Solar power on roofs - more viable with energy price hikes?

[puffernutter]

Are there any nationwide installers or what do I look for in terms of qualifications, trade associations etc., for an installer?

Cheers

Peter

 

[DAPPH]

I was looking in to this at the weekend as I'm contemplating an electric car...

I'd need 16 x 400 W panels (Samsung something or other) feeding 2 x Tesla battery banks (3 would be better) to give me enough range to get to work and back. I calculated it would be around 6.5 year payback in diesel savings alone at today's prices.

I didn't adjust for weekends and used the average number of daylight hours in my calculations.

I think in reality the payback would be sooner given the rising price of fuel.

Latest Tesla offers around 360 mile or so ,


I understand that it's now legal to charge up your own batteries an have them wired by a protected inverter to give you 240 volts for car charging . When the Tesla man came to see me I don't think the legislation was place.

 

[DAPPH]

Similar here, there's actually two separate 4kW arrays. It's hard to directly compare them for a number of reasons but despite the shallower pitched ones having a number of benefits, the steeper ones produce more, and more importantly, more useful electric than the shallower ones.

In a no tarriff situation, without decent storage, it's worth considering and East West array.

I met a guy who saaid he had 24 paanels tied to 4.2 Kwhr
He reckoned that having the bigger array meant he'd be able to generate the 4.2 easier & quicker than the 16 panel set up's . I you can afford it , it sounds a good idea ......over produce in poor conditions and it can always be trimmed down to the allowed level .

 

[addjunkie]

I met a guy who saaid he had 24 paanels tied to 4.2 Kwhr
He reckoned that having the bigger array meant he'd be able to generate the 4.2 easier & quicker than the 16 panel set up's . I you can afford it , it sounds a good idea ......over produce in poor conditions and it can always be trimmed down to the allowed level .

4 kw is whats accepted as the normal output your DNO thinks their kit can take.
A guy up the road from us has all his barn roofs covered, think 4 cattle sheds 120 ft long and a wind turbine. All feeding him and the grid. But when it was installed the cable supplying his place was upgraded as the original install wasn't man enough.

 

[Mr Fro]

Latest Tesla offers around 360 mile or so ,


I understand that it's now legal to charge up your own batteries an have them wired by a protected inverter to give you 240 volts for car charging . When the Tesla man came to see me I don't think the legislation was place.

I haven't really looked at legislation as it's just theoretical pondering at the moment.

Have you seen the Lucid Air? Stated range is 390 miles.

 

[Tangledfeet]

We had them installed when we bought our bungalow almost nine years ago and had considerable work done; large roof area south facing - we broke even a year or two ago.

Haven't seen him post much recently (like me; work and life just getting in the way!) but @HughF lives off-grid.

 

[gaz1]

there was talk that owners of solar was going to pay extra for the times when they needed the energy themselves

feed in tariffs

Solar Export Guarantee to replace Feed In Tariff

** UPDATE May 1st. Octopus Energy have launched the UK's first Export Tariff. Read all the details here. ** When the Feed in Tariff finishes end of March, some of the excess electric generated by your solar energy array will inevitably go back to the grid. At the moment there's no mechanism to...

nakedsolar.co.uk

found a quick reference to it

You could soon be charged a fee if you want to sell your solar power to the grid

Thousands of Australian households have installed solar panels to save on power bills – but a controversial proposal that would enable energy companies to charge solar panel owners to export their own electricity could flip the current status quo.

www.abc.net.au

ive seen the uk version of the above but cant find it on a quick search for now

 

[Domdom]

The bit I don’t understand is this exporting. I know if the panels generate more than is being used there will be an excess, but how does this go back into the grid? Is it just the case that the meter runs backwards?

 

[Gareth J]

The bit I don’t understand is this exporting. I know if the panels generate more than is being used there will be an excess, but how does this go back into the grid? Is it just the case that the meter runs backwards?

If you're lucky enough to have an old clockwork meter, they do! (Apparently). Say nothing and get some panels up asap! Modern meters just stand still. The grid gets your excess FOC. You can get inverters that limit export, which the DNO specify you have to use sometimes.

 

[striker]

The bit I don’t understand is this exporting. I know if the panels generate more than is being used there will be an excess, but how does this go back into the grid? Is it just the case that the meter runs backwards?

You get paid the export Allowance as a percentage of total generated. Even if you use all you generate. You also get the feed in tariff even if you use all you generate.
I was in early, so I get around 60p per kWh generated plus export tariff. My set up (4kw) was around 12.5k installed at the time. We get payments from EDF four times a year. Usually amounting to around £1800 a year tax free. It's index linked and payment guaranteed for 25 years.
Even at such an expensive installation cost, it's one of the best investments we've ever made.
I'm not sure what the feed in tariff is now for new installs, I've heard around 9p per kWh, but the installation costs have more than halved. So probs not the investment it was, but still ok I would think.
Hope this helps.

 

[striker]

Just to add to the above, we save around £20 a month on our bills.

 

[Gareth J]

You get paid the export Allowance as a percentage of total generated. Even if you use all you generate. You also get the feed in tariff even if you use all you generate.
I was in early, so I get around 60p per kWh generated plus export tariff. My set up (4kw) was around 12.5k installed at the time. We get payments from EDF four times a year. Usually amounting to around £1800 a year tax free. It's index linked and payment guaranteed for 25 years.
Even at such an expensive installation cost, it's one of the best investments we've ever made.
I'm not sure what the feed in tariff is now for new installs, I've heard around 9p per kWh, but the installation costs have more than halved. So probs not the investment it was, but still ok I would think.
Hope this helps.

