Welding inside a water tank

[Kayos]

I guess it's one of those questions, if you have to ask on here then you really shouldn't be doing it.

I kicked a team off site for laying a 2000 litre water tank on its side and one of them climbing in.

One moment of madness that could have been fatal, no way was I having that on me. The lad who climbed in did get sacked, not for that but he was a hazard, didn't think the rules applied to him

 

[addjunkie]

once upon a time id have just gone in and done it now even if i was tied to a rope and someone tried to pull me out i dont think i would. have you ever tried lifting a dead weight even worse through an 18 inch hole

Yes and its very difficult even with the proper gear! Only ever had to do it for real once, and the adrenaline running changes the dynamics some what. Fortunately it was only a broken leg from a fall in the tank, and the air was good. Though with a corpse itll be easier there not screaming when you bash them about in the process Lifting the Neil Robesrtson stretcher out!

I worked in environments all my working life where this stuff was regular and have been fully trained in the emergency response. The days of just hopping in and doing it are no more.

 

[Agroshield]

Before you even consider entering the tank you need a rescue plan....

...which also has to take full account of the "25ft up on a steel frame in the middle of a field".

That said, you do not say if this is your own tank, on your own property or a paid assignment as an employee (gross oversimplification, I know).

Maybe read up on ERICPD, concentrate hard on the 'E' and consider why he is not called RICPDE.

If the repair is on the frame, insert some temporary structure to bridge over the frame, remove some of the frame, do the repair from the outside, resecure the frame.

 

[Danez]

Its not too bad working inside these things, the clean up/grinding is the pig, the welding is the easy bit. I have spent a few hours inside the bowser adding baffles, definitely need some form of forced ventilation.

Bob

Interesting, don't think I've ever seen a tanker with a grab before

 

[Munkul]

Rescue plan involving harness and man-rescue winch at a minimum, and a stand-by man
Forced air ventilation, ideally one fan/ducting blowing fresh air in and one sucking crap out
gas monitoring, something simple like an MSA 4x which checks the common ones that will kill you as well as O2 levels
Has the tank been washed out properly?
There are loads more things to think about.
Loads of things to go wrong if you haven't been trained in confined spaces.

 

[bricol]

No lone working, I’d want a second man at the hatch too

With a proper plan and equipment, and probably assistance, with instructions not to simply jump in to come and help - how many times do you read about situations where the first person has become incapacitated, the second and then third persons have jumped in to help and suffered the same issue - seem to recall father and two sons in a septic tank somewhere near here.

20 plus years ago when I was dafter, I and colleague spent a weekend in Holland welding shed plates inside two 10,000ltr flat bottomed caustic tanks they had big hatches and our concession to surviving was a powerful blower fan and some 10" dia hose directed into the tank - but not close to blow the shielding gas away . . . thinking about it now . . .

 

[8ob]

Interesting, don't think I've ever seen a tanker with a grab before

It was a one trick pony so we put a small crane behind the cab and made a frame/sub chassis to take twist locks, its now got a tipper,timber bolsters and tank option which can all be lifted on/off with the crane. Need to get that finished its been dead for a couple of years and all it needs is the brakes done

Bob

 

[Danez]

It was a one trick pony so we put a small crane behind the cab and made a frame/sub chassis to take twist locks, its now got a tipper,timber bolsters and tank option which can all be lifted on/off with the crane. Need to get that finished its been dead for a couple of years and all it needs is the brakes done

Bob

ah nice one that's a class idea

Get some pics up when it's done

 

[Bornfree]

 

[Gareth J]

FYI, If it helps with the cost benefit calculation, I bought a 20,000l plastic tank for about £1800 + vat last year.

 

[8ob]

A bod standing on the lid pointing a leaf blower in there and the jobs a gooden

Bob

 

[Parm]

One of my favourite sayings, gleaned from this very forum: It's all fine, until it isn't.

The saying i use often is "think about your future self"

Can be applied to many many things

 

[Dcal]

View attachment 343104

It has to be easier to do that from the outside.

By the time you have hired half the kit you would reasonably need for confined space entry, you could get a scaffold up to that and do as @Agroshield has already said.

I'd guess, the designer of the frame didn’t give much of a corrosion allowance.
I'd say they expected it to be maintained not just left to rust.
it looks like a tight design but I bet they said it should be galvanised or given a good paint system.
Wouldn't hurt to give it a lick of paint now.

 

[bricol]

It has to be easier to do that from the outside.

By the time you have hired half the kit you would reasonably need for confined space entry, you could get a scaffold up to that and do as @Agroshield has already said.

I'd guess, the designer of the frame didn’t give much of a corrosion allowance.
I'd say they expected it to be maintained not just left to rust.
it looks like a tight design but I bet they said it should be galvanised or given a good paint system.
Wouldn't hurt to give it a lick of paint now.

Its when you find three sides of each box section leg have rusted through 3" above the ground . . .

 

[KTMart]

Where I worked we had lots of confined spaces, cellars beneath machines, ducts, culverts all sorts of things, the company were very hot on H+S and to enter a confined space you were required to be trained first. For a confined space entry to take place required a full risk assesment, an energy control plan, locking off things like comp air, hydraulics, power supplies etc before you could even think about starting then setting up a rescue control point, gas monitoring, setting up tripods and winches appointing an outside attendant and ensuring you had a 4 man rescue team available across site all issued with radios, for routine jobs it was an absolute ball ache! I must have done hundreds of these with no issue and felt it was overkill on routine jobs till one day a contractor forgot to take his medication and passed out while repairing a pump in a coolant cellar. I was part of the rescue team and it scared the life out of me, it's hard to image how difficult it is to move a barely conscious body in a greasy slimy pit and get them winched to ground level.
When it comes to confined space working there can be no short cuts or half measures, everthings ok till it's not.

 

[Tinbasherdan]

If you think carrying a person is hard, try moving a dead body of the same weight. The term dead weight is very apt

 

[sako243]

It was a one trick pony so we put a small crane behind the cab and made a frame/sub chassis to take twist locks, its now got a tipper,timber bolsters and tank option which can all be lifted on/off with the crane. Need to get that finished its been dead for a couple of years and all it needs is the brakes done

Bob

Last time I saw it it still had the rag we put over the intakes when we lifted on the head. Did you even torque the bolts down?

 

[8ob]

Last time I saw it it still had the rag we put over the intakes when we lifted on the head. Did you even torque the bolts down?

Yes its just the brakes to do but......................................... Theres a nice 6pot Perkins phaser with an overdrive five speed box up for grabs, its out of a TL so it may well find its way into there and sod the 330.

Bob

 

[Hitch]

16000l sounds a lot, but it won't take much for that to fill up with smoke and fume, especially with a stick welder.

We do a fair bit of that sort of thing, but TIG, so slightly less fume.

Tank needs venting, fume extraction, gas monitoring, resue harness/ lanyard, top man, rescue plan, tripod & winch... that's ontop of your confined space ticket...

 

[JMS1972]

Sounds to me like it would be easier to hire a crane and drop to ground level and repair from the outside