- Thread starter brewdexta
- Start date
I think (guess) the problem must be the tools/machines/steel cooling down overnight
then during the day warm moist air comes into the workshop, hits the cold steel, cools down and the water condenses out of it onto the steel
humidity is... weird, humidity percentage is the percent of water in the air, at that temperature compared to the maximum at that temperature
so 10% humidity at 20'C is more water in the air than 10% humidity at 10'C
if your 10% 20'C air cools down to 10'C water starts 'dropping' out of it
Shox Dr
Chief Engineer to Carlos Fandango
- Messages
- 18,008
- Location
- East Yorkshire
I think you need to concider what the purpose of the building/space is going to be used for.
Storage of wet/damp machinery is best stored in a yorkshire boarded type building where fresh air can circulate, everything is more or less ambient temp, so condensation doesn't occur.
Where as work areas that has mainly personal movement is better sealed against atmospheric air circulation; easier to keep openings closed, making sure items are dry before bringing them in, etc.
So if the area is insulated against ingress of cold damp air, you only have to deal with what you bring in, and thats mainly body fluids, breath, sweat, wet farts....cups of tea.
Thats why the old guy who takes his car out the garage once a week to go shopping then sticks it back in there wet, wonders why it's rotting from the insideout.
Gareth J
Member
- Messages
- 3,651
- Location
- North Cornwall
Stuff you bring in like your old fart with the damp car, yes. But heavy machines that stay put, no. A few days of crisp, cool weather in an uninsulated, unheated shed gets everything down to say, 5*C. Wind changes, bringing with it warm, humid air. The heavy stuff can take a day or so to warm up to the same temp as the air, Yorkshire boarding lets as much of the humid atmosphere in as it likes.
Before I sealed the gaps with expanding foam, I'd get beads of condensation on everything down to steel as light as box section. You could see the level of fluid inside the diesel tank. It's been much improved since.
Kent
Member
- Messages
- 9,988
- Location
- Bowland, Lanacshire,UK
Don't add heat add extraction. Dry stuff and use anti spatter spray thickly
If I light up my big gas torch my anvil immediately get wet as water makes a b line for it, once the anvil is got hot it goes. Now ask yourself do you want to heat all those machines and tools so they see hot to the touch 24, 7?
If I light up my big gas torch my anvil immediately get wet as water makes a b line for it, once the anvil is got hot it goes. Now ask yourself do you want to heat all those machines and tools so they see hot to the touch 24, 7?
Shox Dr
Chief Engineer to Carlos Fandango
- Messages
- 18,008
- Location
- East Yorkshire
Thats because you are creating water, as a by product of burning gas.
Shox Dr
Chief Engineer to Carlos Fandango
- Messages
- 18,008
- Location
- East Yorkshire
Operating in the space (i.e. using it like a workshop) you need heat though.
While using kit in the cold can be done, it's not ideal practice.
So, do you keep the space warm and find other ways to deal with condensation or do you leave everything cold and have numb unresponsive hands while using your lathe?
Push comes to shove, I'll wear gloves to operate machinery and let 'everyone' tell me I'm wrong, but I'd rather be comfy
It's simple enough to use heat that doesn't produce water as a by product. Instant UV bathroom heaters are cheap enough, get the halogen type and the are dimmable, [using a light dimmer] andwired through a stat, worked a treat.
graffian
Seer unto the end of his beard
- Messages
- 3,781
- Location
- gatwick
The green stuff they spray in bores at the local machine shop really does the job, I had a barrel bored in 2010 and it's on the shelf in a very damp garage
and still not any sign of the red peril.
I am not 100% but it might be some Ambersil stuff, they used to use Ambersil.
Anyone got a can of rustilo or ensis they want to flog?
and still not any sign of the red peril.
I am not 100% but it might be some Ambersil stuff, they used to use Ambersil.
Anyone got a can of rustilo or ensis they want to flog?
dobbslc
Forum Supporter
- Messages
- 12,875
- Location
- Hertfordshire UK
I don't think the lighting dimmers will like the load of a halogen heater going through them......
