Pan European back brake

[chunkolini]

Update,
I have just got a photo to show what I mean.

Taken from behind just above the swing arm.
The head of the caliper stopper bolt can be seen on the left below the brake hose, note the gap between the swing arm and bracket on the . it is the shiny bit just visible above the bolt head. Gap About 5mm.
The theory being that the pistons are pushing against the disc and bending the bracket rather then braking the bike.

Chunko'.

 

[mike os]

hang on a minute

this is a BACK brake?????

What kind of bikle is this ????

AMERICAN?

 

[chunkolini]

Wot?
An amurrikan bike.
Yes this is most definitely not the front end

 

[Ducati]

Update,
I have just got a photo to show what I mean.
View attachment 24275
Taken from behind just above the swing arm.
The head of the caliper stopper bolt can be seen on the left below the brake hose, note the gap between the swing arm and bracket on the . it is the shiny bit just visible above the bolt head. Gap About 5mm.
The theory being that the pistons are pushing against the disc and bending the bracket rather then braking the bike.

Chunko'.

Evening Chunko and all.

I haven't had chance to have a look at any local Pan back brakes yet to see if there were any differences between them and your photos.

However, I have just compared the photo in post #1 with the caliper diagram in Snoopers post #15.

In the diagram going outwards from the disc the order appears to be a) pad, b) spacer, c) anti-squeal shim.

The shim will only be a mill or so thick, however the ' spacers ' appear to be as thick as the pad backing.

On your photo there only appear to be the pads, yet no spacers !

Could these ( if missing ) account for the excess piston travel ?

If you go here http://www.judo-lochristi.be/pan_european_st1100/pdf/onderdelenlijst.pdf go to page #8 ( rear brake caliper ) , if you look at the edge of pads they appear to be in three pieces, similar to Snoopers diagram !

 

[mike os]

mutters under breath...ffs, back brakes.... wtf are theyy for? increasing unsprung weight?... mutter, mutter, spit ... real bikes...harumph etc

 

[chunkolini]

Re pads, they are one piece with two sections of material bonded on.
No antisqueal shims, no spacers, I checked the pads they are about 2mm down on new, I think I was surprised by the l;ength of piston on show after cleaning them.
Are we looking at the same image? mine are No4, the nice simple ones. The ABS/linked ones look like something out of a horror film.

I can only think it is the bracket being twisted, I did consider making up a shim to fill the gap in my picture but dont think that would help as the whole caboodle is not fixed. I was puzzled at first that nothing was a rigid fixture. 'Hmm (in beard pulling mode) everything can slide about all over the place' hmmm. Because it is a sliding bloody caliper!

Everything else seems fine, pistons move smoothly, caliper slides nicely, no fluid leaks, clamp off the pipe and loads of pressure so no air.The mechanic I saw seemed to take it as a personal insult that we could not get it working right.

I have found the bit on fleabay and will order it tomorrow.
Means using the bike with no back brake, not brilliant but I rarely use it anyway. MikeOS, I agree.

Ducati, if you go pearing at Pan rear wheels remember mine is the two pot sliding caliper version, and dont get arrested as a back wheel sniffer.

Keep us posted of any more ideas.

Chunko'.

 

[the snooper]

there is a simple reason it's trying to bend the bracket and that is the caliper is at full extention it has no travel left

 

[mike os]

only in the wet or snow..... oh ******. it's wet snow time of year

most odd chunko....as an experiment you could stick a shim in between the pad & disk to see if anything changes with the altered position?

also I assume the disk is still thick enough? ( by spec...not " yes it looks fine to me" )

also... the bolt attaching the caliper to the mount is not bent or badly worn?

 

[the snooper]

and here is one i prepared earlier as blue peter used to say as you can see no piston exposed also chunko your pads are quite worn

 

[the snooper]

also note where the caliper should be in relation to the disc, central mark yours is way off

 

[octo0072000]

Abs

My Land cruiser does exactly what you describe if the pistons are forced back and the fluid goes back to the master cyl, Don't know if it upsets the abs or what, takes ages to get it right again despite lots of bleeding,What I do now when the brakes need seeing to is clamp off the flexible pipe on the wheel being worked on,open the bleed nipple,fit rubber tube and expel the fluid as the piston goes back,And never had any trouble since using this method,

you are doing it the correct way Gordon with ABS if you push the piston back the old way it can bu--er up the ABS

 

[octo0072000]

mounting bolt

is the calliper mounting bolt adjustable so as to move the calliper inboard a bit
towards the wheel

 

[the snooper]

that wouldnt work as it would create a gap behind the right pad with nothing to push it onto the disc
its only a 2 piston caliper both pistons on the left

 

[chunkolini]

Damn fine work Mr snooper.
The little index mark on the pad spring is a help.
Sooo if I can pull the front end of the caliper in closer to the swing arm, getting rid of the section of exposed stop bolt that will pivot the caliper back into line, and get the index mark and caliper back in line?
Do you think as we deduced today that somehow the mounting bracket is somehow twisted/bent?

Chunko'.

 

[the snooper]

no i think its twisting because the caliper cant move any further to the left

 

[chunkolini]

Any idea what can be causing this?

 

[the snooper]

the space that the caliper has, has to be taken up evenly by the pads and the disc to centralise the caliper so even if it was unbolted from the bike when you apply the brake it would still stay central

 

[chunkolini]

Will have yet another fiddle in the morning.
Detach the caliper from the mount and press the pedal and see whathappens regards lining itself up?

 

[the snooper]

by the looks of the pads they need renewing that would be a start

 

[chunkolini]

Ok, I can see that your pads look about as thick as the disc, will try that tomorrow.
Luckily I can get some in our tiny town.