DVLA and insurance

[Newlands]

I had a penalty notice from DVLA last month for not having my 1979 Leyland 154 insured. It was taxed (£0 because it's an old tractor). I didn't know it was actually an offense to have a vehicle that was taxed but not insured, unless of course it's driven or parked in the road, but apparently it is. I thought that I'd just forgotten to renew the insurance, so I rang the company to check and they said it was insured, I'd paid the premium and they emailed me a copy of the documents as confirmation.

I duly appealed the penalty using the DVLA form, gave them the policy details, and they've come back saying my appeal is dismissed, and threatening further action, because they can't confirm the details with the Motor Insurance Database (MID).

So I phoned DVLA up, in itself an ordeal to actually get a human to speak to. I offered them the phone number of the broker so they could confirm directly with them that I'm insured, but they refused to do that, not giving me a reason, just a point blank refusal. I offered to email them my copies of the insurance details, but again this was refused. This is a pathetic response. I'm now waiting for a letter of indemnity from the insurance company (sent via the insurance broker of course) which I will have to print out and send by snail mail to Swansea. What a completely pathetic outfit DVLA are - refusing to talk directly to an insurance broker, refusing to use emails and refusing to acknowledge the details I had previously sent them, when they have every facility to do all of those things. And worst of all assuming I am guilty of an offense without bothering to check simple facts first.

As a footnote I've just googled the MID (an outfit I'd never heard of before all this) and found I can check my insurance status. It says I'm insured, so I'm now about to ring DVLA again to tell them to check the MID themselves properly.

 

[badabec]

Vehicles don't need insurance if kept on private property.
Are you sure this is from the DVLA? Where did you get the DVLA phone number?

 

[rtcosic]

Vehicles don't need insurance if kept on private property.
Are you sure this is from the DVLA? Where did you get the DVLA phone number?

They do, or you must declare SORN or 'de-register' the vehicle. The requirement for continuous insurance was imposed ages ago.

Of course, it has not reduced the incidence of uninsured vehicles on the road..................

 

[Greeves246]

Vehicles don't need insurance if kept on private property.
Are you sure this is from the DVLA? Where did you get the DVLA phone number?

If it is on the DVLA database it has to be taxed or on SORN and as Newlands says if it is taxed it must be insured. I have a 400/4 that is £0 tax as it is historic but is insured, the Bantam I had was not insured so was on SORN. In his case I would keep a record of all conversations and let them take me to court where a magistrate would dismiss the case.

 

[ajlelectronics]

Vehicles don't need insurance if kept on private property.
Are you sure this is from the DVLA? Where did you get the DVLA phone number?

If taxed (even no cost) then yes you do under the new rules.

 

[premmington]

Sorn it - if zero tax it has to have continuous insurance.

We get caught in the trade with this - not adding vehicles to MID

 

[badabec]

Well that bit of legislation passed by me un-noticed. I didn't even hear the whooshing sound that deadlines make.

Mine are SORNed, must be why. I have off road insurance in case they are stolen etc.

I also assumed the Leyland was SORNed.

 

[gaz1]

They do, or you must declare SORN or 'de-register' the vehicle. The requirement for continuous insurance was imposed ages ago.

Of course, it has not reduced the incidence of uninsured vehicles on the road..................

that requirement was the biggest con going by the industry

all for the money men at best

to top that off came the we will scrap any vehicle weather on private property or not if its not registered

the only people it affects are the honest ones it dosnt affect criminals

 

[daedalusminos]

My take on this is if you're 100% certain you're innocent and can prove it then it's up to them to prove you're guilty. Obviously start gathering all data/Comms, record phone calls etc.

 

[RWD3M]

I had a penalty notice from DVLA last month for not having my 1979 Leyland 154 insured. It was taxed (£0 because it's an old tractor). I didn't know it was actually an offense to have a vehicle that was taxed but not insured, unless of course it's driven or parked in the road, but apparently it is. I thought that I'd just forgotten to renew the insurance, so I rang the company to check and they said it was insured, I'd paid the premium and they emailed me a copy of the documents as confirmation.

I duly appealed the penalty using the DVLA form, gave them the policy details, and they've come back saying my appeal is dismissed, and threatening further action, because they can't confirm the details with the Motor Insurance Database (MID).

So I phoned DVLA up, in itself an ordeal to actually get a human to speak to. I offered them the phone number of the broker so they could confirm directly with them that I'm insured, but they refused to do that, not giving me a reason, just a point blank refusal. I offered to email them my copies of the insurance details, but again this was refused. This is a pathetic response. I'm now waiting for a letter of indemnity from the insurance company (sent via the insurance broker of course) which I will have to print out and send by snail mail to Swansea. What a completely pathetic outfit DVLA are - refusing to talk directly to an insurance broker, refusing to use emails and refusing to acknowledge the details I had previously sent them, when they have every facility to do all of those things. And worst of all assuming I am guilty of an offense without bothering to check simple facts first.

