Transporting gas bottles.

[Spacecowboy]

I'll be getting an account sorted out with AP in the next few days. I was just wondering if they will allow me to pick up a bottle in an estate car. Just trying to save a bit on delivery.
Will they get uppity about that, or is it common practice?

 

[peterd51]

Hi,

I've never had any query from BOC and I generally put my CO2 bottles on the floor behind the drivers seat. Laid an an angle across the floor they don't roll about much.

Regards
Peter

 

[shenion]

WHen I picked up my last bottle there was a comment from the woman at the counter: "We will not load bottles in a closed vehicle, you will have to load it yourself." Guess they wanted to make sure they are not liable for any accident.

My bottles ride in the passenger seat with a seatbelt firmly fashioned.

 

[ozzman]

perfectly fine, they just give you a data sheet just in case of an accident so that you can give it the the police.

take some sheets with you tho as they leave paint everywhere.

 

[Spacecowboy]

Thanks guys.
Theres loads of room in the estate and I have tie down 'eyes' to keep it strapped in.

 

[hareng]

Not sure on this and possibly something to do with the emergency services knowing what they are dealing with.
You see compressed air stickers on private cars, sure BOC gave me something many years ago for propane.

 

[English Steve]

Not sure on this and possibly something to do with the emergency services knowing what they are dealing with.
You see compressed air stickers on private cars, sure BOC gave me something many years ago for propane.

Yes, you are supposed to show hazard warning diamonds on any vehicle in which 'hazardous freight' is carried. In our case these would be "Non-flammable compressed gas" for shielding gasses and "Flammable compressed gas" for oxy-acetylene etc. I believe that the small propane bottles carried in caravans etc are exempt from these regs due to their size, but I can probably check that on friday if anyone wants clarification.

I used to carry an O/A portapack in an Astra van, with the bottle trolley strapped to the back of the passengers seat by a ratchet strap - carried it like that on and off for several years without incident. Then I decided to do the right thing and put the stickers on the rear window - within two months I was stopped by the police three times to "check that my hazardous cargo was properly secured". Fortunately I didn't have the bottles on board on either occasion. The stickers were duly removed, and I never got stopped again...

 

[storm monkey]

The stickers are required by law in the UK if you are transporting gas for work purposes only. If its for personal use, e.g. no reward, then you are not required to use a sticker. Knowing a few fireman though, they prefer it if people put the stickers up if they are carrying compressed gas, regardless of whether its for work or not. It makes things a damn site safer if you do have an accident, and cannot tell the fire brigade what you are carrying. If you aren't carrying gas though, but leave the sticker up, it delays rescue attempts.

We carry diving gas quite often, and have a compressed gas sign stuck to one of those "baby on board" sucker pad things. Lives in the car and is very easy to put up/remove.

Also, make sure your bottles are well secured. A 12l 232 bar cylinder (std dive tank) contains roughly the same energy as 2 hand grenades, and it the valve is knocked off will do some serious damage.

Phil

 

[English Steve]

I have checked the 'Carriage of dangerous goods' section of the UK Road Vehicles Construction and Use Regs.
As Storm Monkey has already said, "The carriage of dangerous goods by private individuals intended for their personal or domestic use or for their leisure or sporting activities." is an exception under the regulations. However, for those of you who are in business the following should be noted
"The regulations described below are complex and it is only possible to give an outline summary of the very detailed requirements. It is advisable for any operator to have complete copies of the regulations and the associated document — ADR — to ensure full compliance.
Note: There is no quantity of dangerous goods as defined by these regulations that is totally exempt from the requirements, this means that plumbers, builders and other tradesmen may be subject to the regulations. There are concessions for small quantities and certain transport operations (these are explained below)."

The above are direct quotes from C&U regs for information.

Also out of interest (boredom?) I took a look around a local caravan agent, and all new caravans in stock had the warning diamond on the gas bottle stowage locker. This does not appear to be required under the regulations, but is probably considered to be 'good practice'.

Regards

Steve

 

[MarkG]

The transportation of compressed cylinders seems to be a bit of a grey area... however, on from legal point of view, and also being a holder of an ADR licence, here is what I can tell you..

Maximum quanity of gas that can be legally carried in an 'enclosed' vehicle is 2 x 10ltr cylinders. Cars and vans are classed as an enclosed vehicle, unless you have one of those spinning ventilation things fitted.

Flammable gas MUST be carried upright at all times, and in a well ventilated vehicle, ie a flat bed truck.

Warning diamonds must also be displayed. Green for High Pressure, Red for Flammable.

Legal carriage limit for non ADR holders is 999 units. Large HP cylinders are generally 50ltr, therefore 50 units. Flamambles have their value tripled. 47kg propane is 141 units. Large Acetylene is generally 28ltrs, therefore 84 units. 1000+ units fall into ADR regs, and appropriate licence must be held.

Safety data sheets or Trem Cards must be carried with the cylinders, and the carrier MUST know exactly what they are carrying whether you have an ADR licence or not.

The amount of people we get in saying they want a bottle of 'air' is ridicluous, when in fact they want Oxygen.... NOT the same thing !

If you have an accident, the emergency services MUST be told you have cylinders on board, and exactly what they are. Failure to do so can cause un-needed problems, and also get you seriously fined / prison sentence.... there are NO exceptions.

Basically you are carrying a dangerous item, no matter what size of cylinder..

Hope that's helped out a bit.....

 

[English Steve]

Hi MarkG.
I don't hold an ADR, so must accept your knowledge on this subject to be accurate. However, I make my living based on the UK Road Vehicles Construction and Use regs and there is a current copy open on my desk at all times. What I said in my previous post is as printed in those regulations ie there IS an exception for the carriage of dangerous goods by private individuals.

Regards

Steve

 

[madkayaker]

probably work checking the insurance disclaimer for the car as well. I know that my van insurance is exempt if Ive got more than 5KG of gas on board.

 

[knoba]

Thanks madkayaker, I hadn't thought of that!

I use magnetic warning diamonds when I'm carrying gas. It's easier on me, the police and the fire brigade. It's also stipulated that one carries a fire extinguisher suitable for the amount of gas carried (flammable or not? I do not know). I have a Transit van with a partitioned off cab and a special bottle carrier that keeps them upright. I only carry one bottle at a time and my usage is personal.

 

[UncleSatan]

WHen I picked up my last bottle there was a comment from the woman at the counter: "We will not load bottles in a closed vehicle, you will have to load it yourself." Guess they wanted to make sure they are not liable for any accident.

Cool so they wont mind me picking up a bottle on my motorbike then

 

[Chrissi]

All of the transportation info can be found here.

http://www.bcga.co.uk/preview/publications/L12005.pdf

 

[madkayaker]

nothing new but this was in the news today

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/7932429.stm

 

[Welderpaul]

Typical of todays society really.
It'll never be banned. It's too useful!

 

[madkayaker]

agreed

 

[Hitch]

We manage perfectly well without. Propane is the way forward

 

[English Steve]

Propane is the way forward

Been thinking of going that way myself after the insurance premiums I was quoted recently