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douchecalamondaes
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OP???
I just took it all apart today, to take those photo's, and spent a while coaxing fuel out of the bottom of the float, eventually it flowed freely out of the bottom of the float, after that it ran sweet, It wont idle on min throttle until the engine warms up, (i.e) after id done some welding with it. but that doesnt matter as you can basically weld with the engine cold on full throttle, (apparently 3000 rpm) I think you have to be on full throttle to weld any amps with these due to frequency?
I am aiming to run 20:1 mix as it says on the engine, at the moment it might not be exactly that as I ran alot of fuel through it to get it going, but I am marking up an old bottle with the right amount for a 5L can so in future it will be spot on.
its alot more than the usual 50:1 for modern engines, but did run smokeless today. whats the best way of stopping it? at the moment I have to pull the spark connection, is there a better way?
also, its a new experience for me to weld and not be able to hear the arc.. I thought that would give me problems but made some pretty runs on my first attempt so all good.
thanks for all your help guys, what rods work well with what amps? and is it better to layer it on with a smaller rod, or use one big one? I am mostly self taught, only learning the basics off an old friend.
I use 3.2mm at 100ams, 2.5 at about 65, 2mm at about 50 etc. I do have some 4mm which my old mains welder couldn't generate the power for, im guessing 120ish?? im welding 10mm steel plate, 3mm box section and some round pipe, and just layering till my weld it as thick as the metal i'm welding, also only using 6013 rod at the moment. mostly with the 3.2 rod, and the 2 or 1.6 for delicate areas and touching up. project needs to be strong, functional, not for artwork etc.
I just took it all apart today, to take those photo's, and spent a while coaxing fuel out of the bottom of the float, eventually it flowed freely out of the bottom of the float, after that it ran sweet, It wont idle on min throttle until the engine warms up, (i.e) after id done some welding with it. but that doesnt matter as you can basically weld with the engine cold on full throttle, (apparently 3000 rpm) I think you have to be on full throttle to weld any amps with these due to frequency?
I am aiming to run 20:1 mix as it says on the engine, at the moment it might not be exactly that as I ran alot of fuel through it to get it going, but I am marking up an old bottle with the right amount for a 5L can so in future it will be spot on.
its alot more than the usual 50:1 for modern engines, but did run smokeless today. whats the best way of stopping it? at the moment I have to pull the spark connection, is there a better way?
also, its a new experience for me to weld and not be able to hear the arc.. I thought that would give me problems but made some pretty runs on my first attempt so all good.
thanks for all your help guys, what rods work well with what amps? and is it better to layer it on with a smaller rod, or use one big one? I am mostly self taught, only learning the basics off an old friend.
I use 3.2mm at 100ams, 2.5 at about 65, 2mm at about 50 etc. I do have some 4mm which my old mains welder couldn't generate the power for, im guessing 120ish?? im welding 10mm steel plate, 3mm box section and some round pipe, and just layering till my weld it as thick as the metal i'm welding, also only using 6013 rod at the moment. mostly with the 3.2 rod, and the 2 or 1.6 for delicate areas and touching up. project needs to be strong, functional, not for artwork etc.
I asked a bloke who maintains the petrol powered equipment at a tool hire place, which is also a Stihl agent, about oil/fuel ratios. He said that the ratio was a property of the two stroke oil and not the engine. He also told me that making the mixture too oil rich was bad news because it tended to coke the engine and gum the rings. Years ago, when that engine was new, the advice was probably to use SAE30 in a much stronger mix than modern two stroke oils.
The currents you quote seem rather low, especially for an AC welding machine. However, the dials on welding machines are often not very accurate and you have to set the current according to how the rods run and use the scale on the machine as a reference for the next time.
With old engines, and especially old two strokes, it can be very hard to get a slow tick over and they are a bit troublesome when cold.
So all you did with this was to take it to bits and give it a clean out?
The currents you quote seem rather low, especially for an AC welding machine. However, the dials on welding machines are often not very accurate and you have to set the current according to how the rods run and use the scale on the machine as a reference for the next time.
With old engines, and especially old two strokes, it can be very hard to get a slow tick over and they are a bit troublesome when cold.
So all you did with this was to take it to bits and give it a clean out?