As a footnote I've just googled the MID (an outfit I'd never heard of before all this) and found I can check my insurance status. It says I'm insured, so I'm now about to ring DVLA again to tell them to check the MID themselves properly.

I think I'd politely tell them to sue me and see them in court.

 

[premmington]

that requirement was the biggest con going by the industry

all for the money men at best

to top that off came the we will scrap any vehicle weather on private property or not if its not registered

the only people it affects are the honest ones it dosnt affect criminals

Easy money - insuring vehicles that are not driven on the road.

 

[Greeves246]

A few years ago I had to go to the DVLA office at Old Trafford Manchester to register and tax bikes weekly and it was a regular occurrence to hear someone complaining that they had been fined for not having road tax when they weren’t using it even though it was parked on the road. Another common one was Asian blokes saying they wanted to tax a car but didn’t have a log book and would pay cash. Basically they wouldn’t have anything with their name and address on it so they couldn’t be traced.
Problem for me was at the end of a month you could only register or tax five at a time, any more and you had to go to the back of the queue for the rest. Car dealers would send several blokes down to stand in line, sometimes the queue was out the door and round the back of the building.

 

[Newlands]

An update - I rang DVLA again (25 minute wait in a queue) and of course you can't get to speak to someone in the enforcement department, so ended up in the payments department. To be fair, he did actually listen and not put the phone down on me. I asked why no-one at DVLA had bothered to check the MID - no answer. Asked why they don't use email in 2025 so I could send proof of insurance documents - no answer. asked why they didn't make the effort to phone my insurance broker - no answer. The conversation came to an end when I told him to make a note on my case file saying that I expected a letter of apology and confirm that the allegations they have made are false and no action would be taken against me.
It usually takes a lot to annoy me, but we're paying handsomely for these clowns to make a mess of a simple job.

 

[Matchless]

I recently had a letter about my MGA being taxed but not insured, I taxed it a few months ago just encase the DVLA kicked off because I had not taxed it for the last 20 or so years, the tax application online went ok, I checked with my broker, Haggertys and found that because I had it on 0 miles cover it did not go on the MID, so it was insured but for 0 miles, I wonder what a judge would have said if the DVLA took me to court, does the legislation state that a vehicle must be insured or that it must be on the MID or what....................

 

[dobbslc]

Depends how long your test drive was

 

[Ton-up]

As you have found out, the DVLA is the biggest bunch of useless tossers I have ever come across.....

I believe they are the only organisation (including parliament) that can make legally binding laws by themselves. (please tell me if I am wrong)

 

[Bobtail4x4]

An update - I rang DVLA again (25 minute wait in a queue) and of course you can't get to speak to someone in the enforcement department, so ended up in the payments department. To be fair, he did actually listen and not put the phone down on me. I asked why no-one at DVLA had bothered to check the MID - no answer. Asked why they don't use email in 2025 so I could send proof of insurance documents - no answer. asked why they didn't make the effort to phone my insurance broker - no answer. The conversation came to an end when I told him to make a note on my case file saying that I expected a letter of apology and confirm that the allegations they have made are false and no action would be taken against me.
It usually takes a lot to annoy me, but we're paying handsomely for these clowns to make a mess of a simple job.

speak to your MP, they love this sort of thing, and the more complaints they have the better chance of DVLA getting sorted out.

 

[gaz1]

An update - I rang DVLA again (25 minute wait in a queue) and of course you can't get to speak to someone in the enforcement department, so ended up in the payments department. To be fair, he did actually listen and not put the phone down on me. I asked why no-one at DVLA had bothered to check the MID - no answer. Asked why they don't use email in 2025 so I could send proof of insurance documents - no answer. asked why they didn't make the effort to phone my insurance broker - no answer. The conversation came to an end when I told him to make a note on my case file saying that I expected a letter of apology and confirm that the allegations they have made are false and no action would be taken against me.
It usually takes a lot to annoy me, but we're paying handsomely for these clowns to make a mess of a simple job.

so basically you got no where

and it cost you a phonecall and time for nothing

all they will do is just send another letter and soon after you will be taken to court

it truly makes a mockery out of digital by default when they dont use it themselves

 

[Smallfry]

speak to your MP, they love this sort of thing, and the more complaints they have the better chance of DVLA getting sorted out.

Talking of useless tossers ............

 

[Bravheart]

Been caught out by this as well. Thing is you only get so many days to actually get the vehicle insured after registering ownership. In the O P s case it might be worth checking to see when the insurance started especially when you used a broker as you may be insured now but the transaction might have gone through after the DVLA grace period.

Edit. Or everyone would be rushing to insure their vehicles as soon as the letter arrives and claiming its insured.

Edit. Edit. The DVLA letter probably isn't sent till a set number of days after the grace period ends. They will then assume anyone claiming it's insured is trying to pull a fast one and won't listen.