Garden irrigation: would you risk fitting a motorised valve in an outdoor cabinet?

[Gareth J]

Fresh water will destroy the valve

I've had some 4" ones go, the water basically wears through a weak spot

Can you elaborate? I've just installed a 2" one to control gravity flow from one tank to another. Only ever a maximum of 2-3m head between them. Is it the flowrate through the tiny gap that happens as the valve closes that wears them?

 

[bricol]

i bet it dont go in to hanging baskets on the wall though

Depends if your wall has a roof or not . . .

 

[waddycall]

I think you’d want a solenoid rather than a motorised valve.

 

[brightspark]

get a few of these https://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/sole...rtADFJCABuv5bu-dt6QaAuXiEALw_wcB&gclsrc=aw.ds

 

[Kayos]

Can you elaborate? I've just installed a 2" one to control gravity flow from one tank to another. Only ever a maximum of 2-3m head between them. Is it the flowrate through the tiny gap that happens as the valve closes that wears them?

It's the fresh water and the flow rate. Destroys the brass

 

[123hotchef]

We put some tanks in on one job that harvested both grey and rainwater, also had low level top up via the water mains. Nothing wasted on that one.

Bob

I thought about harvesting all my rain water to water the garden with plenty of space under the house its just how long does it take to pay for itself

 

[brightspark]

I thought about harvesting all my rain water to water the garden with plenty of space under the house its just how long does it take to pay for itself

if u can pick up some good big plastic tanks up cheap its well worth doing if u are on a water meter .you can also use it on your bog

 

[Gareth J]

It's the fresh water and the flow rate. Destroys the brass

Hopefully mine will be ok, with such low pressure, the super high velocities at just open/closed shouldn't occur. Not sure why brass would corrode with fresh water, suspect it depends on local water pH and ingredients. The water chaps who installed it recommended a motorised valve over a solenoid as they find them more reliable. I know the solenoids we do have, have a lifespan.

 

[brightspark]

fresh water corrodes the copper zinc and tin in the brass probably takes ages anyhow

 

[Kayos]

Hopefully mine will be ok, with such low pressure, the super high velocities at just open/closed shouldn't occur. Not sure why brass would corrode with fresh water, suspect it depends on local water pH and ingredients. The water chaps who installed it recommended a motorised valve over a solenoid as they find them more reliable. I know the solenoids we do have, have a lifespan.

It's the dissolved oxygen in the water, known as aggressive water

 

[not done it yet]

Our washing machines etc have worked fine with solenoid valves for years on end. I used a couple for timed irrigation in my glass house some years ago. Worked pretty good, at minimal cost (back then).

60W 24/7 would soon break my bank! I didn’t generally use that much to heat/dehumidify my workshop to avoid condensation in the depths of winter (generally 0.75 units per day).

My intention is to parallel up a few water butts and flush the loo with rainwater. Leccy, even at 25p/unit for the pump, is far cheaper than metered water - so pay-back time would not be so long. It would much reduce the water bills as an awful lot of water usage is just poured down the loo.

 

[Gareth J]

It's the dissolved oxygen in the water, known as aggressive water

Thanks, did a bit of googling; suggests that dissolved CO2 rather than O2 (hence an acidic water) that's the cause of aggressive water/corrosive water.

I know that ours, if the PH treatment gets neglected, will start and finish eating through copper, and recently even a couple of stainless water heaters, which isn't ideal. But it's still cheaper than mains.

 

[not done it yet]

will start and finish eating through copper,

Are nearly all domestic water pipes not Copper? Not been a problem for the last 70 years or so?

Copper replaced a lot of lead pipes (which did slowly dissolve in some water supplies). Copper has been used for kitchen utensils for centuries without much trouble (it will dissolve in strongly acidic conditions) but is otherwise very unreactive) - and it is likely as toxic, when dissolved and ingested, as lead, even though I think we need a tiny amount of copper (but not lead) in our food intake.

 

[DAPPH]

Our washing machines etc have worked fine with solenoid valves for years on end. I used a couple for timed irrigation in my glass house some years ago. Worked pretty good, at minimal cost (back then).

