New to TIG - Looking for practice advice

[BoogerGrinder]

Hi All,
I recently purchased a Cigweld 205 Weldskill AC/DC machine with the view to get into TIG welding as a hobby.
I have spent a few hours (in small blocks as time permits) practicing on on various scraps of mild, stainless and aluminium.
I have got to a point where I think I can run a reasonable dry bead and produce an Ok start puddle, but as soon as I try to run a bead it just looks cooked. I have played with settings and set ups, but always end up with the same result. I suspect my electrode height is getting a little loose without me realising. I also find it tricky to see exactly what my height is like, maybe I need glasses...... Maybe I am just too slow once i need to start adding filler.
My questions are:
- Am I best to stick to one metal type for practice, if so what what do you recommend?
- How clearly should I be able to see the tip of my electrode and judge its height?
- Do you have recommendations for practice drills?

Thanks in advance for any help.

Cheers,

 

[Misterg]

How clearly should I be able to see the tip of my electrode and judge its height?

Extremely clearly. Pin sharp. It's essential. If you use reading glasses, wear them under your mask (or get a 'cheater' lens).

Have you seen the TIG tutorial on this forum (in the green banner at the top of the page)?

Get the hang of it on one material (mild steel is cheapest / most forgiving (IMHO) ).

And welcome.

 

[BoogerGrinder]

Extremely clearly. Pin sharp. It's essential. If you use reading glasses, wear them under your mask (or get a 'cheater' lens).

Have you seen the TIG tutorial on this forum (in the green banner at the top of the page)?

Get the hang of it on one material (mild steel is cheapest / most forgiving (IMHO) ).

And welcome.

Thanks, I had seen the TIG tutorial and made good use of it to get myself started. I was unsure just how clearly you should be able to see the electrode. I don't use glasses for anything else, but I can never really clearly see how close the tip is to the material I am welding. I have tried playing with different shades on my helmet incase it was too dark/bright. Maybe a cheater lens is the next thing to try.

 

[Popcorn]

Have a look at this one as well

Thread 'Aluminium tig guide getting started.'

Jun 13, 2016

As has been requested by a small number of members I'm happy to start a small guide as a starting point for newcomers into welding aluminium. The idea is to simply give you a starting point so your new toy can be taken from the box and dialed in without the grief of guess work or diving through countless threads with lots of compromising opinions and info.

There are literally thousands of combinations as to what can be done to weld it I'm just going to talk about the meer basics and after that it's up to you.

I'll do it over time and generate a few posts and get some pics in it to help...

• Richard.
• Replies: 278
• forum: TIG Welding

• 

 

[BrokenBiker]

stick to mild steel for initial practice, it is much easier to control than other materials. doesnt run away like ally does and doesnt need as much gas as stainless...plus its cheap.

you should be able to see the electrode, the arc, the motlen puddle and atleast a small area infront of your travel direction. if you can see the weld you have already done as you go as well thats good as you can see any issues and try and correct them.

as for drills, when i started in january i followed something i saw on youtbe on the TFS channel as follows.

get a bit of say 50x100mm steel, say 3-5mm thick.

just practice lighting up in 1 spot, let the puddle grow to 5-6mm then shut off. thats a simple tack. fill the plate up with those, overlap and whatever you feel you need to do but focus on consistency. then, once you are happy, you can practice lighting up and traveling. concentrate on consistency again, width of the bead should be the same all the way, your arc length should be the same all the way etc. once you have filled bith sides of the plate doing that, grab some filler and repeat that exercise, but as you are travelling (at exactly the same speed as before) just tap the filler into the fron tendge of the puddle, literally just tap the end of the rod into the puddle in a controlled manner, count along if you need to to keep decent timing with it and again, just focus on consistency. once you are happy that you are adding filler without stabbing the tungsten into the weld, of the filler into the tungsten, you can then focus on different travel speeds, joints and what not...get the welds looking how you want. when i started, my welds all just looked like mig welds as i was travelling too slow and not adding enough filler so everything was just merging into 1 slug...now i travel a bit faster, have my amps slightly higher and add more filler and im starting to get to typical TIG weld people want

i really like this as a quick and easy practice set up before doing anything that needs to be reasonably good. 4 bits of plate, set as follows and you get 2 butt joints, 2 lap joints, 2 inside fillets and as many straight beads as you want.

so, tack 2 plates along the long edge, i tend to turn it over to weld out so i still have a flat face for the next step, but you could weld both and grind 1 flat if needed

then weld out (you can see i either got too hot towards the end, or wasnt adding as much rod as the first part, probably because i wasnt as comfortbale as i should have been)

tack the remaining 2 plates to look something like this

then weld out the 4 joints you have given yourself

granted, im nowhere near an expert, or even that good yet, but i find these exercises give you a good reference for progess, if you keep the first one you did you can always look back to compare it to how you are doing now.

i used the above one to practice keeping the weld bead away from the edge on the lap welds as i had a little piece to weld that needed the corner to still be visible as it located on something.

im sure i saw this piece on here, but have also seen it on a few vieos from variosu people on youtube too

 

[Misterg]

I don't use glasses for anything else

Do you have to hold stuff at arms length to read it? Or need to find 'good light' to see small details? If so, you likely need reading glasses.

