New motorcycle sales dropping - dealers shutting.

[winchman]

I feel we all have less disposable income, basic stuff has often doubled in price, the knock on is people are not buying as much.

 

[pressbrake1]

No one sensible wants their kids to ride
Electric bikes a less hassle than a 125
Four stroke 125 are purgatory compared to two stroke
By the time you’re 24 you’ve hopefully got a car licence and life is on track so need for a bike and probably no time
In the 90s I worked at a large factory with several thousand employees. There was only three or four bikes in the parking. And that was thirty years ago

 

[Morrisman]

I am on the young side for forum members (although am rapidly approaching middle age), I think there's two major reasons.

Firstly,
Economics, young people really don't have a lot of disposable income (especially compared to their parents at a similar age), and with UK weather a motorbike is always going to be a fair weather toy unless you're a bit gone in the head very committed.

Add to that the increased risk of theft, the additional setup cost compared to a car (multiple sets of riding gear etc.) and the fact that bikes are no cheaper to buy (or lease) than new cars but deprecate much faster... It's extremely hard to justify it on a limited budget.

The only young people I see getting on two wheels now are teenagers who live rurally, where the year of additional freedom if you get a scooter at 16 is worth it.


Safety,
Despite spending many a happy hour riding motorbikes when I lived in Africa in my late teens (I in fact got my Ugandan motorcycle license before I got a UK car license) I wouldn't dream of riding a bike here...

The roads are incredibly congested, drivers have terrible awareness of bikes, and it adds up to being disproportionately dangerous (compared to say a jaunt to Basra, Tripoli, or Kinshasa which is a risk level I am happy with), because you can't easily control the risk that other drivers present to you.

My friend who lives in NZ feels the same when she's back, despite the fact she rides an Enduro bike to get round her farm day in day out (and is ten times the rider I will ever be) wouldn't think of having a bike in the UK.

If we had more available off-road trail riding, I might be tempted, but (legal) trails are pretty scant on the ground to justify a toy like that.

I think that for an older generation who got bitten by the bug when the risk level was less acute (same risk of serious injuries or death, but much less likely to be inflicted on you by circumstances out of your control), it's easy to rationalise this element and keep riding, just like I keep smoking...

But if you're not already hooked, it's a huge disincentive.

I lived and rode bikes in the far east for some 20 years or so, it’s chaos, murderous, compared to the U.K. Might is Right, over there, the bigger you are, the more right of way you have.

It took me a while to get into the swing of things, but once I’d given up trying to force them to drive ‘properly’ it became far easier.

Having a gun pointed in my face for abusing the hell out of some clown who literally tried to drive over me was an early wake up call.

 

[Seadog]

I had the OLD ZX10 nothing like the newer sports focused one, but was a tank, road up to Manchester in one sitting. with a quick splash & dash. could ride that all day no problems.

Me too. Bought new in 1988. No problem pulling two up in the 140mph region, and then some.
It seemed to get more stable the faster you went.

 

[Morrisman]

Everything is too expensive now
Cars n bikes are in ratio with house prices.

In 2014 I bought a brand new zx10r for £9500

One is now £17500 and my one still had full electronics so yes there will be improvements but essentially the same beast

My favourite ever bike, BMW R1100, 1997 model. Bought 8 years ago for £1500, I rode 80,000+ miles on it, loved it. It had to go earlier this year due to my health.

I’d often thought of upgrading to a modern version of the same basic bike, but it would have been £10-15k for something maybe a bit crisper, a bit tauter, faster etc.

At bike nights it was always guaranteed to be the cheapest bike in the car park, with the highest miles, 125,000 when I sold it.

 

[8ob]

I see Harley's with "For Sale" signs everywhere as of late......

I have a 1996 road King with less than 1,100 miles on it, not even had its first service yet, now that tells you a lot about the allure of a Harley .

