Another towing question, limits for pre 1997 licenses

[Robotstar5]

Some of it is a bit weird too.

Like I have D1E, which is "Vehicles with up to 16 passenger seats plus driver with trailer over 750kg, if combined trailer and vehicle weight isn't over 12,000kg". D1 has to have more than 8 passenger seats.

But, I have additional code 119, which is "119 - weight limit for vehicle does not apply".

So, my C1E which has 107 (not more than 8250kg) could be outdone by D1E which theoretically has no weight limit, just so long as the towing vehicle has between 8 and 16 passenger seats and I'm not driving for hire/reward (101)...


So, double decker bus with 10 seats reclassified as a minibus and put a trailer on?

If it's over 30 years old you can drive a double decker with all it's seats on a Cat B licence - link

 

[CompoSimmonite]

When I moved house, in 1982, I hired a furniture wagon sized lorry. The intentiton was just to get something with a tail lift but that was all the hirer could offer with such a lift. I was told it needed a Class II HGV however due to me only moving my own personal belongings the law allowed me to legally drive it. It had a tacho that I had to use as well as air brakes. I assume this was the same "loophole" in the law that allows people to drive their own double decker bus or huge motorhome ?

 

[Justme]

Not read all the posts yet but will jump in replying to the OP.

That Gov web page is WRONG.

The 8250kg limit is for a C1E 107 NOT a BE.

BE pre 19-01-2013 is 3500kg vehicle & UNLIMITED trailer weight.

BE post 19-01-2013 is 3500kg vehicle & 3500kg trailer.

 

[Justme]

What are the current laws on driving something heavier than 7.5tons on a car licence?
I knew a few people who drove converted coaches as motorhomes back in the 90s. And there used to be a get out enabling you to drive an artic as a mobile exhibition unit.
The thing is an HGV licence is just that - heavy goods. People used to be able to re register something privately.
Reason I ask is I fancy building an expedition motor home using a 4x4 or 6x6 lorry chassis - probably ex military.

Loop hole closed.

Motorhomes are rated by weight same as all other vehicles now.


There are some exemptions look up INF52

 

[Justme]

I went to the Gov.uk website https://www.gov.uk/view-driving-licence entered my driver number and it tells me exactly what my entitlement is:

My friend with a pre-1997 license did the same and it also shows 7000kg (3500kg car + 3500kg trailer).

Not sure about PDG's explanation, if PDG has a C1E then I would have thought that allows him much more than 8250kg.

Your friends info is wrong DVLA know its wrong (I told them months ago) the official reply is that its wrong but they have not date for getting the service to up date the view a licence details.

 

[Justme]

This was the reply

Thank you for your enquiry received on 31/3/2017.
Your case reference number is #######.

I can confirm that it is an issue we are aware of and are looking to get this issue resolved for all drivers.

I am afraid we do not have timescales for when this will be resolved at present.

I can only apologise for any inconvenience this has caused.

 

[fizzy]

Loop hole closed.

Motorhomes are rated by weight same as all other vehicles now.


There are some exemptions look up INF52

Typical they would!

 

[Robotstar5]

Loop hole closed.

Motorhomes are rated by weight same as all other vehicles now.


There are some exemptions look up INF52

Link to INF52 in post #30

 

[fizzy]

Link to INF52 in post #30

Some very grey areas there!

Any engineering equipment (vehicles designed or built for the
purpose of engineering work), except mobile cranes.

So that means if I mount a small lathe in the back I can drive what I like!

And

Mobile project vehicles. A vehicle which has a
Maximum Authorised Mass (MAM) exceeding 3.5 tonnes,
whose primary purpose is to be used as a recreational,
educational or instructional facility when stationary, carrying:
- mainly goods or burden consisting of play or
educational equipment and articles required in
connection with the use of such equipment, or
- articles required for the purpose of display or of
an exhibition.

If I carry a few canoes I can drive what I like - well it is recreational

Perhaps carrying a lathe that you are prepared to teach people how to use you would be covered by BOTH categories???

 

[rcx132]

Good stuff Richard. Though practically speaking are there many cat B cars that can tow more than 3500 kg? Plus don't you need special trailers above 3500kg?

The .gov used to have a big omission on its towing page as well that I noticed but they've fixed that now.

I've also noticed that they've put up a section about towing with dolly's which clears that up as there used to be tons of bloodshed on forums over that topic as well.

 

[normspanners]

But a cat C licence is for a goods vehicle - there used to be a way or registering it as a car.

yes you can alter a class seven or a truck as a class 4 but that doesnt mean you can drive it on a car license .

To drive a motorhome with a MAM of between 3.5 and 7.5 tonnes, you need a category C1 licence.

To drive a motorhome with a MAM of over 7.5 tonnes, you need a category C licence.

As is stated here------ you still need the correct license, my mate had let his c1 lapse coz over 70, then realised his MH was 3700kg !! so had to reapply to get it back.

 

[normspanners]

had independent brakes fitted,

close coupled brakes is the wording .

 

[Olderisbetter]

This is all good info but the Polish licence i got just says "Drive" so i can drive an artic with no experience yes?

 

[Justme]

Good stuff Richard. Though practically speaking are there many cat B cars that can tow more than 3500 kg? Plus don't you need special trailers above 3500kg?

The .gov used to have a big omission on its towing page as well that I noticed but they've fixed that now.

I've also noticed that they've put up a section about towing with dolly's which clears that up as there used to be tons of bloodshed on forums over that topic as well.

Not many are rated to over 3500kg. The older landrovers were. But you need active brakes.

Remember that the GTW is real weight so I (with a pre 19-01-2013 BE) could have a mondeo capable of towing say 2000kg but tow a 5000kg plated trailer with a real weight of 1900kg & be ok if it has active brakes.

 

[KemppiFrog]

Been a while since I built trailers commercially, but part of the 3500kg is the limit on 50mm ball hitches? Over that, one needs a hook, or other type.
My mother had one of the old licences from '37 and could (& did) drive all types, including tank transporters, though mostly ambulances in WW11.

A friend bought a double decker bus for peanuts, re-registered it as private and drove down to Iberia on his ordinary licence. 'Times past' and quite rightly so.

 

[Cobbler]

A friend bought a double decker bus for peanuts, re-registered it as private and drove down to Iberia on his ordinary licence. 'Times past' and quite rightly so.

Not Cliff was it, off on his "Summer Holiday"

 

[KemppiFrog]

Not Cliff was it, off on his "Summer Holiday"

Very good!
Though the bus was parked for quite a while about 10km from Cliffie's house. Last big job I did down there was the cooling system on his winery. Nice bloke, but dreadfull wine
KF

 

[Wendelspanswick]

A chap I know has an AEC Matador timber tractor which he has registered as a Showmans vehicle and he drives on an ordinary, pre 97, car licence. Not sure how legal he is but he has been driving it for 30 years.

 

[normspanners]

This is all good info but the Polish licence i got just says "Drive" so i can drive an artic with no experience yes?

woman I know went to south africa to live and had a south african license, when she came back few years ago she applied for a british license and got EVERTHING up to artic class 1 even motor bike and had never driven or ridden any of them either, only a car.
And I dont think she is that good in that !!!

 

[rcx132]

woman I know went to south africa to live and had a south african license, when she came back few years ago she applied for a british license and got EVERTHING up to artic class 1 even motor bike and had never driven or ridden any of them either, only a car.
And I dont think she is that good in that !!!

Was this a long time ago now? I read the rules for exchanging licenses because I was going to do my C class in another EU country, and they are not that generous any more about exchanging licenses.