addjunkie
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Nah, pellet prices are climbing in line with timber.
- Thread starter Lazurus
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Kayos
Gone......
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10 years when the installer registers it, I do it on an app before I leave the house
Ashley Burton
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I would go for a decent Combi Boiler
Conventional non combi boiler with a 3.8kW solar pv system - you will have free hot water in the summer (and on clear winter days), free sunday roasts, washing etc, plus the option (when the designers get their act together) of connecting a modern controllable storage heater or two. You will need a shower pump though.
Modern conventional with a well insulated tank is on a par with combi - factor in the pv as well and you'll wonder why you even asked.
Gas or oil its up to you - oil is generally cheaper, plus you can do your own maintenance if you're that way inclined.
Modern conventional with a well insulated tank is on a par with combi - factor in the pv as well and you'll wonder why you even asked.
Gas or oil its up to you - oil is generally cheaper, plus you can do your own maintenance if you're that way inclined.
brightspark
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my mate fitted one in his house after 2 years it jacked in and they had stopped making them so he changed to an oil boiler
Gareth J
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Friend of mine in a bungalow draws hot air from a vent above the woodburner, through the loft and over to the furthest bedroom. Helps circulate heat and is pretty effective in a bungalow. Just a thought.
Pretty good option imo. You can get older type storage heaters to charge up in excess PV easily enough. Annoying to have to put up with them but easier if it's free to run.
Something I've often wondered, especially appropriate in a small, well insulated bungalow, is how the economics of going all electric, with hot wire ufh would be. Sensibly controlled and linked to one of the super off peak tarriffs, plus as much PV as you can throw at it, installation and maintenance costs would be pretty low. Running costs in winter would be high, but offset with a decent woodburner.
Pretty good option imo. You can get older type storage heaters to charge up in excess PV easily enough. Annoying to have to put up with them but easier if it's free to run.
Something I've often wondered, especially appropriate in a small, well insulated bungalow, is how the economics of going all electric, with hot wire ufh would be. Sensibly controlled and linked to one of the super off peak tarriffs, plus as much PV as you can throw at it, installation and maintenance costs would be pretty low. Running costs in winter would be high, but offset with a decent woodburner.
Kayos
Gone......
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A full house of electric underfloor heating would be horrendously expensive
It costs 3 to 5 times more to heat something with electric than gas or oil
dobbslc
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I've just replumbed the entire house myself over the last year, we had an old (40+ years) oil boiler in the utility room that got replaced with a new Grant external one including all new oil pipes, filters, fire guard and plumbing to get the flow and return pipes up to the loft (chalets bungalow) along with a Magna flow filter, new valves, controls etc. 5K for that lot not including any of the new internal pipework or rads etc 
I used copper pipes in the eaves for the main flow and return pipes to the upstairs rads and coiled copper pipe (Kuterlex 25 meter coils) downstairs as I'm worried about leaks under the still to be fitted solid wood flooring and possibly mice chewing through anything plastic!
The downstairs rads are plumbed into two sets of Emmiti manifolds so I have no joints under the floor to leak. The system is pressurised.
Pic of one of the manifolds ^ it's not finished yet as there is still one more rad to plumb in, and that's part of the beauty of this system as I can have what I need up and running without having to finish everything at once!
I have a cylinder in the "tank room" and a pumped shower system as any electric ones are crap in comparison! Immersion heater as back up.
We had to use the immersion last summer as the old boiler was ripped out and it cost a fortune to run! Don't go electric unless it's a new house with massive amounts of insulation!
I've got a Wiser smart controller that seems pretty good so far but I've still not fitted the thermostatic rad valves!
I'm eventually going to replace the cylinder with a bigger one and will probably get one with the extra coils for solar heating if I install it in the future.
I used copper pipes in the eaves for the main flow and return pipes to the upstairs rads and coiled copper pipe (Kuterlex 25 meter coils) downstairs as I'm worried about leaks under the still to be fitted solid wood flooring and possibly mice chewing through anything plastic!
The downstairs rads are plumbed into two sets of Emmiti manifolds so I have no joints under the floor to leak. The system is pressurised.
Pic of one of the manifolds ^ it's not finished yet as there is still one more rad to plumb in, and that's part of the beauty of this system as I can have what I need up and running without having to finish everything at once!
I have a cylinder in the "tank room" and a pumped shower system as any electric ones are crap in comparison! Immersion heater as back up.
We had to use the immersion last summer as the old boiler was ripped out and it cost a fortune to run! Don't go electric unless it's a new house with massive amounts of insulation!
I've got a Wiser smart controller that seems pretty good so far but I've still not fitted the thermostatic rad valves!
I'm eventually going to replace the cylinder with a bigger one and will probably get one with the extra coils for solar heating if I install it in the future.
Gareth J
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I get that but I think that there might be a point at which (in terms of amount of kWh required) the extra cost per unit is cancelled out by the lower cost of installation/maintenance.
So yes, obviously a leaky mansion won't be heated with resistive heaters, but at some point, in terms of kWh requirement, it might make sense?
A small, well insulated bungalow, with a woodburner might be approaching that point...? Haven't done a back if the envelope calc but suspect that it would depend a lot on if you could do the bulk of winter heating with wood.
Kayos
Gone......
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I've done full calculations, heat loss, U values, expected usage etc and it's honestly not worth it.