Bob

 

[rtcosic]

I have a 1996 road King with less than 1,100 miles on it, not even had its first service yet, now that tells you a lot about the allure of a Harley .

Bob

You're meant to ride a Harley?
Who knew!

 

[mtt.tr]

My favourite to own was a k100, that had 225k miles, pals had 180k miles

 

[Beanwood]

My favourite to own was a k100, that had 225k miles, pals had 180k miles

They were nice bikes - but the mirrors were car door mirror height - and I clipped a couple off their brackets when filtering through traffic....

 

[minimutly]

No one sensible wants their kids to ride
Electric bikes a less hassle than a 125
Four stroke 125 are purgatory compared to two stroke
By the time you’re 24 you’ve hopefully got a car licence and life is on track so need for a bike and probably no time
In the 90s I worked at a large factory with several thousand employees. There was only three or four bikes in the parking. And that was thirty years ago

Even on a 125 you have to do a CBT every 2 years. It costs £700 plus to pass all the "tests" to get your bike license, and quite a bit of palaver...

 

[Erie Fred]

You're meant to ride a Harley?
Who knew!

Yes....you think you know someone....really know them.....and then this....

 

[pressbrake1]

Even on a 125 you have to do a CBT every 2 years. It costs £700 plus to pass all the "tests" to get your bike license, and quite a bit of palaver...

And tests are hard to get

 

[dobbslc]

I had the OLD ZX10 nothing like the newer sports focused one, but was a tank, road up to Manchester in one sitting. with a quick splash & dash. could ride that all day no problems.

I had the ZX4 a 400 version of one of those and it was a really nice bike to ride. Very comfortable for a sports bike.

 

[Martin Hocking]

Everything is too expensive now
Cars n bikes are in ratio with house prices.

In 2014 I bought a brand new zx10r for £9500

One is now £17500 and my one still had full electronics so yes there will be improvements but essentially the same beast

I don’t disagree with the sentiment here. But I think your numbers aren’t comparing apples with apples.

In 2014 a zx10r had a list price of £12200

Current list price as you say is
£17500

BoE inflation calculator makes the 2014 bike cost £16895 in todays wedge.

So yes a new model is more expensive but not by much. Maybe not at all after the merciless haggling your clearly capable of… (9.5k good work!)

If you try and compare like with like a 25 cbr600rr is 11 grand.

It’s ostensibly identical to one around 2013-14 and is actually cheaper in relative terms.

I do concede that someone telling you it’s cheaper and that seeming true in real life are two different things.

 

[Morrisman]

I have a 1996 road King with less than 1,100 miles on it, not even had its first service yet, now that tells you a lot about the allure of a Harley .

Bob

I always planned on buying a big twin Harley some day, but just never got around to it. It’ll never happen now, of course.

 

[addjunkie]

I always planned on buying a big twin Harley some day, but just never got around to it. It’ll never happen now, of course.

Youve not missed much apart from the new bike buzz, wears off fairly quickly

 

[mtt.tr]

Youve not missed much apart from the new bike buzz, wears off fairly quickly

My neighbour lasted a year, it was the bike he rode the least

 

[xmetal]

I think a big reason is the time and expense for a young rider. When I started on bikes you could ride up to a 250cc on 'L' plates and the test was fairly easy to pass and then you could ride any bike. It just seems like they have gone too far in making it restrictive now. It's a shame as starting on bikes makes you a better car driver.

