Blown my welder up.

[Retired]

Hi,

Many thanks again Munkul & Hood for your continuing help and advice; I've just sent a PM to Ruffian asking for his advice?

At the moment being without gas I can't use the welder only switch it on and do setting adjustments.

Kind regards, Colin.

 

[Hood]

I have just looked at the manual and the diagram for 2T seems to suggest that Initial and End currents are not adjustable. Slopes however seem to be. See image, it seems to say that when you press the button you get the Pre Flow then arc ignition then it slopes to main current. When you release it slopes down and the arc extinguishes and then the post flow.

This is 4T which shows that start and end currents are available in addition to the slope and the tap function.

 

[Retired]

Hi,

Many thanks again Hood; you understand this welder a great deal more than I do but as each problem crops up I keep learning.

Ruffian has come to the rescue too with a very quick and most welcome reply to my PM to him; Thanks Ruffian; I'm indebted to you and very much appreciate your help. Ruffian has checked his welder and sure enough in 2T mode these two settings aren't available but in 4T they are so I'll play with the settings tomorrow; I can adjust the settings even though I've no gas connected; what a relief though because with my luck I thought I might be in for more problems; When I get the gas I'll try 4T which to my limited experience looks more useful than 2T as kindly mentioned a number of times by you Hood; I'm trying to hang back learning each stage rather than being too keen to become a TIG welder overnight.

Kind regards, Colin.

 

[Hood]

Some people prefer 2T but I prefer 4T on both Tig and Mig.
It will take a few goes before you get into the swing of it but it shouldn't be too bad

 

[Ruffian]

The 2t is nice is you extend the down slope as can catch it when dropping amperage and restart if needed.

But the 4t with the tap system works alot nicer in my opinion also, because when there is alot of heat in the item you can drop it down to a lower heat and let it chill for a few seconds. (Hood told me about this )

 

[slim_boy_fat]

@Retired If you go for the BOC volkszone offer [I think they call it something else now] there's a dedicated team at the Head Office, your local depot man may not be aware of it.

Do a search, there are threads with direct phone numbers to the team in previous threads/posts.

 

[Retired]

Hi,

Looks like you're the expert on 2T or 4T Hood; you've converted Ruffian to 4T and I too will now convert to 4T; I've very much appreciated your advice Hood and intended to try 4T but as a TIG novice I've had so much to play with and to absorb even on 2T so now I've gained a bit of experience it's time to experiment. I still don't know if it's me but on 2T I struggled a lot at bead end; if I ran to the end of the bead and let go of the button the tungsten appeared to be putting full amps out until the arc died; at first I tried lifting the torch clear but this resulted in a very very long arc doing no good at all to the tungsten; I quickly learned to let go of the torch button earlier before completing the bead allowing the tungsten then to cool before lifting clear.

Thanks slim for your suggestion; I've had a brief look at BOC but was rather overwhelmed unable to make sense of their website but I'll spend more time browsing BOC; I was taught on BOC kit as an apprentice and have always liked their products. Just buying gas has been problematic for me but simplest of things always go wrong. I'm not short of funds so right at the start I paid for a 30L cylinder through SGS only to end up in dispute having been charged over £28 VAT on the cylinder returnable deposit so after making a nuisance of myself by asking for the VAT refund I was called ridiculous; the unused 30L cylinder was returned in the usual pouring rain. I'm not a money lender. I then visited Innergy in Dewsbury who are Hobbyweld agents and the largest cylinder Hobbyweld supply to suit my gauges is the 20L Plus at £220 including cylinder returnable deposit this deposit being VAT free. Unfortunately Innergy don't stock the 20L so I came away with the low pressure 9L; when the cylinder was empty I returned it but I then came away with two 9L cylinders; back home one of the new full cylinders only had about 50 bar of gas in it so yet another visit to Dewsbury. Now a full 9L cylinder wasn't available; I left the part filled cylinder against a credit note; a few days later still in miserable weather I was back in Dewsbury to collect the full cylinder against the credit note.

This Tuesday in anticipation of running out of gas I decided to put this problem to bed once and for all; I phoned Innergy to ask them to please special order a 20L Plus cylinder for me; even phoning proved a problem; I had used the Dewsbury phone number but was speaking to a young lady in Leeds when I thought I was speaking directly to Innergy in Dewsbury; my order was taken and I'm awaiting the 20L cylinder to arrive in Dewsbury then I can pop over to return the two empty 9L cylinders and at last come away with a single 20L cylinder. Sorry if I'm repeating the story but I'm finding learning TIG welding to be interesting what I don't like is all the huge hassle involved; why couldn't I just buy the welder and gas and get on with it but then it would be too easy.

You said earlier Slim you'd like to take up TIG welding; I hope my constant moaning and problems haven't put you off; I'm just so frustrated and after all few novices to TIG welding will have their welder explode or suffer so much hassle just to buy gas. Go for it Slim you'll enjoy it.

