending far too much time with my eyes on the speedo not on other road users or predestrians.

In Edinburgh, the plan is that some roads will be 30 and some 20, so you'll need to be checking for signs when turning into every road - very distracting, I'd think.

 

[gav0994]

My understanding is that many driving offences do not require corroboration by a second officer.
To return to the topic of speeding, in Edinburgh the camera vans are manned by a single person, and that person is a civilian employee of the police service - not even a police officer! - and they only need the photo evidence.

I can only speak from a practical point of having carried out Roads policing duties in Scotland, and we were always double crewed. This was within the last 6 years and the Law hasn't changed dramatically since then - ignoring the Cadder V crown case.

 

[wookie]

In Edinburgh, the plan is that some roads will be 30 and some 20, so you'll need to be checking for signs when turning into every road - very distracting, I'd think.

And whilst your busy looking for the speed change sign you'll end up running some kid over, counter-intuitive if you ask me. I think we need a lot of the signs were taken down, there are far too many, it's just information overload.

On a 40 mph road around here there is a pair of 40 signs that are about 50 foot from the change down to 30 zone, WHY ?

 

[Bill Edwards]

Speed can be a very emotive topic and with completely opposite opinions on what is or isn't correct, but how some of the speed limits are set is just beyond baffling.
I mean the 30 zones that should be 40 or 50, and the 40 zones which should be 30.
And single track country roads that should be 20 or 30 if they have straight sections.
And motorways that are 50. Motorways with roadworks that are inactive through the night and with 3 (almost empty) lanes open and proper barriers up to protect the non existent workforce, still a 50 limit.

 

[Bill Edwards]

Police respond to community complaints over speeding in 30 zones. It's not the Police that set the speed limits for areas, it's the councils and roads authorities. In Scotland they don't have the resources to sit all day doing people in 30 zones. Only lazy cops sit doing speeders all day. Most traffic cops go hunting for uninsured drivers; unsafe cars and drink drivers. For instance in my area they have 6 traffic cops on duty to cover the whole of Ayrshire including the M77 and after midnight there are none!

Well perhaps you're the force that mostly takes the job seriously.
But there's a hell of a lot (and I really do mean a lot) that are nowhere near dangerous spots and just try to catch as many as possible for being 2mph over the limit.

 

[ms08]

And whilst your busy looking for the speed change sign you'll end up running some kid over, counter-intuitive if you ask me. I think we need a lot of the signs were taken down, there are far too many, it's just information overload.

On a 40 mph road around here there is a pair of 40 signs that are about 50 foot from the change down to 30 zone, WHY ?

I would agree with that - there is far too much street signage about now - very distracting and impossible to take it all in.

 

[GW8IZR]

I would agree with that - there is far too much street signage about now - very distracting and impossible to take it all in.

Really, if you are going so fast you cant read the road signs.. you probably need to slow down.

 

[daleyd]

I don't think it's the speed he's going past the signs, rather the amount of unnecessary (and distracting) signs.

 

[GW8IZR]

I don't think it's the speed he's going past the signs, rather the amount of unnecessary (and distracting) signs.

If you ever try driving whilst giving a commentary, the first thing you notice is that the faster you go the more often you miss observations.

Everyone is a great driver and can drive fast until they get formal training .. then you realise that you first need to slow down to improve your standards.

 

[daleyd]

That might be the case (and is a different argument) but it doesn't alter the fact that there is (in a lot of cases) simply too much road clutter and bad road planning which is unnecessary and detracts from people's concentration on the act of driving.

As an example here there is a stretch of road that goes from a 30 to a 50 back to a 40 then back to 50 and then to a 30 in the space of about a mile.

 

[GW8IZR]

I don't know, its a subject that always creates polarised views and almost everyone thinks theirs is right. My view is worth _exactly_ the same as everyone else's, which is actually not much...

What I know as facts are that policemen don't hide in bushes itching to catch people driving 2mph over the limit. I know that reducing the speed limit on the M60 from 70mph to 50mph improved my 22 mile rush hour commute from 2 hours to just over 1 hour. I know that living very close to a ban on points isn't fun. I know that after being taught to safely drive very fast on public roads it was better to make a conscious decision to drive a bit slower...