If, and it's a big if, battery storage becomes viable with solar PV that may change but at the minute it's no
Heat pumps are the (expensive) answer in a properly insulated property, full wet ufh and solar PV to top the thermal store up. Budget £15k for a small bungalow for a basic system
gaz1
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one has been done with a rocket stove via a large well insulated place in canada just over one loggers cord (48 inches x 48 inches x 96 inches)(128 cubic feet) burnt red and white oak.
winter is from late November to march 26 in canada
size of building, 2000 square ft shop 44 ft x 44 ft if squared off
shop is a stick built, insulated 2"x6" walls 10 ft. high, finished inside, double pain windows and insulated over head doors the ceiling has blown insulation R40. So this is close to new house building standards.
wood usage
7am stove first loading last 6 hours (three pieces) second load 1-2 pieces lasts me another 6 hours. That is a normal day for me. So now my fire goes out at say 7PM and I come out next morning at 7 AM and do it again.
previous years wood usage less as learnt his system
Normally in years past I would burn 4-5 logger's cords of wood (4ft.x4ft.x8ft.is a loggers cord). This year I burn't a little under 2 cords.
This second year I started burning my rocket stove daily on November 1 and I am still burning it march 8th but starting this week I am only burning it for 4 hours in the morning (one loading) to knock the chill off. Yesterday in Minnesota it got up to 60 F in the afternoon. I burn my stove from 7am to 7pm. So 12 hours of burning 7 days a week.
just over one loggers cord (48 inches x 48 inches x 96 inches)(128 cubic feet) burnt red and white oak.
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Gareth J
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Fair enough, I haven't looked into anything in detail.
What's made me feel it might be possible is my own experience; a decent sized 3bed cottage with only a woodburner at one end and oil Rayburn at the other. No insulation other than the loft. 4kw of panels.
From now until ~october the Rayburn is off and the PV does just about all the hw, a lot of electric and some heat. We end up spending an average of ~£1 a day of electric on top.
We use ~8000kwh of oil over the winter. I was thinking, if that could be slimmed down, due to a better insulated house and subsidised with one of the super off peak/agile tarriffs and as much direct heat as practicable done with logs, it wouldn't seem too crazy.
Am currently considering options to refit this cottage but none are jumping out at me as a brilliant way forward.
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I had a similar dilema a few years ago. Being all electric in our village and no mains gas for 4/5 miles.
Next choices came down to either oil or LPG, nowhere really for a proper oil tank install without it looking hideous, couldnt be doing with clattering gas cylinders about and having to keep ordering...siting a boiler was a pain too, so I went all electric.
Hot water via an unvented cylinder, supplying 2 bathrooms. Shower is reasonable.
Heating, is a wet radiator system just like any other boiler type setup, but uses a Heatrae Sadia Amptec boiler . The usual radiators with TRVs/timers ec.
The Upstairs bathroom has electric UFH and independent elec towel rail. Kitchen has plinth heater.
Suplementary log burner in the living room, which only really gets lit for a cosy evening now and then.
Its been in 2 years now, no issues, no maintainence. Keeps the house warm.
Its a 4 bed detached bungalow of reasonable dimensions (with loft conversion)
Next choices came down to either oil or LPG, nowhere really for a proper oil tank install without it looking hideous, couldnt be doing with clattering gas cylinders about and having to keep ordering...siting a boiler was a pain too, so I went all electric.
Hot water via an unvented cylinder, supplying 2 bathrooms. Shower is reasonable.
Heating, is a wet radiator system just like any other boiler type setup, but uses a Heatrae Sadia Amptec boiler . The usual radiators with TRVs/timers ec.
The Upstairs bathroom has electric UFH and independent elec towel rail. Kitchen has plinth heater.
Suplementary log burner in the living room, which only really gets lit for a cosy evening now and then.
Its been in 2 years now, no issues, no maintainence. Keeps the house warm.
Its a 4 bed detached bungalow of reasonable dimensions (with loft conversion)
And you couldn't fit a solar PV? (Obviously not everyone can - it needs a roof orientated the right way).
Morrisman
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Holy thread resurrection Batman...
but, could you give a rough idea what your electric bills are in the winter? I’m in the same dilema you were, no mains gas to our village, and after tentative inquiries I have been advised that fitting a buried bulk lpg tank is not viable unless I use more than 20 x 47 kg bottles a year, as it costs around £3k+ for the install.However, I don’t want to be stuck changing those bottles out and humping and heaving every two weeks every winter, as I approach the Autumn of my days....
Electric would seem a simple clean alternative, as we already have a fairly modern central heating system in place, with the boiler taking up valuable real estate on the wall in my garage. Mine is a simple 30 year old, 2 bed bungalow.
The Artilleryman
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Underground gas tank? We have either oil or calor gas round our way (nearest gas main 6 miles) all are above ground tanks and yes some are in front gardens due to new rules - as opposed to the rules in place when our bungalow was built (1992), hope I never have to replace the oil tank.
Lazurus
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We are running at £40 per week for everything, that includes two women working from home with the assocaited washing machine and tumble dryer running every day, cooking lighting, water heating. The bungalow holds at a pleasant 18.5c and nothing to change refill or carry. There have been at least three other installations in our village after ours so it must be getting popular.
Lazurus
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If you have a suitable system it keeps the installation cost down, you will need a new style very very insulated water tank. We used engenera for our system, can recommend them as suppliers and installers.Holy thread resurrection Batman...
However, I don’t want to be stuck changing those bottles out and humping and heaving every two weeks every winter, as I approach the Autumn of my days....
Electric would seem a simple clean alternative, as we already have a fairly modern central heating system in place, with the boiler taking up valuable real estate on the wall in my garage. Mine is a simple 30 year old, 2 bed bungalow.
