What's the issue with Acetylene?

[Mr shiney]

Well the title says it really?

I seem to read endless posts about how one touch of an acetylene bottle and the world will end....

My dad had an Oxy kit it in the garage for 30 years and I have my own which I find incredibly useful. I notified the fire brigade that I was keeping it as I read the horror stories of 200m perimeters and the apocalypse occurring if they caught fire. The fire brigade were disinterested to say the least in my tiny little portapac cylinder telling me that the 2000l of oil stored for my heating was higher risk. My house insurance were equally uninterested.

I observe the guidelines on its use, have flash ask arresters at both ends of the hose etc. Price wise with my discount from BOC it costs me less than the propane.

So am I missing something?

 

[rtbcomp]

If you told the fire brigade and your insurance you're obviously a responsible user, it's the people who mistreat bottles and don't know how to use then that are the problem.

 

[rikrobson]

acetalene is not satble. inside the gas cylinder is a monolith that helps keep the gas stable in the cylinder. If there is a fire the cylider and monolith heat up. The Fire brigare can cool the cylinder and put the fire out, but the monolith stays hot, keeping the gas hot and unstable, cauing a potential time bomb. propane cylinders don't have the monolith inside and cool the gas inside when the cylinderr is cooled.


This is why there is a 200m exclusion zone when the firebrigade find out there is acetelyne present.

 

[Mr shiney]

I understand the construction of the cylinders. I have been a HSE approved cylinder testing station for 25 years.

It is more the fear of god that people seem to have around the use of acetylene which I am trying to understand. I discussed the subject at length with the dire brigade and they have said that in the size of cylinder I am using they do not consider any exclusion zone needed. They would be more concerned about the oil tanks going up.

Surely we should be promoting safe handling rather than just making it out to be the devils own work?

 

[pedrobedro]

There is also a built in weak spot on acetylene cylinders to prevent them pressurising and grenading in the event of heating up.

 

[Jim Davey]

I understand the construction of the cylinders. I have been a HSE approved cylinder testing station for 25 years.

It is more the fear of god that people seem to have around the use of acetylene which I am trying to understand. I discussed the subject at length with the dire brigade and they have said that in the size of cylinder I am using they do not consider any exclusion zone needed. They would be more concerned about the oil tanks going up.

Surely we should be promoting safe handling rather than just making it out to be the devils own work?

I'm with you on this one, the problems arise from poor handling, unsafe working practice and general ignorance of the safe start-up and shut-down procedure. But people can get themselves in just as big a pickle with propane as they can with acetylene, it's just easier to deal with a burning LPG cylinder than an acetylene.
I personally think we would all be a lot safer if people had to show some form of qualification before they can rent/purchase gas cylinders/cutting/welding gear. Maybe a course or refresher every 5 years (Gas fitters/Plumbers have to so why not us) as lets face it, we all know at least one dangerous person who operates with his torch whistling away and his answer to sustained backfires is to wear thicker gloves so he doesn't burn his hands on the handle of his torch!

 

[bpcoryton]

with oxy&fuel (acetylene or propane) gas out the two cylinders its the oxygen thats mostly over looked as the most dangerous in a situation,and the first cylinder that should be shut down.
the company i work for had an incident with a oxygen&acetylene set up.BOC were called in due to what happend to find out the reason behind what had happend,after takeing statements etc. thay gave us all a talking to before leaveing about the safe use etc,bla-bla of the all the gases&cylinders we have&use a lot of time served workers ***** off about this being told how to 'suck eggs'so to speak!but the of the qestions thay asked one was witch cylinder is the most dangerous etc out of oxy&fuel,out of 20 blokes only two of us got it correct very suprised more didnt get to right (i being one of them)anotheir half hour of lectuering for those who got it wrong!
acetylene cylinders have a blow-out plug on their base,and theirs far to many people who use these set ups who have no training on how to set up or use them start up/shut down or what to do in a situation.ive had phone calls from people asking what to do when things have gone wrong after warning them not to use there just brought bargin set up,all out of date scrap.
how many people know about laying a D.A cylinder on its side and then standing it up to use it?.
the gas is as safe as can be its the peoples lack of knowledge about it who make it dangerous.
and if in a fire pull your cylinders out dont leave it to the fire brigade as thay dont like doing it!