Others can have different views without it upsetting me :-)

 

[daleyd]

With the speed thing I agree with you actually, a few years ago when they had average speed cameras in the roadworks on the m56 the traffic seemed to flow much better.

While I agree policemen don't tend to hide in bushes catching speeders, arrive alive vans seem to have taken over over that mantle with aplomb.

With reference to road clutter the government actually seem to be taking some action this.

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/ending-the-scourge-of-pointless-road-signs

 

[wookie]

I know that reducing the speed limit on the M60 from 70mph to 50mph improved my 22 mile rush hour commute from 2 hours to just over 1 hour.

Okay fair enough but make it a variable speed limit so that those of us that deliberately avoid rush hour can complete our journeys quicker.

I go down to London to visit my Aunty from time to time, I never leave before 7pm, usually get there around 11pm having had a nice relaxing drive on fairly quiet motorways, my dad (sadly no longer with us) preferred to drive in the daylight and used to spend an hour or two just getting past Birmingham, what a nightmare!

I know that living very close to a ban on points isn't fun. I know that after being taught to safely drive very fast on public roads it was better to make a conscious decision to drive a bit slower...

Well it does sound like you needed to slow down, I have been done for speeding a fair few times but only briefly had 6 points, normally just 3, and for the last 10 years it's been clean. The only change to my driving has been I'm more careful in the 30 zones not to go over the speed limit at all rather than sometimes going upto 32-33 in a 30 zone.

I am by no means a slow driver, it fact most people I know say I drive too fast but since they are the type of driver that is always up the **** of the person in front, always touching their brakes, only reacting to what is just in front of them rather than looking as far up the road as possible to anticipate hazards, driving in poor visibility without their lights on, etc etc in short a bad driver, I just ignore their opinion.

I was taught to be smooth and anticipate hazards, lift off the throttle and coast down to a lower speed limit rather than jumping on the brakes like so many drivers do, In fact when I did my motorbike test after many years of driving I failed the hazard awareness test just like a couple of driving instructors I know did because we were all clicking too early to indicate a hazard, how stupid is that ? The earlier you are aware of a hazard the more time you have to avoid it.

 

[GW8IZR]

Okay fair enough but make it a variable speed limit so that those of us that deliberately avoid rush hour can complete our journeys quicker.

It is a variable limit or 'smart' motorway that is being constructed..

Well it does sound like you needed to slow down, I have been done for speeding a fair few times but only briefly had 6 points,

It wasn't me close to the ban but I saw the direct effect, I did have a very big speeding ticket on the A9 which cost me a lump of money. That was in 1995 and had nothing since, whether that's by luck or judgement is open to interpretation.

I did a lot of work with road policing units and as a result saw the effects of collisions and the effects on the people cleaning up the aftermath. You know completing journeys quicker .. by speeding, doesn't save you a scrap of time in reality. Everyone likes to think they are so busy that the few minutes quicker makes a difference to their lives.. nah!

 

[Bill Edwards]

What I know as facts are that policemen don't hide in bushes itching to catch people driving 2mph over the limit.

While I agree policemen don't tend to hide in bushes catching speeders, arrive alive vans seem to have taken over over that mantle with aplomb.

Maybe not all of them but a lot do.
Not actually bushes quite so much these days but they're blending in on pushbikes and even tractors. Wagons too I believe.
I know an attentive driver who was clocked without ever seeing the police.

And why do so many people get caught at 32 just yards past the 30 sign after coming from a 50 or 60 zone? How is that not ambushing?


As to clutter on the roads I agree it's far too much. When watching my speed carefully I do feel that I spend more time monitoring my speedo and checking the signage than looking at the road properly. I mostly would feel far safer doing 20 more than the limit but focusing entirely on the road.
Also (particularly on long stretches with CC on) boredom becomes a serious issue. Better to blast along at 100 when conditions permit than to nod off at 70.

 

[ms08]

Really, if you are going so fast you cant read the road signs.. you probably need to slow down.

No, there is just too much unnecessary clutter.