Apprentices

[armalites]

Sadly most young people get tarred with the same brush and personally I think it's many of the people who have that opinion are the ones who have bred this generation who think they don't need to work.

My eldest is 15 and he has a Saturday morning job that pays pretty well but he does stuff for a couple of other people. He spent time Saturday and Sunday last week washing lorries. It was cold and wet and he got £10 for each one and was well chuffed with the £40. He does work for another couple and they pay him almost minimum adult wage because he works so hard when he's there. He also cuts up pallets to sell as kindling. He is a grafter and he sees the benefits and rewards as at the ripe old age of 15 he owns 3 Land Rovers and recently bought a Fordson Major.

Both our kids are teenagers and they get £2 pocket money which is this day and age seems laughable compared to friends who get £10-15 a week. Ours are expected to empty the dishwasher,sort the rubbish and recycling to get theirs.

I get totally fed up with people saying "It's hard for kids these days" it's no harder than it was a generation a go the only difference is so many kids get to the point where they are 20 and have never done a days work. Mummy and Daddy bought/insured the car because it's so hard,pay for their phone, helped them through 3 years of Uni to get a job that pays £18K that they could have got with no exam results at all

My eldest wants to be a tree surgeon and I'm sure he'll do just fine, he's totally convinced he's going to be driving his Fordson to school when he's 16 but he could probably cycle faster, when I was at school everyone wanted a nifty fifty

 

[angellonewolf]

my sons doing bricklaying stright from 16 going collage 1 day 4 days on site

its a win win for you both if they work out you gets cheaper help but spends a bit of your time showing him what to do

over time he gets good and helps you out for the next 2 years at the end you end up with an employee that gets going rate that works your way

 

[Migmac]

Sadly most young people get tarred with the same brush and personally I think it's many of the people who have that opinion are the ones who have bred this generation who think they don't need to work.

My eldest is 15 and he has a Saturday morning job that pays pretty well but he does stuff for a couple of other people. He spent time Saturday and Sunday last week washing lorries. It was cold and wet and he got £10 for each one and was well chuffed with the £40. He does work for another couple and they pay him almost minimum adult wage because he works so hard when he's there. He also cuts up pallets to sell as kindling. He is a grafter and he sees the benefits and rewards as at the ripe old age of 15 he owns 3 Land Rovers and recently bought a Fordson Major.

Both our kids are teenagers and they get £2 pocket money which is this day and age seems laughable compared to friends who get £10-15 a week. Ours are expected to empty the dishwasher,sort the rubbish and recycling to get theirs.

I get totally fed up with people saying "It's hard for kids these days" it's no harder than it was a generation a go the only difference is so many kids get to the point where they are 20 and have never done a days work. Mummy and Daddy bought/insured the car because it's so hard,pay for their phone, helped them through 3 years of Uni to get a job that pays £18K that they could have got with no exam results at all

My eldest wants to be a tree surgeon and I'm sure he'll do just fine, he's totally convinced he's going to be driving his Fordson to school when he's 16 but he could probably cycle faster, when I was at school everyone wanted a nifty fifty

Your to good, my kids don’t get pocket. My daughter works in a bakers shop, hard work pays off. They upped her hourly rate because she grafts and can find stuff do do rather than stand around chatting. My youngest gets the odd bit of work from the window cleaner. He’s got a summer and after school job that he doesn’t know about yet I have arranged it for him!

 

[Kayos]

I'm having a meeting next week, find out what the score is

My liability insurance is up for renewal next month so will be seeing what adding employers to it will cost me, if it's a fortune I won't bother

 

[knighty]

I keep saying if you get the right young people they're really good... but....

one I thought was good has been a bit unreliable lately, missed a few days, late back from lunch etc.. he text me last night he's leaving... he wanted to come in this morning get a full weeks pay and then leave... his mother has told him he's entitled to holiday pay so he wants 28 days holiday pay too.... he's only worked for me for 3 months... and he owes me £550 I lent him a couple of weeks back

he said his mother is going to go see a solicitor if I don't pay him "what he's due"

he insisted he's come in today and get this weeks pay + 28 days holiday pay... and then come back tomorrow with the £550 he owes.... must think I'm an idiot :-o

 

[maz0]

I keep saying if you get the right young people they're really good... but....