Solar FiTs have stopped. Now you get no FiT and no deemed export (unless I'm mistaken on the last bit?). It's all about using it yourself. Hard, but not impossible, to do

 

[vbottles]

Bought a bungalow 6 years ago already fitted with two sets of panels. Currently receive 14p per kilowatt. Has a 4kw inverter but has never produced more than 2. 7kw.
If I move one set of solar panels to a better location does this affect my fit? Any ideas how to work out effiency for shadows/trees comparing winter and summer.
Think previous owner spent £4.5k installing panels. Had a visit from installers just after we moved in selling battery bank. Wanted £8k for power storage. Insisted that no power went to grid as power only flows like water pipes. I'm not great with electricity but knew that's a lie.
Andrew

 

[minimutly]

You get paid the export Allowance as a percentage of total generated. Even if you use all you generate. You also get the feed in tariff even if you use all you generate.
I was in early, so I get around 60p per kWh generated plus export tariff. My set up (4kw) was around 12.5k installed at the time. We get payments from EDF four times a year. Usually amounting to around £1800 a year tax free. It's index linked and payment guaranteed for 25 years.
Even at such an expensive installation cost, it's one of the best investments we've ever made.
I'm not sure what the feed in tariff is now for new installs, I've heard around 9p per kWh, but the installation costs have more than halved. So probs not the investment it was, but still ok I would think.
Hope this helps.

You’re a bit behind....
Read the above - feed in tariff closed over a year ago.
You can get paid for all your export - around 3 to 5p was the going rate, but you have meter data collecting charges to pay for usually (massive con since your meter data is being collected anyway if you’re on smart meter).

 

[striker]

I may be a bit behind, but I know for definite I get around £1800 a year, and it's index linked and gauranteed for 25yrs from the installation date. Maybe fit has stopped for new installations?

 

[Gareth J]

Bought a bungalow 6 years ago already fitted with two sets of panels. Currently receive 14p per kilowatt. Has a 4kw inverter but has never produced more than 2. 7kw.
If I move one set of solar panels to a better location does this affect my fit? Any ideas how to work out effiency for shadows/trees comparing winter and summer.
Think previous owner spent £4.5k installing panels. Had a visit from installers just after we moved in selling battery bank. Wanted £8k for power storage. Insisted that no power went to grid as power only flows like water pipes. I'm not great with electricity but knew that's a lie.
Andrew

Are the to sets of panels either side of the roof? What direction/s do they face? Total kW of the two separate panels? A max of 2.7kW sounds a bit rubbish but hard to tell without knowing about the setup.

Regarding shading, the panels will be wired in series in groups or "strings". Shading one panel in a string badly affects the rest. Think someone else mentioned it above. Micro inverters help out with that, but it's a bit late for that now.

I read about what you can and can't do to an existing setup but I'm afraid I can't remember the details and I can't remember where! It's worth checking if you can find the right place to consult but I feel the answer might be no, no modifications.

8K of batteries would, unless you were heating a swimming pool or something, still see some juice go to grid on long summer days when you'll just never need the total output of the panels. Do you have a hot water cylinder and diverter already?

 

[Gareth J]

I may be a bit behind, but I know for definite I get around £1800 a year, and it's index linked and gauranteed for 25yrs from the installation date. Maybe fit has stopped for new installations?

FiT has stopped for new installs.

 

[vbottles]

Hi,
Basically I have about 14 panels on a southern roof and 8 on an easterly roof. Was thinking of moving to a westerly or onto flat roof extension recently put in?
Cons of moving is how it affects fit second there is no obvious place that has good sun in winter. Also worried that securing to flat roof will damage fibreglass roof?
Probably will do nothing as any spare cash is going to be needed to pay power bills.
Andrew

 

[Gareth J]

Hi,
Basically I have about 14 panels on a southern roof and 8 on an easterly roof. Was thinking of moving to a westerly or onto flat roof extension recently put in?
Cons of moving is how it affects fit second there is no obvious place that has good sun in winter. Also worried that securing to flat roof will damage fibreglass roof?
Probably will do nothing as any spare cash is going to be needed to pay power bills.
Andrew

Would focus on double checking everything is setup and working as it ought to as a starting point. A peak of 2.7kW from a south facing array of ~3.5kw sounds like something is amiss.

 

[minimutly]

All the guestimates of energy output can be sourced from the net. You need to provide location direction the panels face and the angle they will be installed at. Panel output (efficiency), any shading and the type of inverter will make small adjustments to the expected average annual leccy production.

My advice is to avoid the temptation of free panel installation with a contract for the income (they do still exist, I think). Think what happens if/when you might want to move house. That could/would/should cost you thousands off your selling price!

Always get several quotes. Not all companies are truthful, many have gone bust to start up again afresh, so no long term guarantees for them to fulfil. Some may promise far more output than available in reality.

Leccy costs will only rise. You need to be able to work out the practical pay-back period - dont just trust the installer salesperson!

3.68kW is the normal current allowance to be fed into the grid from a single phase property. Permission may be available for more than that at the discretion of the utility.

There are options to consider - like battery storage. Would you use the leccy yourself, if it is not stored. Are you envisaging a battery electric car in the future is yet another thing to consider.

On top of all that, do remember that solar likely produces 8 times as much leccy in the summer than during the winter months. Yearly outputs are not always the best way to plan a system.

What about hot water? Solar thermal panels, while only harvesting heat energy, might be better than using higher grade energy for that purpose, although solar PV panels are relatively cheap, these days, and leccy is a high grade energy source.

No to the last bit - solar leccy, fed into a bit of kit that feeds an immersion heater has got to be better than water pipes, and steaming antifreeze in your loft....
Don't do it.