Digital IDs

[Cato]

For a start it means you would be more likely to be cynical of such wonderous new technologies as digital IDs and CBDCs. It means you are more likely to be able to evaluate news stories in an intelligent way. I am far more at ease in this mad world knowing who the 'bad guys' are and what they are up to than I was when I had no idea and was simply battered around by the unfairness of it all. I now have some agency and ability to make sensible choices, my health has improved immeasurably and my peace of mind is vastly improved, even though this seems paradoxical. They say that ignorance is bliss but your mind will always want to understand and is powerless to do so when you are ignorant or deceived.

Which illustrates my point really, you know that you know what you know. Beyond that there's not a thing you can do with the knowledge irrespective of its being right or wrong.

 

[Dessieb2022]

I'm not saying that any or all of the conspiracy theories are wrong, or denying the existence of cabals etc. at least in part because there isn't any conclusive evidence easily available one way or the other. My point/question was more about working on the premise that the theory is correct, what use is that knowledge?

IMO I think it would be like any situation where you are being lied to, cheating partner etc. I'd rather be dealing with the real situation than a false one and being taken for a mug.

 

[Cato]

IMO I think it would be like any situation where you are being lied to, cheating partner etc. I'd rather be dealing with the real situation than a false one and being taken for a mug.

Granted in situations like the one you use as an example it's better to know because you can do something about it. Situations as described in previous replies you can't, so those 'in the know' have no more control over the situation than those who are ignorant of it or those who are aware but don't care.

 

[Prajna]

Which illustrates my point really, you know that you know what you know. Beyond that there's not a thing you can do with the knowledge irrespective of its being right or wrong.

Well actually, @Cato, I have managed to change a great many things thanks to knowing what I know and particularly have changed and inspired a great number of people. It has also required a good deal of courage, which would have been impossible for me without the knowledge that gave rise to it. And that is the key: the knowledge allows the courage and confidence and clarity to change things that you would otherwise feel helpless about and perhaps try to ignore.

 

[Cato]

Well actually, @Cato, I have managed to change a great many things thanks to knowing what I know and particularly have changed and inspired a great number of people. It has also required a good deal of courage, which would have been impossible for me without the knowledge that gave rise to it. And that is the key: the knowledge allows the courage and confidence and clarity to change things that you would otherwise feel helpless about and perhaps try to ignore.

But what have you changed? That was/is my question, and it's a genuine question. I'm not trying to prove a point, or indeed to prove/disprove what you say.

 

[Prajna]

Granted in situations like the one you use as an example it's better to know because you can do something about it. Situations as described in previous replies you can't, so those 'in the know' have no more control over the situation than those who are ignorant of it or those who are aware but don't care.

Except that you do have a measure of control (or at least influence) over even such seemingly insurmountable problems. Just one Austrian journalist managed to delay a major psyop/biowarfare attack on the world in 2015 by publishing about the attempt. The more people who know what 'they' are up to the more friction and delay is introduced into their plans. The more delay there is the more people become aware of what is happening and the more resistance there is to it. You can affect it no matter how small you think you are. Also, you are then able to support those who are in a position to have some effect on it.

 

[gaz1]

If im honest i dont see why we need digital ids, as it wont stop fraud thats for sure

I didnt mind the driving license to be able to drive or the passport to leave the country

where i do mind is where it is used for other things

a driving license or passport shouldnt be used by other agencys that buy it off dvla i didnt consent to this only consented for dvla to have these details and for the police to beable to check if i could drive or not

the same can be said for the passport we use it to travel abroad and to return back to the uk whilst if we lose the passport we can go elsewhere to get a pass as its recorded through the embassy

ive got no idea to be honest never been abroad and no interest to do so

now i know i didnt consent to passing my contact details to third partys from the dvla
the dvla is selling my details to third partys
many of us know this when we got a parking fine for parking on private land

now if we look at council tax where you can be traced and jailed for non payment this would be acceptable to trace the user via the d license

however they have used the same regs to trace owner of the vehicle which in its own right is against the policy they gained details by false pretences from the dvla

council tax and parking fines are seperate

the same can be said for companys running council land parking ( third partys )

the driving license has now become a tracking device as the license must be addressed

 

[rcx132]

Except that you do have a measure of control (or at least influence) over even such seemingly insurmountable problems. Just one Austrian journalist managed to delay a major psyop/biowarfare attack on the world in 2015 by publishing about the attempt. The more people who know what 'they' are up to the more friction and delay is introduced into their plans. The more delay there is the more people become aware of what is happening and the more resistance there is to it. You can affect it no matter how small you think you are. Also, you are then able to support those who are in a position to have some effect on it.

