welding vehicle sills

[Lurcher]

Hello there,
Just found this cracking site, bloody hell, all the photos etc are brilliant.
I've just bought a turbo mig diy welder with no experience so I've been looking at loads of books......no comparison to this site, I've learnt loads just in the last hour. Can't wait now to get started in ernest. First job is my sills on my Land rover discovery.
Questions:
1.should I get the steel fabricated to the right shape before I start?
2.should I get a large sheet of steel and cut to the required shape myself?
3. the manual of the vehicle doesn't state what kind of steel it is and a friend who is a top engineer went in to all sorts of weird and wonderful descriptions of densities and totally confused me/scared me,(also, he has never welded! too much red wine as well anyway it was well over my head.)
4. can I just go down to the local "metal fabricators"(I'm a total novice and don't even know the words for a shop that sells steel) and ask for
such and such a size of whatever makes up a landrover discoverys sills?

God, I hope you can help me. I'm 41 years old and wish they taught me the above when I got my o'level in metalwork in 1980!!

cheers

Degz(Lurcher)

 

[kernowcam]

I know a bit about series land rovers buty not sure about the disco.
bit daft but first check they are steel with a magnet as they mix adjacent panels!!!
You could ring john craddocks for example who supply tons of aftermarket panels for all land rovers and see what they suggest / offer / what the normal fix is.
I suspect it will be easier and cheaper to buy ready made sill sections, they generally are not to expensive. Unless you have the gear forget decent bends they get on a pre made panels.
You may be able to drill out the spot welds and plug weld to replace but do lots of research first. ie don't remove a panel and find things sag when your should have supported things beforehand. (I can't remember if malcolm has a plug welding section off hand.)
I know on my LR footwells i used £13 ready made panels and modified them to suit, but don't expect perfection untils youve beaten it with a hammer a bit. (land rover number 1 tool.)
Oh and buy a small 4.5 inch angle grinder with some metal grinding disc to tidy your work AND thin 1mm metal cutting discs. They are brilliant and a joy being able to cut thin metal like butter. Ian

 

[Lurcher]

welding sills

Ian,
many thanks for your reply. I had a series3 myself a couple of years back but it had a lovely galvinised chassis, no welding required.
Anyway, I'm looking forward to a steep learning curve.
thanks for all the advice.
Degz

 

[malcolm]

A few of us fitted a new chassis to a Series 3 over a weekend http://www.vord.net/cars/land-rover/landrover-chassis.htm

As Ian says, replacement sills should be available from Land Rover specialists. Normally bought panels work out cheaper than spending time trying to make them from scratch.

You'll probably need to buy a sheet of steel for repairing other bits and pieces not covered by the repair sections, and also for practicing welding. Look up "Steel Stockholders" in the Yellow pages.

There are loads of different types of steel, but I suspect your friend was being pedantic. Engineers can be like that some times. You want "mild steel". Comes in all sorts of thicknesses (I keep 1.0mm, 1.5mm and 2mm). My normal approach is to buy a full sheet in one thickness, then ask if I can take some of the other thicknesses from the off-cuts in their skip.

 

[Lurcher]

welding sills

Great advice guys,
I got the angle grinder out after buying some 1mm discs,thanks to Ians advice, bloody revelation they were,so accurate for cutting out the rusty bits! I had the 3-4mm bits ready for the job, glad I got the advice on that.
I've ground a nice rectangle out now but am a bit worried about having to place the bit of steel and hold it in place, bit of tape and tack weld around it(god I can hear you all screaming at me), but I can't think of a way of holding it. It's a box section which I have cut out one side, the nearside of the vehicle. From what I've read/seen on the website I will<after the tack welds, butt weld the replacement piece in place. Just the grinding was a learning curve God knows what the welding will be!
Any advice gratefully received
Lurcher
Degz

 

[Lurcher]

Forgot to say, "Thanks Malcolm",
After getting down to it, the whole sills did not need replacing, just some big rusty holes needed cutting out.
You're all, well both, coming up with some good basic tips for a beginner, keep them coming.I will be promoting this site on the landrover owners forum in the near future as the returns on there were really poor, I think it was below them to talk about rusty sills! Shame as there are so many about in the forum. Oh well, i'm glad you can humour novices.
I'm striking up the first weld at the weekend, can't wait to lose my
virginity!

cheers guys
Degz

 

[malcolm]

Be sure to practice a lot on spare bits of metal off the car. Your first welds will be terrible, but you should get the hang of it fairly quickly. Makes sense having the terrible welds on scrap steel you can throw away rather than on the car.

Actually, the angle of the steel makes a difference. If you need to weld some vertical steel then it makes sense setting the welder up on some vertical scrap first.

Holding the steel in place is a bit tricky. I tend to keep it in my hand, put one edge in the right place, do the first tack, then bend it into position for the rest of the tacks. Oh - and make sure everybit of metal you plan to weld is shiny clean. That's what the 4mm angle grinder discs are for.

 

[kernowcam]

I bought a few cheap 'mole grips' of different sizes and shapes. really hangy for setting a job up before committing to a weld. also have a couple of magnetic triangles which are ok. get some use.

 

[Hitch]

I have a pair of those magnetic triangles...only use them for holding drawings or cutting lists to machines! :lol:
Bloody things get covered in grinding dust etc, and take ages to clean everytime you put em down!

 

[kernowcam]

thanks for the suggestion. i am glad to find a good use for them. i think they have been handy twice.
ian

 

[Lurcher]

Hello Again,
Had my first practise on Sunday, not as easy as I thought. There was a lot of adjusting the setting but I was getting better before the roll of wire ran out. I was using it on gasless as that was the set-up it came with but I'm going to have a go at the gas as I imagine that may be better, any comments?
Anyway, it was a revelation finally to be able to join two pieces of steel together. Great satisfaction!
I also got a few of those little cheapo clamps, as well as the normal welding ones, they worked surprisingly well.
Thanks for all the tips.
This is great fun
Degz

 

[malcolm]

I went through the same learning process with aluminium recently. Takes a heck of a lot of scrap matal and wire to gain confidence.

You'll probably find gas shielding makes things a lot easier. The light is less bright and there is much less smoke so you'll be able to see what you are doing. It's worth checking the welder manual to see if you need to swap the polarity of the welder when you change from gasless to gas. (Although I suspect if it's a"turbo" it'll already be correct for using gas).

Welding is fun. It's one of those things where you can make a perfectly good weld very quickly, but even after 10 years of it you still get satisfaction from achieving neater and neater welds.

 

[SB Metalman]

Practice,Practice,Practice! whoops! Practice,Practice,Practice! Oh yeah! more Practice,Practice,Practice!

 

[Master-of-none]

Practice

He's had 3 years worth by now, it's a very old thread!

 

[malcolm]

Where is Lurcher anyway? He seemed to slip away at some point in 2006. I wonder what tales and photographs he could post now....

Don't like people going away. It's like not going to visit your granny any more.

 

[Chickenjohn]

I'm still here, but mostly just read.

 

[zardoz]

Just a heads up that there have been some great metal fabrication how to sections over the last few months in Practical classics magazine. Showing how even a layman can get good fabrication done, as long as they can wield a hammer and dolly with a modicum of dexterity and have a bit of patience. They are really worth reading i assure anyone who wants to have a go a fabbing their own panels, he shows many tricks of the trade etc. I'd give it a go before i sprung out for off the shelf panels.

 

[ben8vgte]

I'd give it a go before i sprung out for off the shelf panels.

i had to make a pair of cill's for a pug boxer van because you couldnt get them new, given the choice of ready made i wouldnt want to be doing that in a hurry again