Advice from the experts about threaded rod please

[DanielW]

Here's the difference.

That link charges £14.50 for 3.5mt of 25x25x2mm plus £12 for delivery.

I paid locally £15 for 4mt length.

 

[Wallace]

If you buy one at least you can sell it on relatively easily when the job is finished, not so easy with homemade equipment.

 

[Flapdisk]

That wasn't for box section Daniel, I was thinking about how do I get the slot all the way up the middle for the lifting blade and decided the easiest way was to weld two bits of angle iron to a flat backplate and by leaving them 5mm apart at the front I would get the slot along the full length, so it was for two lengths of angle 40 x 25 x 2000 and one length of 50 x 3 x 2000 flat and a small sheet of 4mm to make the ends and lifting blade

It's what appears to have been done here and can be clearly seen
http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j114/Wedgehog/brwithlifting.jpg

 

[DanielW]

If it was me I'd make a hangmans gantry and a lift hoist...be cheaper that way because you already have the roll bar and its just a case of getting the tilt on the car.

 

[Wallace]

It's what appears to have been done here and can be clearly seen
http://i78.photobucket.com/albums/j114/Wedgehog/brwithlifting.jpg

Looks like the wheel bracket in that photo has been fitted upside down, the wheel will try turning under load.

 

[Flapdisk]

I agree and hadn't noticed that, well spotted Wall. if they are lifting it will be twisting and putting a lot of stress on the lifting blade and connection assembly, the connection assembly looks very elaborate but I guess it has to be adjustable to fit any car.

 

[Flapdisk]

If it was me I'd make a hangmans gantry and a lift hoist...be cheaper that way because you already have the roll bar and its just a case of getting the tilt on the car.

I haven't got a lot of room in my workshop Daniel to do that it would have to straddle the car so it would need to be wide and high, expensive!

 

[Wallace]

I agree and hadn't noticed that, well spotted Wall. if they are lifting it will be twisting and putting a lot of stress on the lifting blade and connection assembly, the connection assembly looks very elaborate but I guess it has to be adjustable to fit any car.

As you say, the brackets need to be adjustable to fit any car hence all the add ons I have made for mine are not vehicle specific. The chassis dolly is currently shortened down and in use as an engine and gearbox stand. Have you thought about using your farm jack in place of the screw thread and electric motor?

 

[Flapdisk]

Hi Wall, the farm jack is what's in use now and is a pain in the **** because it isn't tall enough and you have to keep propping the car so you can take it out and put it on blocks to get another lift.

 

[Wallace]

Make a copy of the CJ Autos lifting device but replace the upright with a 2.5m length of 40mm x 40mm x 3mm box section with 10mm holes drilled straight through every 100mm.

Cut two 180mm lengths of 50mm x 50mm x 3mm box section that slide over the outside of the 40mm x 40mm box section.

Fix the bottom of the jack to the side of one 180mm box section.

Fix the lifting section of the jack to one side of the other 180mm box section and the opposite side to a bracket on the wheel.

Use a 10mm steel pin under the lower 180mm box section to lift the car as high as the jack will go then insert another 10mm pin in the nearest hole under the top 180mm box section and lower the car onto this.

Release the jack and take the lower 180mm box section up and replace the pin to lift again.

Once up to the desired height insert a 10mm pin under the top 180mm box section and lower the jack and release so the pin is supporting the weight.

Should go in two lifts with that jack length.

Does that make sense?

 

[Flapdisk]

It does Wall and I think Rig Pig already suggested that in post 9 on page one I think I have pretty much given in to the idea of buying one. I emailed CJ Auto's and said I was interested and what was the motor on the top, is it a 12 volt winch, if so is it safe to have the car just hanging on a wire?
With a bit of luck they will reply tomorrow and we will know if the motorised one is a winch or not. I reckon it is as the cloce up I posted of it showing the welds shows the manufactured box section not being big enough for much else but a cable and a slide.
I will probably still buy it as the more I think about the work involved in making it the less enthusiastic I feel

 

[Wallace]

For me the building of the tools to do the job is often more enjoyable than the job itself. The ones I have seen operated by a cordless drill had a screw thread. With my Autovip the ballache is jacking the car up to fit it as the car is best lifted on the axle centreline so it has to go up to height and be placed on stands then lowered. Having done it 3 times in a day due to the space I am working in is why I would look at a spit roller for the next job as that will be just a shell, this car only has the engine, gearbox and bonnet removed and is still very heavy as it is around 1850kg kerbside weight.

 

[Flapdisk]

Ok, sorry for the delay, I contacted them and the minute I did they removed the item from their web page and said they are no longer selling it as the one they supply is not man enough to roll a complete car and that they will be making a more heavy duty one at some point. To be honest I think they just want to push their new hydraulic side jacks, but I am not paying those sort of prices just for DIY.

So, I have no choice but to make one. I gave it a lot of thought, It doesn't have to be pretty as it's not going to be marketed, it just needs to be strong. I thought about all the advice you guys gave in this thread and incorporated some of them.
I purchased a 2 ton electric winch and all the steel I need to build it. I have a 50mm box section 2 meters long which will have a short piece of box section which slides down over it, this will have a couple of 4mm steel plates welded to either side of it and a 20mm pin through them which will connect to the bracket device which bolts on the hub. and the winch cable will be hooked to it so as the winch operates the short length of box section slides up or down the long one taking the car with it.
For safety I will drill holes through the 2mtr length so as the short bit is winched up I can put a long bolt through so should the cable break, it can't collapse and as it winches slowly up or down I will have two pins, then I can move the pins in a leap frog manner so there is always one in position and the system can never fall more than the distance between two pins.
I started building it today, and tomorrow I will take pictures for you, I know you all like build pictures, as do I, If you see anything you feel could have been done safer please speak out. I don't mean if you would just do it different, as there are many ways to skin a cat, and everyone will say "Oh I would have done this or that way" I really don't mind criticism providing it's not just for the sake of it.