60W 24/7 would soon break my bank! I didn’t generally use that much to heat/dehumidify my workshop to avoid condensation in the depths of winter (generally 0.75 units per day).

My intention is to parallel up a few water butts and flush the loo with rainwater. Leccy, even at 25p/unit for the pump, is far cheaper than metered water - so pay-back time would not be so long. It would much reduce the water bills as an awful lot of water usage is just poured down the loo.

Depending on the size of the header tank and style of toilet outlet , put a knotted poly bag of water or frozen then heat sealed food bags of water if you have a sealer and some of the stronger bags ( they'll thaw nicely in the tank ) of water in the toilet header tank to fill the void a bit so you use less water . You only need around 2.5 litres for the successful flushing of most turds & paper , occasionally two flushes or an extra small bucket of water if needed . Experiment and see what's the minimum you can usually get away with .

 

[DAPPH]

Our washing machines etc have worked fine with solenoid valves for years on end. I used a couple for timed irrigation in my glass house some years ago. Worked pretty good, at minimal cost (back then).

60W 24/7 would soon break my bank! I didn’t generally use that much to heat/dehumidify my workshop to avoid condensation in the depths of winter (generally 0.75 units per day).

My intention is to parallel up a few water butts and flush the loo with rainwater. Leccy, even at 25p/unit for the pump, is far cheaper than metered water - so pay-back time would not be so long. It would much reduce the water bills as an awful lot of water usage is just poured down the loo.

Is gravity fed rain water possible to the toilets ?

 

[Gareth J]

Are nearly all domestic water pipes not Copper? Not been a problem for the last 70 years or so?

Copper replaced a lot of lead pipes (which did slowly dissolve in some water supplies). Copper has been used for kitchen utensils for centuries without much trouble (it will dissolve in strongly acidic conditions) but is otherwise very unreactive) - and it is likely as toxic, when dissolved and ingested, as lead, even though I think we need a tiny amount of copper (but not lead) in our food intake.

Ours is a private water supply. Two sources; well and bore hole. Testing suggests the well comes out with fewer minerals to filter out (manganese and iron) than the bore hole but a low pH. Not a lot, but obviously enough.

 

[not done it yet]

Is gravity fed rain water possible to the toilets ?

A lot of mains water-supply loos are gravity fed. Ours is not - it has a mains high pressure ball valve - but once the rain water is lifted (or collected) above the loo cistern, there is no reason why gravity can’t then be used to supply the loo via a low pressure ball valve. Rain water is not so much different than the mains supply in that respect - except that it can be free, once the collection is arranged.

 

[not done it yet]

Depending on the size of the header tank and style of toilet outlet , put a knotted poly bag of water or frozen then heat sealed food bags of water if you have a sealer and some of the stronger bags ( they'll thaw nicely in the tank ) of water in the toilet header tank to fill the void a bit so you use less water . You only need around 2.5 litres for the successful flushing of most turds & paper , occasionally two flushes or an extra small bucket of water if needed . Experiment and see what's the minimum you can usually get away with .

Irelevant to my post. Rain water is free from supplier or government taxes. Volume to flush the loo is not something to really worry about if sufficient rainfall can be collected - and if it’s not, the roof tank can be topped up from the mains supply - just like any gravity fed dystem would be now.

Common house brick(s) could be used to reduce the effective volume of the cistern, if deemed necessary (an alternative may be adjusting the ball valve control height, depent on the shape of the cistern.

 

[8ob]

I thought about harvesting all my rain water to water the garden with plenty of space under the house its just how long does it take to pay for itself

It doesn’t need to be complicated, only problem I can envisage with tanks in a basement is configuring/engineering in an overfill or overflow system. Easy in a garden when overflow from buried harvesting tanks just run into the soak away which is where it was all destined for anyway.

Bob

 

[Gareth J]

if sufficient rainfall can be collected - and if it’s not, the roof tank can be topped up from the mains supply

Ideal solution.

But you must be careful about topping up with the mains, there must be an overflow at a lower point than the mains entry to the header tank. So, float switches and solenoids, or a specialist "long" ball valve. No just putting a mains ball valve 4" from the bottom of the header tank. I know in a domestic situation they probably won't find out but if they do, they won't like it at all.