workshop saw options

[oddbob]

Why is a power hacksaw no good on box and tube as i was thinking of buying one for cutting box tube flat and bar cheers.

I have a clarke band saw but find it too exensive in blades they seem to loose teeth then jam and break after a while even quality ones ive played about with feed rates but about given up on it now after about 10 years . maybe a chop saw might be a better option for me. cheers

I've used a power hacksaw for years, and cut anything and everything with it including 16g walled box and thinner ...just use a finer tpi blade.

 

[printcom]

For whats it worth I have a Evo rage 3, it cuts very well leaving a nice clean edge but throws shards at your face and body so wear full face protection, gloves and boiler suite, also the blades dont last long especially if you want to cut wood again. For metal I have a Axminster bandsaw and it is superb, I could not believe they can make it for the price, although I am finding the 6" x 4" capacity limiting and the lack of coolent system tends to kill the blades a bit quicker. But hey, what do you expect from £300. Its a swivel head saw so cutting angles is a breeze. The only downside I have found is the blade supplied is crap. I have noticed a lot of other places sell the "same" saw albeit rebaged for a lot more money.

 

[Spark plug]

Just looked at the administer saws look very good for the money I'm going to have a good look at them later

If I get one of them I could get rid of the power hack saw and not going to loose any more space.

 

[Feanor]

I have a power hacksaw and it cuts box and tube. Ok, sometimes it might be necessary to relieve the weight of the blade and arm on the workpiece by holding the front of the arm and just taking a bit of weight off as it cuts. This isn't as difficult as it may sound and it's safe enough. The arm only travels fairly slowly. What tends to happen if you don't (in very thin-wall section) is the blade jams in the cut. The belt is tensioned just enough and so slips on the pulley if this happens. It doesn't snap the blade.

On a new blade the saw can sometimes jam even on solid stuff as the fresh set of the teeth dig in as it cuts quickly. Again, relieve the pressure by taking just a bit of weight off the cut. It soon settles down as the new blade kind of beds in.

I've only broken about 3 blades in 25 years. This is almost certainly when the workpiece isn't clamped properly in the vice and then spins if the blade jams. It's this that will snap the blade. This can also happen with any round section (solid round bar) if the piece isn't clamped firmly. Or it can happen with any section if the vice ain't tight. Round bar has more tendency to slip though for obvious reasons of least vice contact.

I made another set of jaws for the vice that slide over the existing jaws and have a small Vee-groove machined along the width of both these extra jaws near the bottom of them. This helps to locate and clamp round bar more firmly. But to be honest I rarely use them these days (too idle - ) and only fit them if I have a lot of 12mm round bar to cut. Otherwise I just make sure the vice is really tight.

You need to be using a 14 tpi blade for thin wall section and I tend to keep this blade fitted for most stuff anyway. I do keep a 10 tpi blade hung up nearby for any work that is large and solid, but I don't spend every day keep swapping blades depending on cut. For all intents a 14 tpi is fine for most work in a light fab shop.

You can get blades 1" wide or 1.25" wide. The former are cheaper whilst the latter are a bit stronger, but again, I very rarely break a 1" blade. So my fave blades are 14" (long) x 1" x 14tpi (or 10tpi for definite solids). I just bought one of each about a month ago and expect to get 6 months minimum out of the 14 tpi and even longer out of the 10tpi (all depending on work done). They both cost £7.20 + vat each from MSC/J&L Ind Supplies. They're both Eclipse - all hard.

Edit: I might add that using cutting compound on the blade always helps. Stuff such as Rocol or CT90 or similar. I apply it often whilst it's running, just the slightest smear on a few blade teeth. I apply it using a short plastic stick with a tapered end - one of those markers for plant pots that gardeners use. Or a flat wooden lolly stick works ok too. A little brush is no good cos the blade erodes all the bristles eventually.

 

[gavuk]

I have used industrial bandsaws at work and a clarke 6x4 at home for years,if cutting unattended i use a feed suitable for the vertical sides of the box section ie much slower than I would use for the horizontal part ,if staying with the saw,set for the horizontal sections (fast) and catch the weight instead of letting it speed through the vertical edges...Our coldsaw at work is the same,have to ease up the feed on verticals otherwise it stalls,no secret ,I prefer a bandsaw to a cold saw any day ,haven't used a powered hacksaw in 20+yrs but a fine pitch blade and slow feed sounds right to me.....

 

[steve.h]

i bought a rage chopsaw, it has the multi blade that can cut nails in wood, so it says on the box, I do not like it at all, it just hacks at the metal and throws out tiny little chips at you, not nice at all, only good for wood in my opinion. I would look for a good hobby bandsaw or a secondhand commercial job.

