viceroy 280vs

[chrisg3103]

here is what i cobbled together, didnt have the right part numbers in the program so i improvised

and here is my dodgy soldering

looks terrible as i accidentaly cut too many lines so had to solder them back together over a large gap. but all the gaps in between are clear, been down them with a stanly blade
and the tail of the capacitor isnt touching anything in the pic, just a bad overhead shot

part on the left is the resistors and they wernt conected

 

[Robotstar5]

You're right about the soldering! same with anything though, practice helps, need to use an iron with about 2mm tip, clean copper tracks and component leads (with PCB rubber or fine wire wool - clean off strands!) before soldering (helps the solder flow), clean and wet the iron tip with solder just before use, try "tinning" tracks before soldering.

 

[chrisg3103]

indeed, i hadnt done any 'precision' soldering since collage so only had the screwdriver atachment for the iron bought some fine tips when i got the componenets but got the wrong size. did have some nice examples of what i ahd done before to vindicate myself but cant find them right now
also dont use lead free solder that stuff is mince

well the electrical gremlins have surfaced again and this time they really went to town
had enough of farting about with the tachometer so fix the damage to the lathe pcb and make any loose conections to the tacho safe, as it was to start with.
cut a nice bit of alloy bar to start on the boss for the gearbox lever, turn on the lathe and hear it start to speed up? strange me thinks so i turn the speed down with the joystick, slows down and i let go, speeds back up again.

so turn it off and open the cabinet, could hear the speed adjuster motor still going winding the pully together. cant stop it, oh fiddle sticks (amongst other things)
didnt reach the breaker in time

wound the pully in as far as it would go and snaped the casting like a twig
after i had calmed down and stoped eyeing up the sledge hammer i investigated (again)

found a wire loose, comes from the motor. was so peeved at this point i didnt bother to look any further. this lathe has been an electrical nightmare so enoughs enough, seeing as i need to strip all the electrics to take the back plate off its getting rewired. with COLOUR CODES! must have been a sale on black wire at denford when they nailed this thing together, and while im ranting WHY have a flat plate made of cast iron!? there is only 1 casting on this plate, yes, the one that f***kn snaped off!
also ill need to wire in a new cooling pump contactor

thats were it used to be, god knows whats been going on but ive had enough. probably why the original tacho blew up in the first place, someones been at it.
moral of the story, NEVER buy a machine off ebay unless you can inspect it before hand (rant over )

 

[shenion]

here is what i cobbled together, didnt have the right part numbers in the program so i improvised

and here is my dodgy soldering

The capacitance on the input side of the regulator needs to be increased by about factor of about 1000. You have nothing to filter the rectified AC to a smooth DC.

I would use something like 470uf. I assume the display is relatively low current, as low as 100uf might work. For smoothing caps, more is better up to a point.

Still does not explain the short. you will have to ohm things out.

 

[madkayaker]

its normal for machines to be wired in one color but normally number ferrules

 

[chrisg3103]

The capacitance on the input side of the regulator needs to be increased by about factor of about 1000. You have nothing to filter the rectified AC to a smooth DC.

I would use something like 470uf. I assume the display is relatively low current, as low as 100uf might work. For smoothing caps, more is better up to a point.

Still does not explain the short. you will have to ohm things out.

noted, probably why theres a stonking great 2200 uF electrolytic capacitor on the original. ill add one in with the rest of the modifications (ie a fuse holder )

its normal for machines to be wired in one color but normally number ferrules

indeed, but theres nothing what so ever, not so bad on the solid core wires linking the contactors but the flexible wires need some form of identification were they pass through and under parts. planty of time now anyway

 

[dazzis]

yer dont take this the wrong way but, i had a quick look at your veroboard picture and found the gurt following hth.

If you want send i the components and some veroboard and a schematic and i'll solder it all up fer ee

 

[chrisg3103]

realy not the best of pics
this probably complicates it a bit more but here goes

the red blocks are were the track is broken, black lines DC blue lines AC

the bottom bit looks a dead short on the pic but like i said, its just the tails are slightly to one side so the overhead shot looks bridged. appreciate the offer all the same

 

[Robotstar5]

its normal for machines to be wired in one color but normally number ferrules

I wish some one would tell the rest of europe!, we have Dutch and German machines with no numbering system, only clues are start and finish addresses in the drawings. Had to change a relay the other day with about 20 un-numbered black wires, very careful.

 

[madkayaker]

great fun i bet. Did it work afterwards or is it appearing on eBay "one careful user then the sparky got hold of it"?

 

[Pete.]

