Advice on how to form these pressings ?

[B1N9S]

As the title says. Can anyone advise on how to tackle this ? Not the whole bulkhead, I have a plan, kind of !!! Just how to make the pressings in the steel section. I am a DIYer, so not in the trade at all and have limited metalwork tools and .....ahem........knowledge !! But I'm a keen learner ;-)

The steel is 1.5mm for a bulkhead repair section.

The UGLY !!!



Removed the section.






This is my first draft piece !!! But I can't replicate the pressings !! Help wanted.

 

[cumbriasteve]

With minimal gear available I would probably make a die and former out of flat/square bar stock, heat the steel and press it in the vice.

I would do the pressing before I cut the shape out, this would allow me to remove any distortion and not worry about the external sizes differing.

 

[harryb94]

Have a look at Tony bmw's thread on retro ride on panel making, he shows how to do repair panels like that by hand! I've also seen a thread of I think a couple of Malaysians(?) making repair panels for a vw camper with some hammers and a few bits of bar, impressive stuff!

Edit: here's a link
http://retrorides.proboards.com/thread/70135/panels?page=1#

 

[mike 109444]

When you make a panel like that you need to allow a GOOD excess around the edge as when you form the steps the metal will need to come from somewhere and will pull in from ALL the edges. It is possible to use dull chisels and blocks of wood. If you use a stiff card or thick paper to make a template including the formed shapes it will give you a better ideal of what need to give and take.
There is a very good post somewhere of some chaps in the Philippines hand crafting panels for a VW bus using not much more that grooves in concrete and the dull chisels. ! Perhaps some one might post a link

 

[244t]

Wooden former..


would it be an idea to form the "ribs" on a sheet of ply, say 18mm thick, this could be done with a router or simply with a chisel then pealing away the veneers of wood away to make the required depth of the rib...

the former could then be used beneath the steel sheet , perhaps clamp it on firstly


Just an idea, not tried this method.... someone else may have other methods / ideas

 

[harryb94]

When you make a panel like that you need to allow a GOOD excess around the edge as when you form the steps the metal will need to come from somewhere and will pull in from ALL the edges. It is possible to use dull chisels and blocks of wood. If you use a stiff card or thick paper to make a template including the formed shapes it will give you a better ideal of what need to give and take.
There is a very good post somewhere of some chaps in the Philippines hand crafting panels for a VW bus using not much more that grooves in concrete and the dull chisels. ! Perhaps some one might post a link

That's the vw I was thinking of!

 

[mike 109444]

This was formed from 2mm thick (had to use a bigger hammer !)
Tool made from some lengths of bar and gap of vice used to hammer shape into steel.
Don't try to form full depth in one go, just work your way along.
Try to keep sharp edges off any forming tools or they may cut the metal.

 

[mike 109444]

And welded in

 

[B1N9S]

Thanks to everyone, for the advice. Mike 109444, that looks great. I did have a thought about using wood to make a channel, I'll give it a go. Good idea about not cutting out the final shape until afterwards too ;-)

I don't have access to a full on heat set up, but I do have a propane blow torch, is it worth heating the metal first ? And if, so, how much heat do I give it ?

Cheers guys.

 

[B1N9S]

With minimal gear available I would probably make a die and former out of flat/square bar stock, heat the steel and press it in the vice.

I would do the pressing before I cut the shape out, this would allow me to remove any distortion and not worry about the external sizes differing.

Hi Steve, I like this idea, but what material would I use to make the die/former ? And how much heat should I apply ? Sorry, I'm a bit new to metalwork, but am loving it.

 

[colnerov]

There is a very good post somewhere of some chaps in the Philippines hand crafting panels for a VW bus using not much more that grooves in concrete and the dull chisels. ! Perhaps some one might post a link

Hi, I used to have the link to that but when I went to look again last year I found the site is gone. If I can find the link again I will see if it's come back.

Colin

Edit: I/ve found the link and this is where it ends up, if anyone in VW circles knows anymore about if it's archived anywhere do tell. -

http://www.vwrides.com/viewtopic.ph...&start=0&sid=f5d04393cac2392d17710c3daa7ed95c

Colin

 

[Master-of-none]

Wayback machine -internet archive
http://web.archive.org/web/20090728...&start=0&sid=e94e541b5e4271eafded97960c1e8211

 

[ronan]

 

[cumbriasteve]

Hi Steve, I like this idea, but what material would I use to make the die/former ? And how much heat should I apply ? Sorry, I'm a bit new to metalwork, but am loving it.

If I was doing it in my workshop I have all sorts of offcuts of flat and square bar, I would select the one's closest to the shape itself and then get the right profile with a grinder, finally polishing with a flap wheel.

Basically you get the internal former an exact fit and the external former to fit over it with an allowance for the steel thickness.

Heat the steel to cherry red and it will press in one go.

If you are new to metalwork then it may be a bit more of a challenge and it's probably something I would spend a lot of time to do and get right simply because I have the time and like the challenge.

 

[colnerov]

Wayback machine -internet archive
http://web.archive.org/web/20090728...&start=0&sid=e94e541b5e4271eafded97960c1e8211

Hi, Brilliant!! thank you. Bookmarked. I will have another read of this at the weekend.

Colin

 

[mike 109444]

I have not found heating to be any advantage and if you look at the vw bus thread I think they did not use heat. Just gradually working the shape in should do it.

 

[mike 109444]

Tool shape you may need, see pic. Note does not need to be to wide as will take more drive (bigger hammer !) to force shape. Remove sharpe corners from where arrowed.

 

[B1N9S]

Cheers Mike, very helpful mate. I had a little play last night, but I wasn't fully committed. That's the trouble with having the workshop about 10ft from the house !!! It's warmer in the house and there's a kettle in there !!!

I was having a look at the overall job though and I had a quick look and am thinking it might be better to make the whole panel in one piece. Would be a bit more difficult, but would be a much nicer job. So I now thinking about MDF as a die to work to. I really need to give it some thought.

If I get anywhere, I'll post up some pics. Thanks for all the help so far guys. Really appreciate it.

 

[mike 109444]

You do need something solid to work the metal over/on. If you looked at the guy from the Philippines you will see in some of the pis that he is using a short length of rail track as an anvil. I use a block of steel 2" thick and a stout vice. Sourcing something similar should be high on your list of items. I would suggest an anvil but as you may have seen in other members posts they can be hard to find (in usable condition) Maybe locate a scrap yard as some have found them or similar there.

 

[mike 109444]

If you do go for replacing the whole panel then you will need to brace across the inner wing (?) and the bulkhead (?) basically bridging the gap that you have created by removing that section as it may move and twist. Remember most of it will be spot welded in as it was built on a production line. If you go for inserting a piece then it should be possible to get a virtual invisible joint and blend it in. A lot of the metal around it looks good.
What car is it !!! ???