First project help

  1. garyhealy Member

    Messages:
    5
    Rochdale
    Finally started welding at college and have learnt plenty already, this site has helped too!

    Anyway, now that I am starting to get to grips with it I am ready to start tackling the sills on my car.

    I have the full panel replacement to use.
    Firstly, the front 1/4 of the sill is fine, should i still replace is all of cut the new panel to size.

    Also, when I cut off the sill at the rear panel, when fitting the new panel and it comes to welding should I butt weld on lap weld with the new panel on the top.

    It doesn't have to be beautiful as the car is having sideskirts blended on so the fibreglass and filler work will cover it, just after finding out whats adviseable.

    Cheers
     
  2. just done a similar thing myself

    glad to have another welder aboard,college is a good place to learn,but real life is the REAL school!
    I'm a firm believer in if it a'int rusty and its original-LEAVE IT.This would apply to the front qrtr sill on your project.Obviously you would have to be pretty acurate in your marking out on your new sill.
    As to butt weld or lap weld,for a beginner lap weld is the easiest,but just remember to apply weld thru primer on the inner lip you will have made(just holds back the dreaded red stuff coming back).
    I've just done the same to my Capri,only I butt welded it,didn't want to put anymore money into Mr Ford's pocket!
    If your putting skirts on it,just make sure you've got loads of waxoyl on the sills,moisture builds up on the inside otherwise and you'll have to do it again.
    Hope this helps with your project,what car is it?
    :)
     
  3. garyhealy Member

    Messages:
    5
    Rochdale
    Hi there

    I've decided to give up, there's far too much rust in other areas to carry on, it's only a Nissan Micra so not so bad really.

    As for real lifef is real school, couldn't agree more! College is good as it's got a great and useful setup but thats not how you work in real life, good thing is using what I've learnt so far I've been able to weld seats from another car onto the frame of the micra, this is something alot of people I know pay for.
     
  4. malcolm

    malcolm Hej!

    Messages:
    8,828
    Location:
    Bedford UK
    Miised another one.

    For a structural componant like a sill use the whole panel every time. The advantage of doing that is you stagger the welds over a large area - you weld to the A pillar, the B pillar, the bits at the front and the back, to the floor. The car has to completely disintegrate in order to break at your welds.

    Replacing half a sill is a bit cut and shut. It's a bad plan to leave a handy line for the car to break along. Even perfect welding will alter the metal properties.
     
  5. weldequip Forum Sponsor

    Messages:
    5,306
    Location:
    England
    When I did my welder training at college the tutor was only interested in doing his own foreigners anyway! So much for education, what is it they say? "Those that can do, and those that can't...! If he was such a great welder he'd have been working at BNFL or Rolls Royce!!
     
  6. garyhealy Member

    Messages:
    5
    Rochdale
    I'm hoping to start taking few things in to weld as I use better welders at college
     
  7. Silas (son of Silas)

    Silas (son of Silas) In need of restoration.

    Messages:
    165
    West Midlands
    When I did my welding course at college a few years back, the tutor showed us around the workshop on the first night and pointed out a Murex (i forget the model) identical to the one my father had just completed a VW restoration with. New door bottoms both sides, rear quarter panel replaced, new front and rear valances, new heater channels, extensive inner wing repairs at the front, sunroof removed and new section welded in to fill the hole and the entire area under the rear seat replaced.

    The tutor pointed at the Murex and said something like "for those of you wanting to weld thin bodywork, plants like this one are unable to be set at a low enough to be of any use"

    I queried if he meant it was no good for beginners, or just no good at all. He replied No good at all. I scratched my head and kept my mouth shut. What did I know?

    I told my father about it, who was greatly pee'd on 2 counts. Firstly I was paying a stranger to teach me how to weld (my father owned a large precision engineering firm for years, and prior to that had been a welder for ever) Secondly because the guy I was paying my hard earned cash to was a **Language**.

    The following week he turned up at the start of the evening (I wished I'd kept my mouth shut when I saw him arrive), payed the enrollment fee for a whole term, spent the whole 2 hours tucked away in the corner welding the thinnest steel in the shop. At the end of the class presented his efforts to the tutor and told him if he ever needed any lessons on brushing up his welding skills to drop by his factory anytime, preferably before charging any more money to people hoping to learn to weld anything neater than the "messy line of pigeon **Language**" he'd be demonstrating.

    He didn't bother coming to any more lessons.

    I didn't appreciate his turning up, or his attitude, but I can kind of see his point. I learned absolutely nothing from that class and I didn't see a single neat weld the whole time I was there. I also remember one of the guys on the course with me snapping the tutors discarded demo welds on more than one occasion. The guy was crap, and shouldn't have been passing on his poor skills to others.

    A few years later and I've started welding again, I called my father and asked if I could spend an hour or so with him to see if he could show me were I was going wrong. No chance. He's not changed
     
  8. malcolm

    malcolm Hej!

    Messages:
    8,828
    Location:
    Bedford UK
    What? Your father didn't like you going for lesons but wouldn't give them himself? Surely you can give him some stick for that!

    The Murex might have had a high minimum amp setting. You can get around that sort of thing on thin metal with a bit of technique especially with a high quality welder like the Murex, but it's no good for learning, and even experienced welders would find things much easier with something that is aimed at the job.

    I've posted some photos on the forum of 0.3mm steel neatly welded with a Portamig, but there's no way that Weldequip would suggest anything other than a decent TIG for that sort of thing. It's a technique - or "bodge" as I like to call it - the welder just wasn't supplied to do that sort of thing.

    Shame the course didn't work out, but I'd be surprised if you learned nothing from it. Person to person tuition is the way to learn welding. I had a complete newbie doing perfectly good welds on perfectly positioned metal after 10 minutes this week. Of course imperfectly positioned welds are a little harder, but he's got the bug and is going to buy himself a cheapish MIG.
     
  9. Silas (son of Silas)

    Silas (son of Silas) In need of restoration.

    Messages:
    165
    West Midlands
    It's what I would have really liked. 1 to 1 tuition for free. Problem is he is very good at doing but pretty poor at explaining. That goes for most things. His advice tends to avoid all details and consist of things like "well, you just do it"

    I'm spending a lot of time trying to get to grips with the Migmate I just bought, but he doesn't seem overly enthusiastic at any level. His main objections are:

    Why waste your time welding up and old car when you could buy a new one? (because I can't afford a new one)

    If you must drive old cars, why not either buy one that's already been restored or pay someone else to restore it (see previous response)

    Etc Etc....

    I don't see him that often as he lives about 80 miles from me, so when I do see him he is usually more interested in saying hello and catching up than picking up welder. There's also the fact he is pretty old these days. Perhaps I should have tried to tap his skills 15 years ago?
     
  10. lexi Member

    Messages:
    1,557
    paisley
    A lot of tradesman lose patience as they get older, I know I have especially since I`ve been self employed. It was different when you were working with a company and over the years I had two apprentices who did their four years with me on a daily basis. I think the emphasis is too much on money with self employment rather than training. Tis a pity especially as the shortages are now being filled with people from abroad rather than training our young boys. Can`t do ? Teach is what my old man used to say....a bit extreme maybe. I used to kid one of my apprentices by saying" I`ve taught you everything I know!......and you still know nothing!?
    Alex
     
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