Looks like someone has robbed the pump contactor to replace one of the others, or the pump was an option that wasn't taken. I have the wiring down for the motor FWD and REV, I expect the speed variator motor is wired the same but with limit switches. Those contactor MUST be fixed right next to each other because they have interlocks that stops them both pulling in together. They have electrical interlocks also where the rev contactor must be open before the rev one closes and vice versa. When you dig into it they are not so complicated.

I did re-wire mine with coloured wires though, to protect my own sanity. There's a thread on the Denford forum.

 

[Pete.]

This is how mine was wired. The colours here are for visual reference only, all the wires were black. C1 is the pump contactor, C2 and C3 are fwd and rev, E1 is the overload/stop button.

 

[chrisg3103]

ta, all the pump gear was definatly there before. can see the markings on the plate and the switch panel were the parts have been removed, plus the bed and tank was full of rancid cutting fluid

was planning more on relocating the power distribution pcb to the controll box and combining it with a rectifier/ regulator. plenty of spare room in there and means you dont need to wrestle the cabinet off to get to the fuses and so on

first things first, see how good my cast iron welding is!

 

[chrisg3103]

well got the plate kind of repaired

took the plate to work and sand blasted it to see if there were any other cracks, just the realy big one

after reading about cast iron welding i thought id just try and bolt the thing back together, if it fails then it will be easy enough to get a steel plate cut

going to be issues with the limit switch seeing as the plate is now 8mm thicker, not including the screw heads. if its a close fit i can countersink the heads, otherwise its a new location or switch

then gave it a quick spray of some primer i had lying about

one day ill buy a tool i dont have to fix

 

[madkayaker]

one day ill buy a tool i dont have to fix

Wheres the fun in that

 

[graffian]

I really don't get on with that board with lots of holes. I am an elctronics thickie, even so I find it fairly easy to make PCBs. Below is simple board to take a few rows of wires and a couple of sockets, so I could connect ribon cables to soemthing. The board still has the toner on the copper. They are pretty easy to make, took about half an hour to make this one and they are so much easier to work with, they also look fairly good.

Look up laser toner transfer pcb.

 

[chrisg3103]

indeed, belive it or not i have done an HNC in engineering electronics project parameters were it had to have a pcb, a pic16f84 and a 7 seg display, i ended up making a can dispenser that could dispense 3 different cans and keep count of how many were left. had a scrap pcb from it that the technician printed back to front, but cany find it anywere! just need to take my word for it

i have been eyeing up the 'press n peel' stuff, but i dont have a laser printer. but been looking at cheap ebay ones just for making pcb's, not done any electronics for about 8 years. went into mechanical engineering, but its coming back to me

 

[chrisg3103]

well got the plate back on and made a start on mapping the wires, was absolutly freezing! ended up making daft mistakes at the end and confusing myself, didnt help i coudnt feel my hands and the cold killed the multimeter

the writings on the wall....

couldnt hold a pen and the paper always ends up black anyway

the knackered board

i dont know why they routed everything through this board rather than just run the wires direct? dosnt make it any more convienient to disconect things, just a lot more grief! i can fit a couple of panel mount fuses easy enough and do away with this thing

and the speed adjuster motor back in

not sure what way round the bent leg bit goes though looks about right

once i gather the enthusiasm to look at the thing again and draw up a schematic ill start ordering parts and look at getting a pcb done for the voltage rectifier/regulator circuit

one question for you sparkeys, is it nomal to have an output from the transformer going direct to earth?

 

[chrisg3103]

well nearly got this thing wired back up, got rid of the pcb that was half burnt out anyway and fitted some fuse holders to the switch cabinet

some nice oval holes

and fuseholders

wired up with some handy heat shrink

quite neat i think, and hopefully stop anything burning out (again) makes more sense to keep them all in 1 location, one is for the contactor coils, one for the lamp (not fitted yet) and one for the tachometer (eventualy)

and some nice easy to trace colours not sure what the brown supply wire is putting out from the transformer as it was never used.
now i have the layout sussed it will be easy to put in a pump contactor once i find a sutable one. and get hold of a sutable 3 phase coolant pump, cough cough

had a look at the limit switch situation again in the dying minutes of my enthusiastic flurry. i bought a couple of 10A switches along with the fuse holders, turns out they bolt together perfectly for the two trips! and they are slim enough to fit between the shaft and the plate. so shouldnt be such a nightmare to sort after all

and on a side note pete, another bullet you dodged with this lathe, the speed control motors 3 phase. would of had to get very crafty to convert that to single all good fun

 

[Pete.]

I would probably have fitted a handwheel outside the cabinet. Nice to see you making progress mate, just a shame there's been so much work in it.