one I thought was good has been a bit unreliable lately, missed a few days, late back from lunch etc.. he text me last night he's leaving... he wanted to come in this morning get a full weeks pay and then leave... his mother has told him he's entitled to holiday pay so he wants 28 days holiday pay too.... he's only worked for me for 3 months... and he owes me £550 I lent him a couple of weeks back

he said his mother is going to go see a solicitor if I don't pay him "what he's due"

he insisted he's come in today and get this weeks pay + 28 days holiday pay... and then come back tomorrow with the £550 he owes.... must think I'm an idiot :-o

It's idiots like that who ruin it all for everyone, I just hope you don't deny another decent kid the opportunity in future, however I would totally understand if you did, you can only take so much of that crap. Also if he worked for 3 months full time and his holidays are pro-rata hes due 6.4 days holiday, his mums a dreamer.

 

[gaz1]

what do you expect you lent him 550 dont lend that amount in any case

 

[knighty]

It's idiots like that who ruin it all for everyone, I just hope you don't deny another decent kid the opportunity in future, however I would totally understand if you did, you can only take so much of that crap. Also if he worked for 3 months full time and his holidays are pro-rata hes due 6.4 days holiday, his mums a dreamer.

6.4 days... minus the 6 days off he had over christmas/new year :-o

what do you expect you lent him 550 don't lend that amount in any case

I've known him for quite a while, he used to date a delivery drivers daughter and used to go help with deliveries if the driver needed a hand, not just some random kid off the street... it was more but he was paying some back each week

the guys who have been here a decent amount of time are the total opposite... the only time anyone has time off sick is when everyone else tells them to go home... and then most argue against it (they're still getting full pay either way)... work comes in and has to be done that day... so if someone is off everyone else has to do their share of work (we already do too many hours)

 

[Revs1972]

The first year, he doesnt seem overly interested, so ive not seen many people helping him, he tends to be put in a corner and forgotten.

He sounds like someone needs to take him under their wing and show him the ropes properly. I was quite shy as an apprentice ( drafty), luckily we were each given a mentor who taught us the ins and outs.
Mine was an ex fabricator so he knew everyone on the shop floor and through him I was introduced to some great guys who remain good friends. I think the fact that I mucked in with most things , from scraping spatter off of welds before painting, to pulling bolts out from the stores helped. Some of the other office apprentices in my year were a bit up themselves, and it was obvious they were not liked. Little things like the welders striking an arc just as they were walking past to make them jump. (They would wait for me to pass before starting) In turn , I showed the younger workshop apprentices how to read drawings properly, and would be helpful wherever I could.
I think your comment about being put in a corner and forgotten is the key thing here. Find out why he is there, was it because he had nothing else available to him, or does he have a genuine interest in what he is doing. If no one is showing him properly , and he is too intimidated etc to ask then both parties may be missing an opportunity.

 

[mccp]

he said his mother is going to go see a solicitor if I don't pay him "what he's due"

There isn't anything a solicitor can do other than write you a threatening letter, which you should probably just bin. Under two years continuous employment you don't have many rights other than racial/sexual discrimination.

Paid holiday can include bank holidays as long as you are paid for them. Your problem is most likely the £550. He probably doesn't have it to pay you back and unless you have something written down, you might struggle even with the courts. I'd be tempted to try and get him to talk about the money he owes you in a text or email, and then tell him you'll take him to the small claims court unless he coughs up.

(This is not legal advice )

 

[Revs1972]

It's idiots like that who ruin it all for everyone, I just hope you don't deny another decent kid the opportunity in future, however I would totally understand if you did, you can only take so much of that crap. Also if he worked for 3 months full time and his holidays are pro-rata hes due 6.4 days holiday, his mums a dreamer.

Sounds like one of these world owes you a living types

 

[slim_boy_fat]

Sounds like one of these world owes you a living types

Or, at least, Mummy does.

 

[fizzy]

We had a new starter - aged 28 - after about 4 days he didn't turn up - then his mother rang to say he had a bad tummy. Then we get an email off him saying he was quitting and don't attempt to contact me or I will sue you for harassment!

Even worse another new starter didn't show - said his sister had been injured in the Ariana Grande bombing in Manchester. We were so sympathetic - until one of the girls in the office realised she was friends with his sister - no truth in it at all - how can someone lie about something like that?

 

[Kayos]

I'm going to college today, will hopefully know what I'm doing then

 

[bump]

We have apprentices at our place (Software development and IT Operations) I was on the recent interview panel for their progressing onto junior levels and actually It made me proud to see how much they had learnt during their apprenticeships and had put into practice. We do pair programming for pretty much everything so they get to ask a lot of questions and understand what is being done and why. I also mentor junior members of staff.

