They do seem a bit weak. Thought about trying the trick to remagnitize with a arc welder
- Thread starter Jonny
- Start date
the snooper
getting older by the day
- Messages
- 21,086
- Location
- Hull UK
another job for a multimeter test the voltage coming from the coilThey do seem a bit weak. Thought about trying the trick to remagnitize with a arc welder
rtcosic
Forum Supporter
- Messages
- 2,937
- Location
- Warwickshire
They came in other colours??
All pre 49 Sunbeam S7,s were black. In 49 the S7d came out. Near identicle but with a few differences and these were all mist green. My bike to confuse things is a S7d and should be green but back in the early 70's it was partly painted black so is now a mix of the two. I will one day paint it green, but I do not like over restored things so will then age the paint
On my 2 stroke bike if I new what make the mag was that would help as I normally just buy old replacement parts off eBay untill I get the right bit to make it work but this has no name on it and it's being hard to find one like it. I have seen people just stick old lawn mower bits in the mag an would be happy with this if I can't see the new bits. I am going to a bike auto jumble in Sept and will take my points along and see if I can Match them with some when I am there.
On my 2 stroke bike if I new what make the mag was that would help as I normally just buy old replacement parts off eBay untill I get the right bit to make it work but this has no name on it and it's being hard to find one like it. I have seen people just stick old lawn mower bits in the mag an would be happy with this if I can't see the new bits. I am going to a bike auto jumble in Sept and will take my points along and see if I can Match them with some when I am there.
Rig Pig
Member
- Messages
- 3,741
- Location
- Narrwich! U.K.
Not familiar with that trick, I'm keeping an eye open for a magnet charger to sort out the Lucas sr1on my Howard.They do seem a bit weak. Thought about trying the trick to remagnitize with a arc welder
ronan
Member
- Messages
- 11,382
Jonny, do you have " The vintage motorcyclists workshop" by Radco ? On page 184 there is a piece on the lucas flywheel magnetos and on page 190 a similar artical on villiers flywheel magnetos. They would appear to be similar setups to what you have on this little machine.
What a lovely little bike, such classic lines. That looks like the pre 1940 197 Super sports engine, which would fit with the racing past, I beleive you could buy the motor seperatly to upgrade your standard Villiers engined machine to 'sports' specification for racing etc. purposes, although Monet Goyon seem to have made some sports models with hotter motors.
It sounds to me like the magneto is not generating current, age may have taken it's toll on the magnets as suggested previously, it's a pretty simple system so must be a question of isolating the issue (s). As you say, not so easier with older bikes where everything is over 70 years old :-9
I found these folks helpful when I worked on a Greeves 250: http://www.villiersparts.co.uk
It sounds to me like the magneto is not generating current, age may have taken it's toll on the magnets as suggested previously, it's a pretty simple system so must be a question of isolating the issue (s). As you say, not so easier with older bikes where everything is over 70 years old :-9
I found these folks helpful when I worked on a Greeves 250: http://www.villiersparts.co.uk
I did look at the Villiers Supersport engines when I got it. They are all though different to mine. Mine is a twin port barrel and head all as one piece. It has screw on exhaust fittings cast as part of the barrel unlike the Villiers push on ones. It is fitted with a very nice Amec bronze carb. Unless this is a French one its not quite the same. There is no name anyplace on the engine only some worn numbers/letters. When I got the bike the last owner said he was told it was a Villiers 250R engine from the person who he had bought it from. I can find nothing on a Villiers 250R engine on the net and to me it looks smaller than a 250 but it does have a long barrel so I may be wrong. When I got the bike it had no paperwork or no lights and number plates. I just quickly added these to aid me in getting it registered as they seem to go a bit easyer if the bike looks at least road worthy. I was given a very old UK tax disc with the bike and it seemed be for a MG with the reg shown on my bike so this helped. After inquires with the French MG site I found out it was a 1932 S17 frame, forks and the tank was off something else. The engine though was not one they could ID from the photos and they had not seen one like it in a MG before? It though came with with some paperwork saying it had been raced in France and in the UK. It did have some very odd things on. The footpegs are behind the seat a bit like rear sets. You have to be like a horse race jockey with your legs right up It very hard to sit on. On top of this the rear brake pedal was behind the foot pegs. There was no way I could work it with my heal as it seemed impossible so I have now moved it in front of foot peg, still hard but I may have a chance with it now It also had a short hand change gear leaver as well as a rocker type foot operated leaver. I was told this was to aid with push starting, there was no kick start. It was stuck in gear when I got it and I needed to get into gear box so have removed the foot change as was welded on the gear change shaft so I could get in gear box. I can now with a bit of work fit a kick start as I am sure with this riding position there will be quite a lot of me stalling it and don't really want to be push starting it every time
It very hard to sit on. On top of this the rear brake pedal was behind the foot pegs. There was no way I could work it with my heal as it seemed impossible so I have now moved it in front of foot peg, still hard but I may have a chance with it now It also had a short hand change gear leaver as well as a rocker type foot operated leaver. I was told this was to aid with push starting, there was no kick start. It was stuck in gear when I got it and I needed to get into gear box so have removed the foot change as was welded on the gear change shaft so I could get in gear box. I can now with a bit of work fit a kick start as I am sure with this riding position there will be quite a lot of me stalling it and don't really want to be push starting it every time 
pedrobedro
Man at Matalan
- Messages
- 13,090
- Location
- CX near Chesterfield
Weren't they all vomit green ? A friend of ours had a Sunbeam with a little Watsonian sidecar like a Bambini. I think his was the S8 but they all look alike to me with the balloon tyres and the little shock at the back.