HughF
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25:1 on mine with stihl oil. Just come in from putting an hour on it padding beads in the horizontal and overhead with 7016, didn't miss a beat. To stop them, look on the pull start area/fan cover, there should be a rubber button that you press to kill the ignition.
I run 3.2 on 100-115-130 depending on joint type and position on mine. I don't use any other sizes of rod. Put up a photo of your control panel plate, you might have the fine adjustment version
mine is the really old version...
I run 3.2 on 100-115-130 depending on joint type and position on mine. I don't use any other sizes of rod. Put up a photo of your control panel plate, you might have the fine adjustment version
mine is the really old version...25:1 on mine with stihl oil. Just come in from putting an hour on it padding beads in the horizontal and overhead with 7016, didn't miss a beat. To stop them, look on the pull start area/fan cover, there should be a rubber button that you press to kill the ignition.
I run 3.2 on 100-115-130 depending on joint type and position on mine. I don't use any other sizes of rod. Put up a photo of your control panel plate, you might have the fine adjustment version
OP (Original Poster - that's you douchelcamondaes), successful experience with the very thing you are using - you can't beat it.
I use Stihl two stroke oil in a hedge cutter and strimmer at 50:1 and I've had no probs but they are fairly modern (about 20 year old) engines. The neighbour was using a new hedge cutter in a cloud of blue smoke and when I asked it turned out he was using some DIY shed 2T oil at 25:1 like it said on the machine.
I use Stihl 2T @ 50:1 and find it works out quite cheap when bought by the litre. 5 litres works out even cheaper if you can use that much in a sensible time. When I've opened the crankcases, there's been a reasonable amount of oil in there.
Dunno, maybe it's different for some reason with ancient two strokes. You might check the vintage motorbike sites.
the snooper
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he has it running properly now
douchecalamondaes
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there was a thread I saw about what oil mix to use, ill try and find and link it, someone had taken apart the engine to show the aftermath of too lean/too rich etc.
so stithl oil is the one to use?? I have a dirt bike and some lawnmowers, both new, will stithl work good in that? and I'm not sure to be honest, it doesnt smoke as it is, so I might leave it at 20 or 25:1, better a little rich than a little lean.
hugh thats the exact same engine by the looks of it, 372cc JLO engine. mine has adjustment 50-70-85-100, that sorta region, so not too accurate, 85 was too low for 3.2mm, is sat on top and didnt cast good, 100 seems good, melts in nice, and doesnt feel like it needs more, I cant find that button, Id heard roumours of it, but cant find it on mine, but it still just kills spark?
I'v been using it today for what I posted about building, welding 10mm, worked much better than my single phase, beautiful runs, im gonna use it for everything over 2.5mm now.
yes all I did was change the spark plug and clean out the carb,float, blah blah, and ran alot of fuel through it, I think these are so simple you will be able towork it out eventually, (a couple days for me, a diesel only machanic)
so stithl oil is the one to use?? I have a dirt bike and some lawnmowers, both new, will stithl work good in that? and I'm not sure to be honest, it doesnt smoke as it is, so I might leave it at 20 or 25:1, better a little rich than a little lean.
hugh thats the exact same engine by the looks of it, 372cc JLO engine. mine has adjustment 50-70-85-100, that sorta region, so not too accurate, 85 was too low for 3.2mm, is sat on top and didnt cast good, 100 seems good, melts in nice, and doesnt feel like it needs more, I cant find that button, Id heard roumours of it, but cant find it on mine, but it still just kills spark?
I'v been using it today for what I posted about building, welding 10mm, worked much better than my single phase, beautiful runs, im gonna use it for everything over 2.5mm now.
yes all I did was change the spark plug and clean out the carb,float, blah blah, and ran alot of fuel through it, I think these are so simple you will be able towork it out eventually, (a couple days for me, a diesel only machanic)
brightspark
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douchecalamondaes
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also, does it overheat? or is the flywheel fan enough for prolonged use? I tried to spend as little time as possible at full pelt to keep it cool, will it run for say half an hour without cooking??
douchecalamondaes
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the motorbike is premix, honda CR 80 derestricted, the mowers are 4 stroke, I was getting confused my bad..