Shox Dr
Chief Engineer to Carlos Fandango
- Messages
- 18,008
- Location
- East Yorkshire
I don't think the lighting dimmers will like the load of a halogen heater going through them......
You have to be careful, I used a 1kw dimmer, worked with no problems for 4yrs+
Last edited:
brewdexta
The biggest tool in the box
- Messages
- 5,688
- Location
- UK
The rust season is rapidly approaching, I was thinking of testing up to 16 different oil and wax based products by dividing a 12" x 12" surface plate into 3" squares. Some will be better on metalworking tools, others on woodworking tools where you don't want oily residues.
The plan is to give it a good clean and degrease, then apply each product and leave it in the cold workshop. The surface plate was covered in rust when I acquired it so given these wonderful products will protect it, I won't be doing much damage.
Coating will be thinly applied like you would in use. I don't have a full list of stuff I have to hand in the workshop but off the top off my head I have :-
WD40,
Gibbs Brand
Camelia oil, came from Axminster about 15 years ago, says made in Japan on it
light machine oil - 3 in 1 type stuff
Liberon lubricating wax
Some Bilt Hamber wax, could be their UC, I'm pretty sure this is like ACF50 but can't confirm it.
Loads of other waxes, bees etc.
Loads of linseed oil, danish, etc. etc.
No point using engine or way oil, that will definitely work but not that pleasant in use. It is a static not an in use test so no sweat or wear but more scientific that just throwing product names about.
The aim is to find out which ones work and which ones are more fad or marketing. Suggestions welcome.
Cheers
Andy
The plan is to give it a good clean and degrease, then apply each product and leave it in the cold workshop. The surface plate was covered in rust when I acquired it so given these wonderful products will protect it, I won't be doing much damage.
Coating will be thinly applied like you would in use. I don't have a full list of stuff I have to hand in the workshop but off the top off my head I have :-
WD40,
Gibbs Brand
Camelia oil, came from Axminster about 15 years ago, says made in Japan on it
light machine oil - 3 in 1 type stuff
Liberon lubricating wax
Some Bilt Hamber wax, could be their UC, I'm pretty sure this is like ACF50 but can't confirm it.
Loads of other waxes, bees etc.
Loads of linseed oil, danish, etc. etc.
No point using engine or way oil, that will definitely work but not that pleasant in use. It is a static not an in use test so no sweat or wear but more scientific that just throwing product names about.
The aim is to find out which ones work and which ones are more fad or marketing. Suggestions welcome.
Cheers
Andy
Well it would be interesting if you tried mould protector (basically protects mould tool steel while it's in storage between runs) - it's usually green and is just spray on. I think other industries use something similar.
Pity you won't go with good old grease but I can understand the pain of getting it off later. You could just use it for the test piece as a reference point though.
Pity you won't go with good old grease but I can understand the pain of getting it off later. You could just use it for the test piece as a reference point though.
MattF
Forum Supporter
- Messages
- 17,394
- Location
- South Yorkshire
That oil & wax combo I use seems to be doing a good job of keeping stuff rust free. Pretty much any tools or machinery I clean up these days get a coating of it. Linseed oil & beeswax, with turpentine to thin it. It can be a bit time consuming to apply, as you need to buff any excess off within a day or so of application, (else it starts curing fully and you have a devil of a time buffing it then), but I lather pretty much everything with it now. 
Goes a long way too.
Goes a long way too.Looks similar could be just renamed for different industries like I mentioned.
https://www.cromwell.co.uk/shop/lub...-mould-protection-2-spray-400ml/p/AMB7011135H
http://mouldshop.co.uk/products/29-mould-sprays/3298-mould-protect-green/
I was using my lathe last week & I had cleaned up the swarf & given the ways a quick wipe down with a rag. But I forgot to go over it with an oily rag & didn't put on the motorbike cover I use to protect it. I had to spend over an hour tonight cleaning off the small patches of surface rust that appeared due to the very damp air we've recently had.
I apply chain oil with a paintbrush & wipe off the excess with a rag & keep the lathe covered & that seems to work.
I apply chain oil with a paintbrush & wipe off the excess with a rag & keep the lathe covered & that seems to work.
