Spaceframe race car chassis - options

  1. stuvy

    stuvy Member

    If your skilled enough(which takes time not just a weekend) then tube is the better material to use
     
  2. stuvy

    stuvy Member

    How many cages are built from box?
     
  3. The_Yellow_Ardvark

    The_Yellow_Ardvark perkele

    Messages:
    13,220
    Location:
    England
    I know of two.

    One is a Haynes Build you own buggy, 1" box and pipe lagging.
    Mig up as was the frame.

    The other in a Beatle based kit car. That was built into the A, B and C post of the donor car, to hide it.

    But that was an issue in the IVA.
     
  4. BarrieJ

    BarrieJ Member

    Messages:
    615
    Location:
    Milton Keynes, Bucks, United Kingdom
    Years ago I built a Dutton B Type from a factory (Tim Woolley) supplied kit, the mig welding on the chassis was very poor, both the fitting and the quality of welds. Many of them we cut off and rewelded. I have a feeling many of those cars that survived are still changing hands on eBay (or at least their reg' documents are).
    If you want to have a go yourself, then practise, practise, practise, you couldn't do worse than an early 1970's Dutton.
    Penetration is the thing, practise on sheet in all positions until you're confident that your welds are all sound, it's all too easy to get a reasonably good looking weld but it could be 'cold' and have insufficient penetration.
    Post photos of your welds on here, there'll be plenty of members willing and able to offer constructive criticism.
     
    Hopefuldave and Cornwallfrank like this.
  5. stuvy

    stuvy Member

    Cage not chassis
     
  6. Cornwallfrank New Member

    Messages:
    13
    Location:
    Cornwall
    Hi, thanks for all the info.

    I'll try to give a little bit more info.

    This is a chassis to take the front and rear subframes andengine, box etc from an Audi TT.

    I understand that tube is better than box, and the main safety structure will be tube of the correct size, material and certificated. The spec for a rallycross car floor frame is 50mm x 2mm square box section or 50mm x 2mm tube.

    Having been online all afternoon/evening I think the tacking and getting a professional to complete is probably the safest/best way forward.

    I have built a westfied, the chassis is 25 mm box, the ROPS was of course tube.

    The car will not need an IVA as it wont be road legal but will have to pass a Motorsport UK examination to get a "motorsort passport"

    I will try and teach myself/get advice/go to college when there is course availability but need to get things moving soon to get car complete for next seaon.

    All your comments are appreciated.
     
  7. stuvy

    stuvy Member

    If it’s that soon pay someone to do it

    Youl weld it up all gung ho and being box it will flex and distort unlike tube, then spend longer realising you needed more cross bracing and gussets to be repairing than racing
     
    Cornwallfrank likes this.
  8. The_Yellow_Ardvark

    The_Yellow_Ardvark perkele

    Messages:
    13,220
    Location:
    England
    It was the roll cage. Nowt to do with the chassis.
     
  9. Cornwallfrank New Member

    Messages:
    13
    Location:
    Cornwall
    As said, Ill tack it and get someone proficient to complete it, but will learn anyway for possible future projects.
     
    stuvy and The_Yellow_Ardvark like this.
  10. ronan

    ronan Member

    Messages:
    9,942
    dublin
    Anyone know anything about Formula student ? Its a competition that a huge amount of Universities and colleges take part in, designing and building a single seater racing car. As far as i know the chassis design is fixed, but the other parts like engine suspension can be varied.
     
  11. Ruffian Member

    Messages:
    2,454
    Location:
    Devon UK
    Knew a little bit when at smu.
    It has a lot of fixed regulations.

    Maximum engine size of 600cc, has to be 4 stroke and have a starter motor. And has if my memory is correct either a 18 or 19mm inlet restricted.
    Minimum weight limit, and size restrictions also.

    Alot of tuning and developments in suspension and chassis.
    I know the 2012/2013 Swansea met uni chassis were built in collaboration with pro drive also so big names help out.

    Only really used for 3 challenges per event.
     
    ronan likes this.
  12. ronan

    ronan Member

    Messages:
    9,942
    dublin

    I have seen some of the chassis, and often thought they would be a good basis for what the original poster was looking to do.
     
    Cornwallfrank likes this.
  13. Cornwallfrank New Member

    Messages:
    13
    Location:
    Cornwall
    Hi, I have looked at a lot of chassis plans, kit car chassis, hotrod chassis etc but I haven't found anything suitable for the 4WD set up I'm after. I will also be fitting a complete fibreglass bodyshell.

    4WD not FWD, sorry
     
    ronan likes this.
  14. stuvy

    stuvy Member

    Z cars
     
  15. Ruffian Member

    Messages:
    2,454
    Location:
    Devon UK
    They would be no use as far to small for any type of car engine. Most run cbr600rr engines or smaller turbo single/twin engines now for volumetric efficiency.

    For the OP to get a 4wd car for rallycross or autograss to meet the msa blue book it would have to be thoughily thought out first.

    Some really cars that we have been competing against have been outlawed to to constant changes in regs. Look at David kynaston Audi a3 or Andy burton 306 cosworth for 2 examples.

    I would be interested in you ideas first of all as if your planning on using Audi tt running gear (probably 1.8 20vt bam 225 engine)
    And the quattro system (probably not the best of choices due to the haldex rear axle)
    But trying to build it with a space frame which racing class would it come under?
     
    Cornwallfrank likes this.
  16. Moose McAlpine

    Moose McAlpine Member

    Messages:
    389
    Location:
    Watford Hertfordshire
    What exactly are you looking for?

    I have exactly one of those sat outside i bought for a project, then promptly ran out of money.

    (Mine is an APX so no expensive EGT sensor, but still a 225 Quattro.)
     
    Cornwallfrank likes this.
  17. pedrobedro

    pedrobedro Man at Matalan

    Messages:
    10,461
    Location:
    CX Derbyshire
    Dax did a 4WD kit, not cheap by any means. On the Formula Student regulations there are PDF web pages documenting them (there's an electric class as well now) 133 pages so no easy summation.
     
  18. Cornwallfrank New Member

    Messages:
    13
    Location:
    Cornwall
    The car will be for hillclimbs/sprints and would be in the sports libra class.

    I will be using the 1.8T as you say but because of the Haldex 4WD system, but I am on tarmac not the loose stuff, I find it works very well in this discipline.

    What were the issues with the outlawed cars, were these in rallycross?
     
  19. Cornwallfrank New Member

    Messages:
    13
    Location:
    Cornwall
    I will be using an APX, currently running 310/330 but with a little more to come.

    My original question was how to progress with getting the spaceframe built, do it myself, farm it out or somewhere in between.
     
  20. Ruffian Member

    Messages:
    2,454
    Location:
    Devon UK
    Both were rally cars and had excessively modified bodies that didn't hit the requirements when the blue book changed the requirements of transmission tunnel sizes and diff tunnels.

    The rally cross cars now have also got to start with body shell and alter it to the sizes and spacing in the blue books.

    I dont know about hill climbing requirements but know a couple people who do race local to me at wiscombe and will know more details.

    If i were hill climbing on tarmac I would look at removing the haldex completely and putting a atb diff in the back and putting a haldex controller in the transfer box to keep it closer to 50/50.

    I had a mk4 golf r32 and made quite a difference

    If you can get away with a full space frame then grab a mig and get fabricating yourself.
    Start small and get some practice, (some people on here do help out with tuition) and will be better for you in the long run if something needs altering afterwards like the exhaust or seat mounts.
     
    Cornwallfrank, 8ob and MattH like this.
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