If you are wondering, the apparently too light duty one they were selling was the best part of £400 I have bought the materials for this for well under half that.
We discussed the wheels in the thread, in the end I found the cheapest way to get a pair which could carry the load was to get a set of replacement spare part wheels for a trolley jack! and got them for a tenner better than half the stupid Fleabay prices. Axle is a 19mm stainless steel rod and fits the wheel perfectly.

Pictures Tomorrow.

 

[Flapdisk]

Ok then here we go, first of all here is the 2 meter box section that will be the main body of the lift, alongside it taped to the wood is some flat stock I ordered which will be used for the connection to the roller at the bottom later on.

As I explained above the winch will be bolted to a 4mm plate welded to the top of the box section, I have cut it to size and drilled the holes to mount the winch.

Now comes the short length of box section which will slide over the long one and be pulled up and down by the winch, I have cut out the plates and drilled them ready to be welded on either side

Now the bit of unequal Angle Iron which I have drilled the holes in and started to cut in two for the Hub Bracket

I then clamped it all together to check out how it will all connect to the car and the winch

Then I attached them to the car and made one of the fill in spacers

Then I took them off and cleaned them up a bit ready for welding

Then I cleaned up the short box section and the side plates ready for welding

Then welded the first one on just before packing up at 8pm.

Yes I laid the weld on good and thick, I want lot's of strength here and enough weld to dress it to a nice bevel. looks like it's sat on top due to the amount I laid, but I checked the underneath and it's difficult to see inside the box, but it looks like good penetration, I had the Arc Welder on max amps (140) It's only a small one about as old as me with a 2.5mm rod.
I didn't use my new Mig as I have never welded metal of 3 and 4mm with that and felt more comfortable with the old stick. Would the mig weld 4mm ok I have the GYS Smartmig 162?
Oh! one last pic just of a few bits on the bench

Ok that's it for now, hopefully I will get a bit more done tomorrow.
Bob

 

[Wallace]

I was thinking about this yesterday as I took the car off the roller and wondered what you had decided to do. I find the jacking to fit the jig such a ballache with mine or swapping sides as it fits all four wheels.

What size pins are you going to use for the leap frog?

Oh, I like the comment "Then I took them off and cleaned them up a bit ready for welding", which should read; "polished them ready for chrome plating"!

 

[Flapdisk]

I was thinking about this yesterday as I took the car off the roller and wondered what you had decided to do. I find the jacking to fit the jig such a ballache with mine or swapping sides as it fits all four wheels.

What size pins are you going to use for the leap frog?

Oh, I like the comment "Then I took them off and cleaned them up a bit ready for welding", which should read; "polished them ready for chrome plating"!

Noooooo! I'm not going to those lengths I have some red enamel left from doing my mower, I got it from the stationary engine company, thattle do it
Hey Wall, what is the Black on the black steel? do they dunk it in old oil? It takes some getting off and has quite a hard surface.

I know, the jacking is a pain isn't it. The only way I can roll my car in my workshop is to first jack it up and put dollies under all the wheels so I can push it sideways into a space with only two feet clearance front and back, than I have to jack it again to take the dollies out and fit the roller. These days when I get on the bloody floor to locate the jack I can't get up again

Well I have some half inch thick high tensile bolts which are about 6 inches long, I thought I would use a couple of those, they are thicker than the pins in the winches pulleys.

 

[Wallace]

Part of my jacking problem is down to the car itself as the best two places to lift the car are the axle centres, right where the roller goes and since painting stone chip on the floor and chassis even placing axle stands is a pain.

The black on the steel is mill scale from the hot rolling process.

1/2" HT bolts will give you quite a substantial safety factor, I doubt you would bend one if the car fell the all the way down onto it! All the weight bearing pins holding my Autovip together are 10mm, the maximum weight capacity of the frame is 1700kg and that load is spread across four 10mm pins.

 

[Flapdisk]

Thanks Wall. I know exactly what you mean, I have finished all the underneath and it is now all been epoxied and gravitexed, I don't want to put a jack on it either, makes me angry when you go for tyre and they wack a jack straight under the edge of your sills with no regard for you paintwork at all.
I was looking just now, over a thousand have looked at this thread and only 50 replies! I would have thought the kind of guys on here would have been interested in something mechanical being made.
Well I thank you for your interest Wall or I would be talking to myself. Must have been something I said
I was reading the manual on my new Mig last night, it has more amps than the stick welder and the Hub bracket is 8mm steel so I think I will fit a reel of 0.8 wire to it today switch everything to max and have a go Result pictures later.
Bob

 

[DanielW]

Are you saying that the box section nearest the two files slots over the main lift post? and is used to pull up the car, you will add extra weight (traction,kinetic friction if you like)to the lift by doing it this way without some sort of bearing motion it will increase the lifting strain of the pully motor.

 

[Flapdisk]

Hi Daniel, doesn't matter mate, the vertical box section won't have much friction as it's nearly vertical and the short bit you see on the bench wouldn't create that much, On the one that was available for purchase the box ran up and down the inside and that worked fine. Anyway the car is on the floor on one side so you are only lifting about half it's weight, 1 Ton and it's a 2 Ton winch.