soluble cutting fluid alternatives?

[Gareth J]

I'm fed up with the cutting fluid in things (particularly the lathe) that don't get used too often separating out and being useless when you come to use it again. Not such an issue on the more regularly use saw but still annoying. Currently trying to pump out the tank and keep it in a gallon drum so I can shake it up before use.

Have I just got rubbish fluid? (Smith and Allen branded)

What alternatives might there be to try that won't deteriorate if stood for a while? But still thin enough to pump. Some oil thinned with kerosene?

 

[Munkul]

I've been using Morris Supercut 1000 for years now in my saw, no issues with seperation and sometimes it will sit for a few weeks.

Only issues come with having no biocide in it, in fact I'm going to add some soon cos it's gone a bit stinky recently.

 

[frank horton]

I use Q8 with no probs and often my lathe sits for a month or so.....
Then I just turn the pump on (separate switch / feed) to stir it up a bit.....
Then it goes back to milk after 5 mins.......
BUT
I bought an as new Myford S7 lathe and a Myford VMF mill and no way it the milk going near em....
So will use the norm 46 hydraulic oil instead...
Have a couple of gall's of cutting oil left so when it's gone all the other machines will Cleaned out and get hydr oil as well....
The last 5gall drum of Q8 was nearly £180.
But u do get rust for free..?

 

[grim_d]

Odd. I use Smith and Allen fluid, or rather it sits in the tank and doesn't get used.

I think it was in for two years and and I only used it maybe 3 times, I checked it fairly often though with no separation, bacterial growth, odd smells or nastiness.

Little bit of neat cutting oil floating on the top but certainly I was very, very impressed with how it survived after all the horror stories of soluble oil going nasty and the sludge that was in the sump of my mill when I got it.

Is it sabresol? Bad batch?

 

[Gareth J]

Not sure what S&A put in it. It mixes fine but left for months settles out again. Not a surprise really but if I can use something else, particularly on the lathe, I will.

Very light hydraulic oil could be a goer, thanks. I'll see if it'll pump ok. I don't know a lot about the requirements for a coolant/lubricant but guess it's just that - the water is great at keeping stuff cool. Whether a simple oil would provide decent cooling properties or not....?

 

[Munkul]

I've been using Morris Supercut 1000 for years now in my saw, no issues with separation and sometimes it will sit for a few weeks.

Only issues come with having no biocide in it, in fact I'm going to add some soon cos it's gone a bit stinky recently.

Started a new job last night with the saw, and refreshed the coolant, and put a very small amount of FAM30 disinfectant in it, now any farmer knows this stuff kills just about anything and everything smells fine for now!

At work they use Morris supercut 6000, it says it has good bio resistance but they use it at a decent rate so smell/crud doesn't really build up even if it would.

 

[Theblackbox]

Depends how strong your pump is you could use non soluble cutting oils (not to be confused with neat oils that you’d drip on) little bit thicker than soluble usually used in cnc lathes I cant remember a good brand.

Also solubles aren’t equal I had a similar problem to you kept separating and going bad I changed I’ll have a look what to! Got given some stuff really stinks and is very oily when made up seems to work great sadly couldn’t say what it is as it came to me in a bucket!

 

[northwest]

I went down a rabbit hole with this a couple of years back (and recently revisited it last year with the CNC Mill).
I am not an expert but I have stuck my hand in my pocket and bought quite a number of "solutions", no pun intended. By far the best, by a margin, was the Blaser Swisslube. As long as you did not actually touch anything. This was the sticking point, literally. It was as sticky as hell and made everything else sticky to the touch. Without this I would use it on everything bar the big mill, I no longer use it because of this. Because my workshop is small I just cannot use soluble oil on the big Mill, too much mess so I bought one of these FOGBUSTER. By the time I had paid import duty it was a bit eye watering but then I bought the cutting fluid that goes through it, remember, this is a total loss system, eye watering just doesn't quite cover it and once it has gone I will probably baulk at buying more ROCOL Accu-Lube LB5000

On the lathe (M300) I use neat cutting oil, Castrol Care Cut ES2. I cleaned out the tank and removed as much trace of Mystic as I could and filled it with this. I bought it from Broughton who offer a superb service by the way. I would possibly try this in the Fog Buster when the Rocol stuff runs out, remember the LB 5000 is about two hundred quid a gallon, this is around £130 for about four gallons. Bit of a difference there.
This works well for me on the type of work I do, difficult materials, usually quite hard, and Ally (7075 usually) so two extremes and it still works, I also use it in a high pressure feed system while reaming and it is just great for this. It certainly helps cutter life.