Yes there are youth out there that are lazy and not interested, but there is the same in every generation.

 

[gaz1]

I'm going to college today, will hopefully know what I'm doing then

kayos remember theres 2 different types at college school levers doing there coarse and adults doing a coarse you need to know which one

the one day a week could possibly mean the adult side of it

 

[Kayos]

kayos remember theres 2 different types at college school levers doing there coarse and adults doing a coarse you need to know which one

the one day a week could possibly mean the adult side of it

They are in college 3 days a week, I've been told they are 16-18

 

[Cyberprog]

We have apprentices at our place (Software development and IT Operations) I was on the recent interview panel for their progressing onto junior levels and actually It made me proud to see how much they had learnt during their apprenticeships and had put into practice. We do pair programming for pretty much everything so they get to ask a lot of questions and understand what is being done and why. I also mentor junior members of staff.

Yes there are youth out there that are lazy and not interested, but there is the same in every generation.

We're in a similar boat - ours are brought in on the Ops side not dev side though. First two we've had (around 23ish) - one is brilliant, quiet and studious and quickly passed his apprenticeship and was employed as a fully functioning team member within about 9-10months. The other is a stoner who struggles to remember a single thing you teach him. He's taken longer - so long they had to extend his apprenticeship, and after passing got caught drug driving after going out on a bender to celebrate! I think he has been offered a 12mo contract, and told to pull his trousers up and sort his **** out - I think he'll be riding a bike in once his court date comes round!

So to replace those two we've taken three more on - two are younger at about 19 who have gone into the ops side, and both are bright. We have one in our team (infra) and the other is with the app team. Our lad is OK, getting him into the swing of things - but he's keen to make us think he understands stuff when in fact, he does not. We keep having to tell him to ask if he doesn't understand!

The other lad is *very* quiet, had to take him with me from bristol to manchester the other week and it was hard work! Wound up just blasting music to keep myself awake on the way back! (This being the sum total of all the time I've spent with him!)

 

[bump]

We're in a similar boat - ours are brought in on the Ops side not dev side though. First two we've had (around 23ish) - one is brilliant, quiet and studious and quickly passed his apprenticeship and was employed as a fully functioning team member within about 9-10months. The other is a stoner who struggles to remember a single thing you teach him. He's taken longer - so long they had to extend his apprenticeship, and after passing got caught drug driving after going out on a bender to celebrate! I think he has been offered a 12mo contract, and told to pull his trousers up and sort his **** out - I think he'll be riding a bike in once his court date comes round!

So to replace those two we've taken three more on - two are younger at about 19 who have gone into the ops side, and both are bright. We have one in our team (infra) and the other is with the app team. Our lad is OK, getting him into the swing of things - but he's keen to make us think he understands stuff when in fact, he does not. We keep having to tell him to ask if he doesn't understand!

The other lad is *very* quiet, had to take him with me from bristol to manchester the other week and it was hard work! Wound up just blasting music to keep myself awake on the way back! (This being the sum total of all the time I've spent with him!)

We make ours cover both sides, as we are infra as code, CI/CD pipelines etc and an apprentice can't be sure which path they will go down if they haven't tried both. One of the questions was explain how a browser requests something from a server, one of the apprentices said I'll make it harder by requesting something served via TLS, which he got spot on including the SYN, EST, FIN, and ACK, he then extended it with websocket upgrades.

Are you pairing with your apprentices? We do that and switch the driver every 40 mins or so.

 

[Cyberprog]

We make ours cover both sides, as we are infra as code, CI/CD pipelines etc and an apprentice can't be sure which path they will go down if they haven't tried both. One of the questions was explain how a browser requests something from a server, one of the apprentices said I'll make it harder by requesting something served via TLS, which he got spot on including the SYN, EST, FIN, and ACK, he then extended it with websocket upgrades.

Are you pairing with your apprentices? We do that and switch the driver every 40 mins or so.

No, the Dev side of the business isn't the main part of the business - we're doing VOIP call centre systems. So they start off in application generally to get that stuff under their belt (understanding genesys) and then move on through support to whatever they want to do. The dev team took on a young chap recently straight from sixth form after he performed really well on a work experience placement!

We don't do pairing in a structured way, but he sits at the same desk as myself and my two team members, and we make up the infra support team, and then the rest of the infra consultants sit opposite us.