 

[jackojacks]

The Above is the same with my band saw . i think some of my probs are due to me using an industrial bandsaw for years as part of my job so i expect a bit much of my clarke bandsaw.
it is a very good saw i prob tend to try and cut material that is a bit thin at times which can jam the blade ive just been cutting 40mm box today 3mm wall no probs at all a pleasure to use. i also think a coolant/ lubricant set up would help things.

the addition of a chop saw may stop me abusing the band saw so much.

 

[Spark plug]

Thanks for the advice feanor I'm going to adjust the belt later so that it can slip, the saw has its own coolant.

An old fella I was talkingg to today told me to put sum new rather thick oil in the damper to help reduce the presure on the cut.

 

[Feanor]

Yes, I meant by the way, the small standard vee-belt on the motor pulley, that is tensioned correctly, rather than the large multi-link belt around the large driven pulley that is connected the the crank and slides. Mine's a standard Rapidor machine.

Coolant has got to be good. I actually set mine up for coolant years ago by fabricating a stainless sump and shoe-horning it underneath the bed of the saw. Then I used an old washing machine pump and drove it via direct contact (like an old cycle speedo that bears on the tyre rim) off the motor pulley and belt. A couple of specific brackets had to be bashed into shape. They're always plastic pulleys on these sturdy little pumps, sometimes flat belt driven off the washing machine motors and exert no actual friction (erosion) on the driving surface of the saw motor pulley.

It worked ok really after I fandangled some piping and a couple of swivel joints and a little on/off tap that was scavenged from air-line spares, but I eventually fell out with it a bit. It kept freezing every winter (as most of my coolant does), I got fed up cleaning thick sludge out of the sump and the occasional leaks and blockages began to grate. I can't really say it lengthened blade life excessively. Having said that, the pump itself still went the distance (and they're ten a penny anyway off scrap washing machines) cos all they are is a driven impeller in a neat little plastic housing with input & output pipes. It's still kicking around somewhere.

One day I removed it all and gave the entire machine a damned good clean and a new blade and didn't put it back. It's been fine ever since and the Rocol compound does the trick better than coolant ever did anyway. There's also less mess and it's all neater and less complicated.

Most of these saws were designed and used dry. I have seen more modern ones with coolant since and my mod with the washing machine pump was, I thought, an innovation at the time. But the cuts don't really need to be cooled in the way say a steel lathe tool needs coolant. The fluid does assist in lubricating though and carrying away the metal dust of the cut. But in my view, cutting compound does this better and is less messy.

If the machine is built and designed with coolant though, by all means use it if all works well. Coolant isn't bad, but on a power hacksaw you can do without it. Cutting compound is a fine substitute, even a better one.

If you do get the belt nicely tensioned to slip under too much load and your vice is good (clean and square jaws) and clamps tightly enough, then hopefully a dig-in will just cause the blade to stick and the belt to slip. Do NOT attempt to release the stationary arm and blade out of the cut whilst the motor is still running. The moment you do release it by pulling upwards it will jerk forwards (or backwards) under power and you are likely to snap a blade doing this. You could also mash your fingers with the sudden motion.

Turn off the machine, then pull the blade up out of the cut. Holding the arm above the cut (and being ready for it), turn back on the machine and allow it to back and forth whilst carefully lowering the blade back into the cut by taking some of the down weight.

Keeping the damper well topped with oil is good, though I just use some hydraulic oil of unknown viscosity that I cadged off a mate. I know he uses it for his forklift is all. Any oil will do I would think. I suppose I could have experimented with EP90 and such over the years.

Make sure the blade is well tensioned too when fitting one. Pretty damn tight I would say rather than any chance of sloppiness. I always use some grips on the end wheel that tensions the blade. In other words, tighter than hand tightening can achieve, without going too extreme.

Check that the little horizontal driving pins that go through the holes on the blade aren't worn oval or bent out of shape. This could cause the blade to flutter a bit under load and result in a breakage. They're easy to overlook or ignore. I replaced mine with some short lengths (only about an inch apiece) of silver steel round, about 1/4" diameter.

 

[Spark plug]

I started to give the hacksaw a good service yesterday the gib strip for the blade needed adjusting, after I cleaned an inch of goo out the suds tank it seems to have acquired a leak so Ile braze that today.

I fully stripped the vice down and cleaned everything up with a oil stone to get rid of the marks hear and there. Just need to oil and grease and put everything back together.

Fingers crossed everything will be ok.

 

[tedmagnum]

i have the evo raptor 355 . exelent saw for cutting tube but you cant cut box on the flat side .it has to be cut on its edge so useless if you need to cut box at 45degrees .

Why not ????