So, I had harmony with the oils, sort of Feng Shui in the lubricants cupboard. Then I put the CNC Mill in and started again. As I said above, the Blaser Swisslube was the Mutts, looked as if I was using just water. But it started taking the paint off all the castings (apparently it is known for this) and some months later I am still finding pockets of "sticky". After speaking to @Hood about the problem he recommended I speak to Exol lubricants, which I did. They were aware of the Blaser's shortcomings and approached the issue from a machinist angle as they work with industry every day. I bought a drum of Excelfluid LFDX which is a semi synthetic soluble cutting oil and it is not listed on their site as it is a bit specialist, you need to ask for it, can't remember how much it was but the next bit is the important bit: DO NOT just sling a load of tap water in there, you need de-ionised water at the very least, distilled is the best.

The biggest single issue with soluble oils comes from the dilution with ordinary tap water, de-ionised water is a pound for 21/2 litres at tesco, for steam irons, and this is bacteria free and calcium free water. I buy a 25 litre drum from a local chemical supplier as I use it in the screen wash and so on so always handy and it is not much.

 

[Brad93]

Always used ROCOL Soluble on the drill and RTD drip fed or brushed on the lathe.

I may put soluble on the lathe. Or maybe something a bit thicker.

It had some horrible oil in it when I got it, went like varnish on everything and stained all metal and paint surfaces.

 

[hotponyshoes]

Last time I filled my tank (maybe 3yrs ago) I used Smith & Allen, The previous batch(I think that was rocol? and would have been well over a year old) had separated and had gel like strands floating about on the top. It took me a while to clean the tank out, worse bit was a line about half way down where the separation was I think. This was so sticky I actually bought a small submersible pond pump and a 7 day timer. It was only about £20 for the pair. Plan was to just drop the pump in the tank and set it to come on for 15mins once a week as that was the minimum the cheap timer would allow.
I dropped it in there but have never actually plugged it in. The S&A still looks fine although I think I have only run it 3 times in as many years.
I did mix it with distilled water, was less than a tenner for a 25l drum.

 

[slim_boy_fat]

@Jonsey You probably use flood cooling, much more than I do.

A random Google search, I use these for my small needs, works a treat and I just give a shake if there are signs of separation - other sizes are available

https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/2825609887...9oAZZJ1dp_8EaIMFLTOQdfFRv4GKiZ4UaApB8EALw_wcB

 

[Brad93]

Last time I filled my tank (maybe 3yrs ago) I used Smith & Allen, The previous batch(I think that was rocol? and would have been well over a year old) had separated and had gel like strands floating about on the top. It took me a while to clean the tank out, worse bit was a line about half way down where the separation was I think. This was so sticky I actually bought a small submersible pond pump and a 7 day timer. It was only about £20 for the pair. Plan was to just drop the pump in the tank and set it to come on for 15mins once a week as that was the minimum the cheap timer would allow.
I dropped it in there but have never actually plugged it in. The S&A still looks fine although I think I have only run it 3 times in as many years.
I did mix it with distilled water, was less than a tenner for a 25l drum.

The strands on top is tramp oil

 

[Brad93]

Castro’s sell a cleaner you run through your system for a week prior to emptying. ABOM uses it

 

[Parm]

Blaser Swisslube.

This stuff is the dogs danglies /new favourite phrase, used it three times today)

It’s what’s called a bio concept fluid. Comes from the factory pre loaded with “healthy bacteria”

Causes folk like me much headaches as it makes complying with guidance nigh on impossible

Used by many F1 team machine shops

 

[Parm]

@Jonsey You probably use flood cooling, much more than I do.

A random Google search, I use these for my small needs, works a treat and I just give a shake if there are signs of separation - other sizes are available

https://www.ebay.co.uk/i/2825609887...9oAZZJ1dp_8EaIMFLTOQdfFRv4GKiZ4UaApB8EALw_wcB

Yep, exactly what I use

 

[fizzy]

I use the smith and allen stuff.
Suds pump not working on the lathe or the bridgeport so I just use a WD40 spray bottle.
I keep empty fabric softener bottles - the big ones - to store ready mix in and just decant into the WD40 sprayer when needed.
It plays havoc with my lungs since I had Covid so I wear a mask - also causes me contact dermatitis if I don't wear disposable gloves. Not nice stuff.

 

[Parm]

I use the smith and allen stuff.
Suds pump not working on the lathe or the bridgeport so I just use a WD40 spray bottle.
I keep empty fabric softener bottles - the big ones - to store ready mix in and just decant into the WD40 sprayer when needed.
It plays havoc with my lungs since I had Covid so I wear a mask - also causes me contact dermatitis if I don't wear disposable gloves. Not nice stuff.

Yep

 

[fizzy]

Yep

Mind you even squirting WD40 is making my lungs suffer. CoVid effects last for months!

 

[Parm]

Mind you even squirting WD40 is making my lungs suffer. CoVid effects last for months!

I don’t know much about how Covid affects health, but be careful with MWFs

 

[fizzy]

I don’t know much about how Covid affects health, but be careful with MWFs

http://www.medicalwomensfederation.org.uk/

MWFs???