 

[tom2207]

Do you have to hold stuff at arms length to read it? Or need to find 'good light' to see small details? If so, you likely need reading glasses.

as a guide put something like a warranty form , or a phone book , if you remember them down ,,, and put your head where your mask is and see if you can read the small print , if you cant read it , change something until you can ,,, if you cant see it you cant tig it ,,, you can get away with a lot less detail with mig as its just more forgiving , arc length and tungsten position is where you need detail to be visible. A lot of the videos from weld tips etc have amazing arc shots the size of a computer screen ,,, its just not like that in real life .

 

[BoogerGrinder]

@BrokenBiker thanks for those tips, I have been doing similar to what you first described, but have reached frustration when starting to try to lay beads with filler.
@Misterg yeah I don't like to admit it, but a do need to read at arms length with finer print or seek out better light.
@tom2207 this is a good description thanks, I never have an issue seeing what I am doing when stick welding and I think this has lead to some of my confusion about what I need to be seeing when Tig welding. I have watched a lot of Tig welding youtube and I think this has added to my confusion.

 

[BrokenBiker]

@BrokenBiker thanks for those tips, I have been doing similar to what you first described, but have reached frustration when starting to try to lay beads with filler.
@Misterg yeah I don't like to admit it, but a do need to read at arms length with finer print or seek out better light.
@tom2207 this is a good description thanks, I never have an issue seeing what I am doing when stick welding and I think this has lead to some of my confusion about what I need to be seeing when Tig welding. I have watched a lot of Tig welding youtube and I think this has added to my confusion.

Get a cheater lenses, they dint fit all masks but can be made to fit one way or another...yiu can get them in varying levels of magnification, you may find it helps a lot

 

[tom2207]

Get a cheater lenses, they dint fit all masks but can be made to fit one way or another...yiu can get them in varying levels of magnification, you may find it helps a lot

even a cheap pair of +1 oe +1.25 will get you going , if it helps then go to a decent independent opticians and get them to make to a task specific pair of glasses ,,, eplain to them exactly what you want and they will make you something ,,, if you like them get the replacement pair made with glass lenses , a bit more expensive but they will last a lot longer . i was an opticians tech in a former life too ,,, lol , another of my odd jobs

 

[Misterg]

I don't like to admit it, but a do need to read at arms length with finer print or seek out better light.

I use +1.25 glasses for reading, but can just about get by without ('good light', long arms, etc...).

I also wear them for MIG, but with TIG, rightly or wrongly, I end up with my head closer to the work and need to 'double up' with the readers and a +1.25 cheater lens in the mask to be able to see the arc properly.

I would get down to whatever your equivalent of Poundland* is and pick up 2 or 3 pairs of cheap reading glasses spanning +1.25 to +2 prescription to see if any of them helps - you can always get an equivalent cheater lens if they do. (Might be worth getting an eye test sometime, too.)

*Dollars and Sense ??

 

[addjunkie]

even a cheap pair of +1 oe +1.25 will get you going , if it helps then go to a decent independent opticians and get them to make to a task specific pair of glasses ,,, eplain to them exactly what you want and they will make you something ,,, if you like them get the replacement pair made with glass lenses , a bit more expensive but they will last a lot longer . i was an opticians tech in a former life too ,,, lol , another of my odd jobs

This….I have 3 pairs of glasses now, slightly different scripts for different things…pain in the but but seeing detail is very useful.

 

[tom2207]

when I was working as a tech , I just turned old frames into work glasses ,,, from +0.50 right up to +4.50 or what ever I had laying about ,, its mighty handy to be able to pick up what you fancy , you soon get to the point that you wont put up with anything less than crystal clear vision for the task ,,, my old daily wear at work was .+3.25 but big screws in the tech world then were 1.4mm and frames at 500 quid a pair you needed to see what was going on.

 

[northwest]

Get a cheater lenses, they dint fit all masks but can be made to fit one way or another...yiu can get them in varying levels of magnification, you may find it helps a lot

Don't get a ridiculously powerful lens either, you will find 1x or 1.5x is more than enough, anything stronger and in real life you wouldn't be able to see.