pedrobedro
Man at Matalan
- Messages
- 13,090
- Location
- CX near Chesterfield
Must have been The S7 then as it was definitely green with big tyres. He sold it and the bloke who bought was going to use it for everyday transport, rather him than me. I've been round the shop today and there's another Ariel square four in for about £16,000.
ronan
Member
- Messages
- 11,382
I cannot get over the prices some "classic" bikes are making now. Bsa M20's going for thousands, when i remember you could pick them up for the price of a few pints. Years ago when the irish army was getting rid of their bsa sidevalves they loaded them into open topped sand lorries and brought them to the furnace in irish steel in cork, because no one else wanted them.
Likewise with the £16,000 ariel square four, i remember seeing a good one going for about 5k and thinking the seller had had a bang on the head.
Likewise with the £16,000 ariel square four, i remember seeing a good one going for about 5k and thinking the seller had had a bang on the head.
Hi Guys, Been a week or so and have now had a good tinker. Sadly still not running 
I came across a trick on the web that by using a electric drill to spin the engine for 5 mins without the plug in this would basicly put any charge produced back into the flywheel magnets. Anyway did this untill my electric drill was smoking hot and almost burnt out and after some other very fine adjustment did manage to get the smallest of sparks at the plug. It is though weak and can only jump a gap of around 1mm but at least I got something The spark is the same at the point the plug lead connects to the magneto and at the end of the plug lead so I do not think any of those parts are the problem. I do know that under compression a week spark will probably not happen and this is probably why engine not firing up. Would this point to it being the magnets or the condenser at fault? and not the coil. I have taken some photos and maybe someone can ID the make of mag I have as that would help.
Also it has two other coils in, I think they must be for the lighting and at this time are unused as the bike had no lights on when I got it. There are two connecting tangs on the back of the stator plate that come from these coils. A bit different from my other flywheel mag bikes as they only have one point to connect lights to, any ideas why there may be two. Also I have looked into connecting a batter and coil but also came across that you could use the low tension part of your original coil to supply to a new canister type coil and this would save the need for a battery. I guess for this you need to have good flywheel magnets ? I was wondering if I could use one of the connections from one of the lighting coils to supply the canister coil and then back to the points? What do you think? I am finding it hard to find anyone around my area who can re-magnitise my flywheel, have tried a few garden machinery places and phoned a fair few mag repair shops but non so far have said they can do this hopefully quite simple job for me
Jon
I came across a trick on the web that by using a electric drill to spin the engine for 5 mins without the plug in this would basicly put any charge produced back into the flywheel magnets. Anyway did this untill my electric drill was smoking hot and almost burnt out and after some other very fine adjustment did manage to get the smallest of sparks at the plug. It is though weak and can only jump a gap of around 1mm but at least I got something The spark is the same at the point the plug lead connects to the magneto and at the end of the plug lead so I do not think any of those parts are the problem. I do know that under compression a week spark will probably not happen and this is probably why engine not firing up. Would this point to it being the magnets or the condenser at fault? and not the coil. I have taken some photos and maybe someone can ID the make of mag I have as that would help.Also it has two other coils in, I think they must be for the lighting and at this time are unused as the bike had no lights on when I got it. There are two connecting tangs on the back of the stator plate that come from these coils. A bit different from my other flywheel mag bikes as they only have one point to connect lights to, any ideas why there may be two. Also I have looked into connecting a batter and coil but also came across that you could use the low tension part of your original coil to supply to a new canister type coil and this would save the need for a battery. I guess for this you need to have good flywheel magnets ? I was wondering if I could use one of the connections from one of the lighting coils to supply the canister coil and then back to the points? What do you think? I am finding it hard to find anyone around my area who can re-magnitise my flywheel, have tried a few garden machinery places and phoned a fair few mag repair shops but non so far have said they can do this hopefully quite simple job for me
Jon
It looks like a villiers flywheel magneto haave alook at the drawing on this page
http://www.historywebsite.co.uk/Museum/Engineering/Villiers/Villiers3.htm
http://www.historywebsite.co.uk/Museum/Engineering/Villiers/Villiers3.htm
Hi, It does look a bit like a Villiers one though I was unable to find one under Villiers on the net quite the same as mine so I have in the past contacted Villiers Services. They say they do not know what it is or even what the engine is as they to also do not think its a Villiers unit