But what are the consequences if you are wrong ? What if this new legislation is genuinely trying to fix the issues with the older ID system? What if these attempts to stop the progress of technology stop us being able to deliver better services to people, or stop attempts to reduce costs and alleviate our financial issues? What if our small island, which lacks industrial might and resources, needs to be a technology innovator instead? Encouraging conspiracies causes people to have mis-trust of governments and academics and encourages pre-science thinking. Look at how the QAnon and election conspiracy in the US lead to an attempted insurrection. Conspiracies are dangerous, not to mention that they are a rabbit hole that mess with lives and peoples mental health (Reddit QAnon Casualties is an entire sub devoted to helping the families of conspiracy theorists and is a sad read).

 

[Dessieb2022]

Granted in situations like the one you use as an example it's better to know because you can do something about it. Situations as described in previous replies you can't, so those 'in the know' have no more control over the situation than those who are ignorant of it or those who are aware but don't care.

But you can though, you can use cash instead of card or digital currency in the future. You can make an informed decision not to bother with the virtue signalling which is a 'green' electric car. These are only a couple of things that the public have control over if they want. If enough people know how it really is they could make the government sit up and listen.

 

[Prajna]

But what have you changed? That was/is my question, and it's a genuine question. I'm not trying to prove a point, or indeed to prove/disprove what you say.

And it's a perfectly reasonable question, @Cato. Most of the changes are in the way I live because I know who I am and therefore I don't have to conform with someone else's idea (or ideology) of who I am and how I should behave. I haven't changed 'the system' but I am no longer ruled by it and generally live in peace. There are a number of policemen who do their jobs differently (better, more conscienciously and more compassionately) or who have left the police to grow organic vegetables, and a high court bailiff who now understands the mortgage fraud and now only attends evictions to make sure his boss doesn't overstep the law. Then there are a number of individuals who are now well on the way to finding their own freedom. A good answer to your question would require a book to give context and details and even then you would have to relearn quite a few fundamental things that you have been taught that are quite wrong. As I said, the question is a good one, but it is not easy to answer well.

 

[DAPPH]

Call me a conspiracy theorist if you want but couple digital IDs with cashless, the net zero, ULEZ etc... And it really seems the authorities are hell bent on getting as much control as possible over tax paying law abiding citizens. We've had a glimpse of this new world during covid in my opinion, laws can be passed overnight, freedoms removed with hours notice, and many people not only went along but actively encouraged it. It's pretty scary really where things are heading.

So would this digital system stop cash being illegally used if it was only through a digital ID and a central bank that you could buy & sell . The black economy and dark web trading must be worth nearly as much as the declared and paid tax things these days .

 

[pedrobedro]

The system has successfully got people to buy lower polluting cars.

Forced people to buy lower polluting cars ?

 

[Pigeon_Droppings2]

Sounds wonderful to me....

No need to restrict your purchase at checkout...we've already traced your digital I'd and digital currency and we've concluded you've already had your 2 tomato ration for today therefore out auto checkout has rejected your purchase attempt automatically.

...why stop at tomatoes...sky is the limit.

 

[DAPPH]

But planes were flying in and out unchecked weeks, months, after the initial 'lockdown'. A mate of mine flew into the UK, from China, mid lockdown, with absolutely no health checks or test or mask, only a printed handout waffling about 'if you have a fever' or some such drivel.

Same guy flew to Spain and back a couple of times over the following months, again, NO health or PPE on the plane or in the airport.

Too little, too late, when it did come, as all those in power were busy making a killing on crony contracts to focus on the finer details of their 'covid' safety policies.

The main thing of the lock down was to slow the spread & flatten the peaks of likely infection in the UK so hospitals had a chance to cope .

Without the lockdowns I have a very strong feeling that we as a country would have been absolutely slaughtered with the disease and its variants.
We wouldn't have lost just a lot of old folk like happened we'd have had massive fatal losses in the working population . .


Having fowl pest in your chicken farms comes to mind , we usually cull millions of sick chickens in locked down areas in the hope that it will slow down elsewhere due to reduced transmission paths .

 

[DAPPH]

This highlights and just strengthens my belief that all the things we are discussing aren't done solely for the good of the public. I realise there'll always be isolated incidents within any system but some of the things that happened were farcical. I also believe the reasons given for various measures (previously covid but currently I'm thinking particularly net zero and climate change here) aren't exactly genuine, as it all seems to be about money!! You can drive any car, if you pay, fly anywhere, if you pay, use as much plastic, if you pay etc...! Due to past and current contradiction by those in charge I simply don't believe them when they claim something is an "emergency" or "crisis". How does the air quality improve if I pay £12.50 for the same journey that was free last month? .