I do like my Parweld and once again can praise both Parweld and The Wakefield Welding Center for their generous help and support; also all you members who have had the patience and kindness to hold my hand as I head down this rocky road; at times I confess I've felt so fed up with the whole issue of TIG welding I could have sold everything associated with it and never bothered with TIG again it being so highly frustrating; everyone's help and kindness though would have been ungraciously wasted should I quit so I'm still here and intend to remain so; one way or another I'm going to become reasonably proficient at TIG welding so bring on the problems and frustration because I'm surely getting used to them.

I won't do any more TIG welding until I have at least a 20L cylinder of pure argon in my welding trolley; I'm spending more time running around for gas than actually using it.

Kind regards, Colin.

An update. I tried contacting Innergy in Dewsbury earlier this morning but no answer so I hung up. I've just tried phoning Innergy again a few minutes ago on a different number posted as Innergy Dewsbury; after the young lady had kindly spent time looking around to see if the cylinder had arrived she was in Leeds looking at their cylinders? I'm informed they are short staffed this morning so if I phone Dewsbury and the limited staff are dealing with a customer the phone calls are transferred to nearest Innergy branch in this case Leeds. Incredible hassle just to get hold of a cylinder.

 

[minimutly]

Most motor factors are now agents for hobbygas/adams gas, they would have what you need?
As for tigging - it's non musical guitar playing, and I can't do that either, but I am learning...

 

[Retired]

Hi,

Thanks minimutly; here in Huddersfield when I search for Hobbyweld stockists I have limited choice nearby; Dewsbury the most convenient for travelling but terrible for contact. Dewsbury do not stock the 20L Plus cylinder so it's special order.

Adams gas I spoke to at Rufforth Auto Jumble but their nearest branch to us is Halifax.

The harder I try to buy gas the harder it gets; I've now emailed BOC asking what they can offer?

I can't get going at all in the workshop; our local post man is a great guy and very helpful; Bron has just given him a large tin of chocolates and a handmade Christmas card in case we miss him before Christmas. As a sideline he does gardening and DIY jobs; he's just asked me for a favour; he's involved in a problem across the street at a neighbour of ours; he and a chum have fitted a wall unit but the neighbour says it's the wrong way round? Could I pop over to give him a hand taking my drill along to help him out as a personal favour. So I'd end up in our neighbours home uninvited by them drilling their wall whilst they were out? SORRY NO. During our 32 years living here only one neighbour has ever taken a parcel in for us; I'm now learning to say No rather than YES; I like to help but enough is enough I can't get peace to wander into the workshop. Bron and I are so soft and helpful it's causing us problems. Retirement shouldn't be what I'm going through each day.

Kind regards, Colin.

 

[Hood]

Hi,

Looks like you're the expert on 2T or 4T Hood; you've converted Ruffian to 4T and I too will now convert to 4T;......

As I said Colin, 4T is what I personally prefer, especially on the Parweld with the tap feature, on the Stealth it is not quite as good as it does not have that feature, it does however leave my finger/thumb (whichever I am using depending on how I am holding the torch) free to use the Up/Down buttons if required, I must admit however I very rarely use them as I can manage without them for the most part. That is all down to a few years (more than I care to remember) Tig welding experience.

 

[slim_boy_fat]

You said earlier Slim you'd like to take up TIG welding; I hope my constant moaning and problems haven't put you off; I'm just so frustrated and after all few novices to TIG welding will have their welder explode or suffer so much hassle just to buy gas. Go for it Slim you'll enjoy it.

Thanks, I have all the stuff for TIG but lots of other bits of life keep getting in the way. One of these days I'll get a chance to settle down and have a go . I have a problem with close quarters depth perception so gauging tungsten position in relation to the weld pool can be tricky.

Re the BOC scheme, I pay just under a fiver each per month for my Y size argon & argoshield bottles, but they do last me for ages.

 

[Retired]

Hi,

Thanks Hood; I'll definitely be trying 4T once I obtain gas. My TIG welding can be counted in hours unlike your years and if things don't start to go my way it will remain hours too? I do use the up/down buttons on the torch but so far not during welding only using them to save me going to the welder to make current changes; it will come though as I gain more experience; I hope.

Thanks Slim; you're definitely up against it trying to learn TIG welding if you have a close up eye problem because arc length is critical (I'm an expert pool dipper having practiced). I've just spent a while browsing the BOC website but remain baffled. Argoshield is explained for MIG but not TIG? Argoshield Heavy (W) I think is £149.88 per year rental inc VAT; VAT is payable because this rental is non returnable. W size gas £69.18 per fill inc VAT but plus delivery? A W is a big cylinder and should last me ages without fear of constantly running out of gas but have I got the right gas and will the cylinder accept my Parweld gauges? I can easily live with £3 per week rental and the gas is a great deal cheaper than I've already paid; I've so far parted with £180 for Hobbyweld gas and if the Hobbyweld 20L cylinder arrives it will add another £110 for gas.