I cant find any info on what sorta oil the manufacturer recommends. but if it is looking for SAE, then ill just use 10w-30 in it no? I can get hold of the man who used to use it back in the day, so I guess we will have the difinitive answer then I would have thought, looking at the engine, that it would take SAE at 20:1, it is huge for a single piston after all
I cant find any info on what sorta oil the manufacturer recommends. but if it is looking for SAE, then ill just use 10w-30 in it no? I can get hold of the man who used to use it back in the day, so I guess we will have the difinitive answer then I would have thought, looking at the engine, that it would take SAE at 20:1, it is huge for a single piston after all
HughF
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Use a good quality 2 stroke oil, nothing 'racing' or similarly fancy, just a good quality oil. I'd still stand by running it at 25:1 instead of the 20:1, as the modern oil will have much better lubricating properties than the stuff of old. Also, 25:1 is super easy with the disposable stihl vials, just chuck two of them into a 5l can instead of 1 and you're sorted.
There should be a cast aluminium plate bolted to the brace that runs from the air cleaner guard to the cylinder head that tells you the oil type. Probably long since out of production.
There's a conversion jet available for seagull outboards to go from 8:1 up to 25:1 with modern oils, and they don't seem to grenade themselves.
Yours has the later Rockwell JLO engine with the 6 bolt head. Mine is the heavier, older unit that looks like it came from the 40's. These welder were available with many different engines during their production run. As for it overheating, the cooling fan in the engine will keep it cool when running for hours at full power, you have nothing to worry about. Grab some 4mm 7024, stick it on full power and make it work
There should be a cast aluminium plate bolted to the brace that runs from the air cleaner guard to the cylinder head that tells you the oil type. Probably long since out of production.
There's a conversion jet available for seagull outboards to go from 8:1 up to 25:1 with modern oils, and they don't seem to grenade themselves.
Yours has the later Rockwell JLO engine with the 6 bolt head. Mine is the heavier, older unit that looks like it came from the 40's. These welder were available with many different engines during their production run. As for it overheating, the cooling fan in the engine will keep it cool when running for hours at full power, you have nothing to worry about. Grab some 4mm 7024, stick it on full power and make it work
normspanners
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OP =ORIGINAL POSTER
IE---- you
This conversion is not for your engine it is only for the seagull outboard.
I think hugh was just giving an example that you can weaken off the oil ratio with modern oils??
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HughF
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Exactly...
douchecalamondaes
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yes I have the metal plate, it says 20:1 but doesnt say what type of oil
I prefer mineral to snth for everything,engine oil etc, so is the stithl oil mineral??
yep mine is the 6 bolt, yours looked the same,
does it take more power to use gigher grade rod? like iv said i only used 6013 atm
I prefer mineral to snth for everything,engine oil etc, so is the stithl oil mineral??
yep mine is the 6 bolt, yours looked the same,
does it take more power to use gigher grade rod? like iv said i only used 6013 atm
HughF
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Mine is the 4 bolt, I'll put a picture up later, it's quite different.
I have no idea if the stihl oil is mineral or not, but it works and is cheap enough.Iron powder rods (7024) need more amps for the same thickness as you have to melt the coating too.
mine will idle with the throttle arm shut down too, these carbs seem quite good.
I have no idea if the stihl oil is mineral or not, but it works and is cheap enough.Iron powder rods (7024) need more amps for the same thickness as you have to melt the coating too.
mine will idle with the throttle arm shut down too, these carbs seem quite good.
douchecalamondaes
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idl's better than my dirt bike to be honest, but doesnt rev up massively quick, abit like a diesel revving, probably a massive flywheel.
The red Stihl 2T oil most places supply is mineral. I think they also do a synthetic as well but it may only be available in the USA. Some of the synthetic two stroke oils are to be mixed at 100:1. The oil companies have research departments working out the composition and use of two stroke oils and they don't stay in the game by seizing up engines, so you'd think they'd know what they were doing, but, I'd be reluctant to use any two stroke oil at 100:1.
IIRC the old 2 stroke Flymos used SAE30 at 16:1, but they never seemed to last that long and coked badly.
Two stroke oils for outboards are different again and shouldn't be used in anything but outboards.
Some of the bike two stroke oils have a large ratio of oil to fuel, but they are prediluted for easier mixing.