 

[Jim Davey]

Correction, they WON'T do it, the Fire brigade will let your house/garage burn to the ground while they watch from a safe distance if they think there are gas cylinders involved.

 

[Mr shiney]

Correction, they WON'T do it, the Fire brigade will let your house/garage burn to the ground while they watch from a safe distance if they think there are gas cylinders involved.

Not my local brigade. According to them the sizes I am referring to here are not an issue. They will tackle the blaze accordingly. Acetylene cylinders are equipped with blow out disks to prevent them from becoming bombs and the portapack gas volumes are very small.

Do you have a reference for the claim Jim? Ae you a fireman? Or are we getting into the old wives tales that I referred to earlier? No offence intended!

 

[chunkolini]

Issues with acetylene?
each puff of flame is a bottle going off http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RoatgaQrK28 watch out for the fliers. They start off spinning on the ground as the plug pops out under pressure then take and go off like bombs.
Mixed with O2? goes kersplaaam.
Treat it with massive respect.

 

[brightspark]

simple answer. ive had bottles for 40 years. read the book store them safely check equipment before use WOTS THE PROBLEM {scare mongering

 

[mike os]

tend to agree BS.... its idiots with gas bottles that are the problem, not just acetylene either

used and stored properly whats the problem?

 

[Fergus]

Not my local brigade. According to them the sizes I am referring to here are not an issue. They will tackle the blaze accordingly. Acetylene cylinders are equipped with blow out disks to prevent them from becoming bombs and the portapack gas volumes are very small.

Do you have a reference for the claim Jim? Ae you a fireman? Or are we getting into the old wives tales that I referred to earlier? No offence intended!

On the odd occasion when I've been involved in such things the cylinders usually end up in a skip full of water to cool off, placed there by the Fire boys.

An area known to contain cylinders tends to get extra attention and as much effort as possible to manage the fire away from that area. Once they start to blow, then withdraw to your cordon.

 

[Mr shiney]

Fergus, have you seen many acetylene fires then?

 

[chunkolini]

Look after your stuff, treat it with respect and it is fine.
Get daft and it can get out of hand.
I treated mine as 'just stuff' for years. Now I treat it with respect, it is still just stuff though.
Does that make sense.

 

[the snooper]

.
I treated mine as 'just stuff' for years. Now I treat it with respect, it is still just stuff though.
Does that make sense.

yeah it makes sense, you know what it costs to replace it, and don't like the thought of it

 

[Fergus]

Fergus, have you seen many acetylene fires then?

Maybe 5 in the last 14 years or so. None of them went bang thankfully.

 

[Mr shiney]

Maybe 5 in the last 14 years or so. None of them went bang thankfully.

Which I am guessing is the real reason my local fire brigade are not scaremongering?

I have no doubt that large scale storage of acetylene is of concern but I don't think that the gas deserves the rap that it gets. When I was diving commercially the hydrogen we used always made my bum twitch but again properly handled I never saw or heard of an incident.

As I keep saying perhaps we should promote safe handling rather than putting the fear of god needlessly into people?

 

[AndyStobbs]

Which I am guessing is the real reason my local fire brigade are not scaremongering?

I have no doubt that large scale storage of acetylene is of concern but I don't think that the gas deserves the rap that it gets. When I was diving commercially the hydrogen we used always made my bum twitch but again properly handled I never saw or heard of an incident.

As I keep saying perhaps we should promote safe handling rather than putting the fear of god needlessly into people?

If it means one less course to attend (and fund) I would much rather stick with the latter.

 

[Mr shiney]

I don't think anyone mentioned a course. There is nothing wrong with peer education. Instead of scaremongering why not give correct advice. Cylinder handling is no difficult. Don't use it lying down, if its been lain down let it sit upright for an hour or so before you use it. Don't store it near any sources of ignition such as grinding or welding near it. Do frequent leak checks, inspect hoses etc.