After paying throught the nose with your ever decreasing purchasing power ,you find a cheaper less polluting ways of getting around . You make the decision as to if you can afford it as you now are, the government just gives you a nudge to make you think better perhaps .
The bigger picture of less pollution , better health & an industrial renewal in a stagnant economy is sometimes quite outside of a lot of peoples vision & thinking capabilities .

 

[Prajna]

But what are the consequences if you are wrong ? What if this new legislation is genuinely trying to fix the issues with the older ID system? What if these attempts to stop the progress of technology stop us being able to deliver better services to people, or stop attempts to reduce costs and alleviate our financial issues? What if our small island, which lacks industrial might and resources, needs to be a technology innovator instead? Encouraging conspiracies causes people to have mis-trust of governments and academics and encourages pre-science thinking. Look at how the QAnon and election conspiracy in the US lead to an attempted insurrection. Conspiracies are dangerous, not to mention that they are a rabbit hole that mess with lives and peoples mental health (Reddit QAnon Casualties is an entire sub devoted to helping the families of conspiracy theorists and is a sad read).

If I am wrong, @rcx132, then the worst that can happen is what you suggested; perhaps I slow down the introduction of some legislation that may help. If I am right then there is a chance that I help to prevent a very distopian future for mankind. I'm pretty damned sure I'm right since those who are planning to remove all our freedoms and turn the vast majority of people into serfs have published what they intend to do and how they intend to do it. Of course the language the use tends to be innocuous and ambiguous and some of the material is not easily available but they do admit it. For example, the introduction to Bernays' book Propaganda states the following:

"The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country. We are governed, our minds are molded, our tastes formed, our ideas suggested, largely by men we have never heard of."

Bernays is not offering a theory here, he is describing what he is involved in and admitting who he is: part of the invisible government.

By the way, searching 'tavistock institute' rather than 'tavistock conspiracy' does bring up a wiki page for it, albeit that it is factually incorrect on a number of points and omits many important details. It doesn't even list Bernays or Mead as involved, though the certainly were. Better to read Bernays' Propaganda and Crystalizing Public Opinion. Something else that is mentioned on the wiki page is that the TI was involved with polling organisations, but they fail to point out that the TI actually set up Gallop and a number of other polling organisations and that the purpose of polls is not to garner public opinion but to form it.

 

[Prajna]

After paying throught the nose with your ever decreasing purchasing power ,you find a cheaper less polluting ways of getting around . You make the decision as to if you can afford it as you now are, the government just gives you a nudge to make you think better perhaps .
The bigger picture of less pollution , better health & an industrial renewal in a stagnant economy is sometimes quite outside of a lot of peoples vision & thinking capabilities .

@DAPPH, the 15 biggest ships in the world produce more sulfur oxide, nitrogen oxide and CO2 than all the cars on the road. Something makes me think they are nudging the wrong person.

As to 'nudging', the uk government actually employs an outfit called the Nudge Unit, also called the Behavioural Insights Team. They suggest that the purpose is to help the government to develop policy that will change people's behaviour but they use subliminal programming and emotional blackmail to do so. How do you feel about that?

 

[CornishPete]

cheaper less polluting way of getting around

My biggest bugbear is that nothing greener is ever cheaper. Everyone would rather be less polluting but it is such a regressive policy. If you can afford 50k for an ev, you can enjoy 250 miles for £15 of electric, no road tax, no ULEZ charges, and god knows what they'll come up with next. If you can only afford a 500 quid banger you're absolutely rinsed. This is the first time that new technology has been adopted that isn't better than the existing technology it replaces. I'm not saying EVs aren't better, but overall, including infrastructure, it's not anywhere near yet.
Much like vegan sausages.

 

[Dessieb2022]

@DAPPH, the 15 biggest ships in the world produce more sulfur oxide, nitrogen oxide and CO2 than all the cars on the road. Something makes me think they are nudging the wrong person.

As to 'nudging', the uk government actually employs an outfit called the Nudge Unit, also called the Behavioural Insights Team. They suggest that the purpose is to help the government to develop policy that will change people's behaviour but they use subliminal programming and emotional blackmail to do so. How do you feel about that?

Then there is the 77th brigade that try to swing public opinion one way or the other on social media...

 

[Prajna]

Then there is the 77th brigade that try to swing public opinion one way or the other on social media...

Not to mention Unit 8200 in Israel.