 

[tom2207]

Don't get a ridiculously powerful lens either, you will find 1x or 1.5x is more than enough, anything stronger and in real life you wouldn't be able to see.

what happens is that the distance gets less as the magnification gets larger ,, you very quickly end up needing to be six inches from the workpiece ,,,

 

[BrokenBiker]

another thing that could help us identify any issues is if you pop a pic up of some of your weld attempts. we can do a lot more when we can see what is going on and some here may be able to spot a technique or settings issue from a pic of the welds. helped me out hugely when i was starting with all 3 processes

 

[BoogerGrinder]

Here are some recent welds on 1.7 mm stainless. 1.6 mm tungsten and filler. 2 secs pre flow, 8 secs post flow and number 8 cup with diffuser (no lens). 15 l/s argon
Two dry welds circled in yellow.
A couple of welds circled in blue with not enough heat, 40 amps.
The rest are a bunch of start practices or running beads at 50 amps, which to my limited experience seem cooked.

 

[Misterg]

Here are some recent welds on 1.7 mm stainless. 1.6 mm tungsten and filler. 2 secs pre flow, 8 secs post flow and number 8 cup with diffuser (no lens). 15 l/s argon

15 L/s ? Do you mean 15 L/min? (Not being pedantic - it may be relevant..)

If that's stainless, I think one of two things might be happening:

1) Poor gas coverage - Assuming you're holding the torch at roughly the right angle, with stick-out less than ~1/2 the cup opening: If the gas flow is too high, you get turbulent flow that pulls air into the gas shield (especially with a plain cup rather than a gas lens). The rule of thumb I picked up is gas flow in L/min should be ~~ cup number. On that basis (and assuming L/s is a typo) your gas flow may be double what it should be. Try with ~8 L/min. (I presume you're holding the torch in position until the post flow finishes, too, and that your welding indoors in an area free from draughts.)

2) With thin stainless, you can get oxidation on the back surface that contaminates the weld pool and gives a dirty weld. Do you get the same thing with thicker material? Alternatively, without going to the trouble of back surface purging / shielding, you can try the same thing with the sheet clamped to a block of copper (or aluminium) behind the weld area.

 

[BrokenBiker]

Get some thicker practice material, preferably mild steel...

A number 8 cup wants 8-10lpm gas so 15 is potentially going to give you issues with turbulence and it wll waste gas.

I say mild steel for a few reasons...1 its cheaper than stainless or ally, 2 you can drop a few cup sizes and then drop your flow rate and post flow time and 3 there are less variables...you aren't worried about cooking it, the puddle is more consistent and stays roughly the same width even when the metal is hot and the filler is cheaper...

As for the cooked welds, you can have a few separate issues or a mix of a few with that, but if you are running at the bare minimum amps for that thickness your travel speed will suffer and that will cook a part...turn the amps up and travel faster is my method but you need to get some thicker materials and nail the basics first like set up and arc length. Stainless can be tricky at the best of times, I can lay a respectable bead on mild steel then cook stainless onnthe very next weld...steel will follow the 40amps per mm rule, stainless wants less because of its poor thermal conductivity and the hotter the part gets the harder it gets to weld...and it distorts for fun too

 

[BoogerGrinder]

15 L/s ? Do you mean 15 L/min? (Not being pedantic - it may be relevant..)

If that's stainless, I think one of two things might be happening:

1) Poor gas coverage - Assuming you're holding the torch at roughly the right angle, with stick-out less than ~1/2 the cup opening: If the gas flow is too high, you get turbulent flow that pulls air into the gas shield (especially with a plain cup rather than a gas lens). The rule of thumb I picked up is gas flow in L/min should be ~~ cup number. On that basis (and assuming L/s is a typo) your gas flow may be double what it should be. Try with ~8 L/min. (I presume you're holding the torch in position until the post flow finishes, too, and that your welding indoors in an area free from draughts.)

2) With thin stainless, you can get oxidation on the back surface that contaminates the weld pool and gives a dirty weld. Do you get the same thing with thicker material? Alternatively, without going to the trouble of back surface purging / shielding, you can try the same thing with the sheet clamped to a block of copper (or aluminium) behind the weld area.

Thanks, you are correct, I meant 15 L/min. I hadn't realised the turbulent flow could have such a significant effect. I will try reducing the flow rate. I also wasn't aware that oxidation on the back side could contaminate the weld pool on thinner material, but that makes a lot of sense. On the basis of what you and others have said I will switch to some thicker mild steel for practicing. As well as getting myself a pair of specs.