 

[More Amps]

Like many, my first transport was a bike (an NVT 125 - basically a re-badged Yamaha DT125) which I relied on for about four years until winter riding lost its appeal due to a leaky fake barbour, jeans and a pair of gloves combined with an open face helmet. Not perhaps the ideal mode for going from Edinburgh to Aberdeen in February, but I survived to tell the tale. These days a teenager is faced with getting a provisional licence, theory test, CBT, A1 test, A2 test or waiting and going for DAS...Below are the charges quoted by a local training place,

Individual training days are charged out at £300 per day (FULL equipment hire included in price)
Test fees: Mod 1 £15.50 Mod 2 £75
DVSA. Motorcycle Manoeuvring Area (MMA) hire: £100
4 Day Mod 1 & 2 compressed course £1000:
Mod 1 = 1 day training + 1 day test £500 (MMA & Test fees not included)
Mod 2 = 1 Day training + 1 day test £500 (Test fee not included)
6 Day Mod 1 & 2 compressed course £1500:
Mod 1 = 2 days training + 1 day test £750 (MMA & Test fees not included)
Mod 2 = 2 Days training + 1 day test £750 (Test fee not included)
8 Day Mod 1 & 2 compressed course £2000:
Mod 1 = 3 days training + 1 day test £1000 (MMA & Test fees included

)
Mod 2 = 3 Days training + 1 day test £1000 (Test fee included

)

Based on the above, your average teenager/youngster is looking at an initial minimum spend of £1,000 and that's before they buy themselves a helmet, gloves, jacket, boots and hopefully some trousers that provide a little more protection than a pair of old ripped Levis - and we can't forget that they will also need to fund a bike as well... Throw in the fact that there's no guarantee that they'll pass all the various components first time, and the costs continue to climb!

The price of new bikes by the major manufacturers will continue to climb as they try to squeeze more power from their engines while also having to deal with ever stricter emission controls while also trying to cover every possible potential segment of a market that has splintered into so many new types unlike the old days of learner/commuter/sports/tourer.

Classic bike prices seem to have come off the boil if you look at prices achieved rather than some of the ludicrous asking prices. I believe this is largely due to the ageing demographic - people who want to buy Classics typically lust after the superbikes of their youth (and yes I know some people have driven up the values of a Yamaha FS1E - there's one on Ebay priced at £9,495, and two others at £7,299...why would you buy one? You surely can't believe that it's a shrewd investment at that price, and you're unlikely to jump on it for a run to the pub...so presumably people buy them just to remind themselves of when they were sixteen... Pre-war bikes are running out of people who can remember them when they first came out - and with obvious exceptions (Vincent Black Shadow, Brough Superior etc) prices appear to be on a slow decline. Post-war bikes (let's say upto 1970) are surely in the same boat - plenty of buyers for sports bikes, especially those with history, but long-term (say 10 - 20 years) who's going to be lusting for a Manx Norton? Post 1970 bikes have to be the sector with the greatest potential as potential buyers have settled down, had kids and seen them flee the nest and now have some disposable money to spend on toys for themselves...

Personally, I think that right now is a great time to be buying a bike - if you look at what's available for under 5K, there are some absolute bargains available, ok you won't be buying the latest spec with all the latest gadgets, but whatever your tastes you can find plenty of low mileage, good condition bikes (often with full dealer service history). I paid 3.5K for my Africa Twin (2000 plate, one owner and only 15,000 miles) Current asking prices suggest that it should fetch 5K on a good day depending on the buyer - if it turns a profit, I'll be happy. MCN recently ran a feature on buying a Hayabusa for £1,500 - ok at that price it's almost certainly a little tatty round the edges, but throw some money and time at it and you'd have a cheap missile if that's what floats your boat.

Harleys have been mentioned in this thread, and it's worth mentioning that the average age of a Harley rider has now reached 50, and Harley themselves have recognised that this a problem for them - they don't want to be selling bikes to older and older people, hence the introduction of smaller capacity bikes.

I apologise that this "short" post now looks more like an essay, but I look forward to reading the views of others - especially if they say i've got it all wrong!

 

[daleyd]

Me too. Bought new in 1988. No problem pulling two up in the 140mph region, and then some.
It seemed to get more stable the faster you went.

My cousin had the wayward predecessor to that, the GPZ1000RX. Fantastic looking but evil handling, he managed 170 on it - I would normally be inclined to think it was a tall tale but it was corroborated by the old bill followed by a stay at her majesties pleasure