I see Wakefield Welding is a BOC agent?

I've just been into the workshop to check the welder settings; yes on 4T all options are available; I found (I) Slope up set at 2 as recommended starting point by Parweld but (L) Final current at 30% of main current; with hindsight I've set this whilst briefly trying pulse. 10% is a good initial setting for (L) so it has been too hot at button release.

Kind regards, Colin.

 

[slim_boy_fat]

Argoshield is explained for MIG but not TIG?

That's right, you need pure Argon for TIG. Iirc, BOC cylinders are filled with more gas than those of other suppliers, so win:win

Just phone their Head Office and ask to speak to the person(s) who handles the deal.

 

[Retired]

Hi,

Thanks Slim.

I've had more than enough frustration trying to buy gas. I've just sent a polite message to Innergy cancelling the 20L cylinder letting them know the frustration involved in buying from them in not stocking the cylinder as advertised then not having a clue whom I'm talking to or where? I further explained I was supplied a less than half full cylinder involving two more unwanted journey's to Dewsbury. I'm not against having to special order a cylinder but visits and phone calls don't appear to work.

Tomorrow morning I'll return both empty cylinders and collect the deposits but with my bad luck I'd better wait until tomorrow afternoon because no doubt they won't have enough cash to hand? I'll then start afresh and see where I get to with BOC. No gas so not a

Time now for me to chill before I end up exploding like my welder did.

Kind regards, Colin.

 

[Retired]

Hi,

If only I had known The Wakefield Welding Center supplied gas via BOC before all the endless frustration I've been suffering. I've just emailed Jim at the TWWC; Jim is a great guy and hugely helpful nothing too much trouble for him. I've asked what I need to do in order to collect gas from him in future; with Jim's friendly professional help I'm sure I'll soon have a smile on my face; I'm more than happy to buy from TWWC because of Jim's previous help where he went light years out of his way to help. Why do I always have to suffer before something goes right?

Any novice following this thread I suggest take up knitting it being a lot easier; I know because I used to work nights industrial knitting crimplene and jersey etc. Only joking guys but I can knit and weave.

Kind regards, Colin.

 

[Munkul]

For anything awkward like industrial gasses, it's definitely who you know, not what you know

Once you have a BOC account and a local depot with a "face" then things get very, very easy.

 

[Retired]

Hi,

Thanks Munkul; I think in general it's not what you know but who you know hence we've got so many idiots in power. I felt very tempted last night to open a BOC account but I'll wait for Jim's reply from The Wakefield Welding Center; with my luck I'd probably end up ordering laughing gas. I can't believe buying gas could prove so highly frustrating; I know I'm a novice but it's been bordering on bizzare. I've already done the supermarket shopping and later I'll return the empty cylinders to Innergy in Dewsbury for a deposit refund; that will be one problem sorted. It's no longer good enough to have cash in my pocket and know what I wish to buy; I've now got to jump through hoops too.

Hobbyweld have lots of agents and browsing the web the company looks pretty well organised. Hobbyweld next nearest agent to me is in Ossett; looking at their website contact is by phone only? No thanks I've tried using the phone only to be diverted so I didn't even consider trying to phone the company in Ossett because I'd probably be diverted to Chesterfield. I'll never buy from Hobbyweld again.

Kind regards, Colin.

 

[Retired]

Hi,

I'm now without gas or gas supplier having the welder but unable to weld.

Bron and I have just returned from Innergy in Dewsbury having returned both 9L Hobbyweld cylinders. I hope I've not been too harsh regarding both Innergy or Hobbyweld; everyone has been polite and pleasant with me and the Dewsbury Innergy depot is convenient to visit but the system lets them down; I had a good natter with Mick this morning at Innergy and Mick agrees it's not gone well for me and he understands my feelings and why I'm hoping to go with BOC in future. Surely Hobbyweld who clearly advertise their three sizes of Argon cylinders should make all three sizes available in all their depots? I've now given Hobbyweld and Innergy bad press which I never set out to do; novices who only want to have a go at TIG welding could well be happy to use the 9L cylinders but with these TIG welders costing so much to buy it doesn't make sense to me to then skimp on buying gas. I'd have happily remained a Hobbyweld customer if I could have been supplied the cylinder I wanted. Fingers crossed it will be third time lucky with BOC this time. I can now start over with gas.

Kind regards, Colin.

 

[Munkul]

make sure you get the volkzone forum discount! It's rather expensive at normal prices from BOC.

 

[Hood]

make sure you get the volkzone forum discount! It's rather expensive at normal prices from BOC.

That depends on use, if I use 2 cylinders of 33l 300bar a year then I am cheaper than using SGS 30l. I use a lot more than that so I m massively cheaper at BOC. If 30l per year or less then SGS would be cheaper.