WP 20 week!?

[Jim Davey]

Is this the week for everyone on the south coast to burn out a WP 20 torch? I've had 10 in this week! What are you all doing out there?
If it's not torches it's water pumps, I've had 3 Kemppis and one EWM in this week too with burned out motor start capacitors and sticky pumps.
Not seen a machine in with that fault for months then 4 in 2 days, wierd.

 

[Welderpaul]

End of the month, everyones going like the clappers to get work out of the door for invoice time
I know we do every month

 

[Jim Davey]

And to save 3 seconds you decide not to switch on your water coolers? Ingenious.

 

[Welderpaul]

Why would any machine be set up so it needed the cooler to be switched on seperately to the welding set? That's asking for trouble.

Any w/c TIG i have used/we have, the cooler comes on as soon as you switch the set on.

 

[Robotstar5]

Is this the week for everyone on the south coast to burn out a WP 20 torch? I've had 10 in this week! What are you all doing out there?.

Assuming they're hired, do they have to pay a premium if returning faulty/damaged kit?

 

[Jim Davey]

You'd be surprised how many cobbled together Heath Robinson style home made coolers my customers have lashed up. Plus the usual aftermarket add-on coolers that are powered separately from the mains.
If I add a cooler to a set it's always plumbed into the on/off switch do it comes on when the set does but I don't fit every cooler out there.

 

[Jim Davey]

Assuming they're hired, do they have to pay a premium if returning faulty/damaged kit?

That depends on a few factors, if it's out and out damage/abuse/neglect then of course there is a charge. However if the kit just fails then I take it on the chin. You have to be a bit flexible, nobody likes getting a big bill at the end of a hire so general wear and tear stuff I don't sweat. But if I put out a new machine and it comes back dented to hell with burned, cut cables then somebody is getting an invoice to cover it.

All these torches this week are customers own ones though.

 

[Welderpaul]

Is it economically viable repairing a WP20?

 

[Robotstar5]

Is it economically viable repairing a WP20?

Beat me to it!

 

[Jim Davey]

Yes as they are very quick to do (if they have a zipper cover) if it's a neoprene sheath then it's iffy as they take much longer to get on and off. Parts are cheap though and on the dearer torches like the Speedway and Parweld progrip it's definitely worth the time. If it's much more than a power cord/water pipe head or switch then no as 3-4 of the above items if they are all needed together adds up to more than a new torch once labour is added in as well.
If I can't fix and pressure test a WP20 in fifteen minutes it's too far gone to start on.

 

[Welderpaul]

It's the labour cost that we pay that takes the wee as far as i am concerned. If its something we can repair in house - new swan neck etc etc, then we will do it, other than that the torch gets chucked in a box for spares.
We do get along life out of them though; in use day in day out.

 

[Jim Davey]

Paying a service engineer £45+ per hour to fix torches is a bit of a waste really. But so many firms have got rid of 'Ole Burt' the welder who would also sit in the dead kit corner and would go through torches, extension leads and angle grinders on a Friday afternoon and sort them out as most are easy fixes.

 

[Welderpaul]

Agreed. - Our torches are 250 quid a pop cos they control the machine and have a PCB and display in them so repaired where possible.
I'm sure a lot of stuff is an easy fix but like you say there's few places that can warrant paying someone to tinker with stuff. Chuck it in the bin and get a new one...grinders and such are consumables really these days.

 

[Jim Davey]

It's the labour cost that we pay that takes the wee as far as i am concerned. If its something we can repair in house - new swan neck etc etc, then we will do it, other than that the torch gets chucked in a box for spares.
We do get along life out of them though; in use day in day out.

I think labour rates in the welding industry are well below average. We all expect to be shafted if we take our cars to a main dealer. Call an emergency plumber or electrician and it's the same, £60,£70,£80 pounds an hour or more in many cases. But pick up the phone to a welding shop, call out a service guy, who is trained, carries spares, is expected to have a wealth of knowledge on all types of welding machine, welding process and carry whatever spares are necessary to effect a repair and then are surprised when he wants more than £25 an hour.

 

[Jim Davey]

Agreed. - Our torches are 250 quid a pop cos they control the machine and have a PCB and display in them so repaired where possible.
I'm sure a lot of stuff is an easy fix but like you say there's few places that can warrant paying someone to tinker with stuff. Chuck it in the bin and get a new one...grinders and such are consumables really these days.

It's liability more than anything, that and PAT testing regs etc. if a guy puts a new cable on a grinder that's perfectly safe, he's still in trouble if he can't PAT test it afterwards to prove its safe. Same goes for a lot of basic shop fixes these days. Everyone is scared stiff of copping a fine or being sued so passing on the responsibility or just binning faulty kit looks more attractive all the time. Shame how things have gone really.

 

[Paul.]

It's liability more than anything, that and PAT testing regs etc. if a guy puts a new cable on a grinder that's perfectly safe, he's still in trouble if he can't PAT test it afterwards to prove its safe. Same goes for a lot of basic shop fixes these days. Everyone is scared stiff of copping a fine or being sued so passing on the responsibility or just binning faulty kit looks more attractive all the time. Shame how things have gone really.

There's a lot of of misunderstanding and misinformation about PAT testing, mainly put about by testing setups, as long as the equipment is properly maintained and safe there is not a legal requirement for testing. http://www.hse.gov.uk/electricity/faq-portable-appliance-testing.htm

 

[Welderpaul]

A decent quality Robin PAT tester cost me 300 quid on ebay. A competent lad to test and record everything and hey ho, every 6 months we are all tested up and ok.
Our customers dictate that any kit we take to site is PAT tested, so rightly or wrongly, that's what we need to do. Makes sense to test a great big heap of site/shop electrical gear once every six months.

 

[Jim Davey]

You're in the minority Paul, most places farm out all that work.

 

[Paul.]

My NHS contract requires kit taken on site to be pat tested, so I bought an RS one and do it myself, its a customer requirement though not a legal one, and not likely to be sued for not having a test cert.

 

[Jim Davey]

There's a lot of of misunderstanding and misinformation about PAT testing, mainly put about by testing setups, as long as the equipment is properly maintained and safe there is not a legal requirement for testing. http://www.hse.gov.uk/electricity/faq-portable-appliance-testing.htm

You've just fallen into the trap there my friend. Answer me this; How do you prove that the equipment is properly maintained AND safe without a PAT test? You can't, it may be safe but without the paper trail to prove it in the event of an accident resulting in a claim you'll be hung out to dry. There are many areas where this is the case. Gas safety testing is another, there is no law that says it needs doing. But there is a law saying it is an employers responsibility to provide safe working equipment. Again, if one of your guys has an accident with a piece of equipment you have provided for him as his employer and you can't prove it was safe, then you have broken the law and you can expect a whole heap of trouble.