Serious question about copper vs plastic pipe for plumbing.

[gaz1]

What does 22 years in the trade make me? Far from a youngster but I'm not stuck in the past

it puts you in the mix of being a hybrid between them

so hybrid trader you are

when you get to 30+ years then id say getting to be an old timer

plastic was just coming in but i was doing copper at that time and still am doing though the plastic pipes have changed enough

but heat and brittle failures mared the plastic system for years it was only suggested to use them on cold systems only

 

[mike os]

Only issue I ever see with plastic fittings is when they are incorrectly installed... missing liners, not inserted correctly, mixes systems or pressure on the joint.... other issue is the end isn't cut clean so it has crap in the o ring or damages it

 

[Kayos]

it puts you in the mix of being a hybrid between them

so hybrid trader you are

when you get to 30+ years then id say getting to be an old timer

plastic was just coming in but i was doing copper at that time and still am doing though the plastic pipes have changed enough

but heat and brittle failures mared the plastic system for years it was only suggested to use them on cold systems only

Off the tools for 2 years, best move I ever made

 

[KemppiFrog]

Sounds like a misremembered story

In the 70s there was a copper shortage, thin wall copper with a red stripe was produced to save copper, however as it was under 0.9mm wall thickness it couldn't be used for gas. Always gutting to rip a load of red stripe out, only about 2/3 the weight of normal copper

Don't think so; stuff was from Belgium ansd sold in Portugal. Mind you, most plumbers were still using threaded iron for water. 20 yrs if you were lucky.

 

[Beeezer]

be sure to really really rodent proof your abode.
Rodents love plastic elbows….

 

[knighty]

a ate talked me into using plastic at work when I moved some stuff around

no leaks but it's bowed/drooped/kinked/sagged all over the place

cold it ok, it's just the hot

I'm going to rip it all out and swap for copper

 

[gaz1]

a ate talked me into using plastic at work when I moved some stuff around

no leaks but it's bowed/drooped/kinked/sagged all over the place

cold it ok, it's just the hot

I'm going to rip it all out and swap for copper

just pipe it in 1 1/4 pipe and that will support it better

 

[dobbslc]

@Nick67GT what is your house built like? Concrete floors or wooden with a void underneath?
Do you want to run pipes on the surface or hidden and are there mice about?
I have two Emmeti 5 port manifolds in my hallway cupboards feeding Kuterlex 15mm sleeved copper piper run in from 25 meter coils.
It's rodent proof (hopfully) and as it's off a coil has no underfloor joints to fail, I have a solid oak floor over both a screed in the house extension and floating wooden joists on top of it so really don't want to rip it up!
It can be fished through and under floor joints up to a point but obviously isn't as flexible as poly pipe. As it's plastic coated it also runs in my screed floors within extra plastic sleeve and lagging with no worries about corrosion over time.
The downside is the cost of it but in my head I'm only going to do this once and dont want any problems if I ever make it to old age
Hope this helps with some maybe slightly alternative options.

 

[MetalMonkey]

Biggest issues we have had with plastic has been a) rodents b) movement and c) oxygen permeability (presumably less of an issue now with barrier pipe).
Otherwise it is a lot cheaper and easier than copper.

 

[knighty]

just pipe it in 1 1/4 pipe and that will support it better

it's all 28mm pipe, I'll just swap to copper, pipes need moving when new roof goes on before I clad the walls anyway

 

[hermetic]

If you use plastic do not use the metal pipe reinforcers inside the pipe, only use the plastic ones as any magnetite in the system will collect round the metal ones and surprisingly quickly block the pipe (CIRCA 2 years!) AMHIK
Phil

 

[brightspark]

Biggest issues we have had with plastic has been a) rodents b) movement and c) oxygen permeability (presumably less of an issue now with barrier pipe).
Otherwise it is a lot cheaper and easier than copper.

a good few years back the heating pipe was grey in colour i got 3 rolls out of a skip and gave it to my mate a plumber who said fling it back in its no good we wont use it . its porous and lets oxygen in to the system . not much use if u have a sealed system and the pressures dropping all the time

 

[Nick67GT]

@Nick67GT what is your house built like? Concrete floors or wooden with a void underneath?
Do you want to run pipes on the surface or hidden and are there mice about?
I have two Emmeti 5 port manifolds in my hallway cupboards feeding Kuterlex 15mm sleeved copper piper run in from 25 meter coils.
It's rodent proof (hopfully) and as it's off a coil has no underfloor joints to fail, I have a solid oak floor over both a screed in the house extension and floating wooden joists on top of it so really don't want to rip it up!
It can be fished through and under floor joints up to a point but obviously isn't as flexible as poly pipe. As it's plastic coated it also runs in my screed floors within extra plastic sleeve and lagging with no worries about corrosion over time.
The downside is the cost of it but in my head I'm only going to do this once and dont want any problems if I ever make it to old age
Hope this helps with some maybe slightly alternative options.
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Thanks for posting the piping arrangements in your property. This is the sort of thing I have in mind.

The bungalow was built in the late eighties and has a block & beam floor construction. I have no idea how much space there is under the floor for running soil pipes (for example) for when we radically remodel & extend the overall layout. The present heating & hot water pipes are all in copper and run in insulated ducts along the sides of the rooms until they reach their destination and then ‘pop up’ where required. The boiler is a Valiant combi, which replaced the original boiler & hw tank arrangement. I believe it would struggle to meet with the demands of en-suites / utility room / larger kitchen / more radiators when we have have eventually agreed on the final layout.

One thing is for sure, I’d rather rip everything out and start again, than try to add to the current network and be disappointed with the result from both the performance and aesthetic point of view.

 

[dobbslc]

One thing is for sure, I’d rather rip everything out and start again, than try to add to the current network and be disappointed with the result from both the performance and aesthetic point of view.

Almost exactly the same as me, a chalet bungalow so,I have bedrooms and a shower room upstairs too.
I've ripped most of the plumbing out over the last 5 years and what's left of the old stuff will be following this year, a lot of it was in very poor condition.


Here's some of the new stuff in the eaves done while the back stud wall was out.




I'm not sure you'll easily get under a block and beam floor but the Kuterlex pipe will do the job if you can.