Right so since we have such a broad knowledge spectrum on this fourm with a vast array of experiance. A mate of mine works on a farm and the owner wants to get new tractors to replace his old ones. He has asksd me as apparently because im a mechanical engineer i know the answer to every thing (i really dont have much of a clue about tractors to be honest). The farmer wants to be able to move tanco silage bales with it ie two on the loader on the front and two on the 3 point hitch at the back. I assume this means he wants a heavy tractor to cope with the weight while the tractor dosent have an even load on it ie 2 on the back before he picks up the two on the front and one with a high hydraulic flow rate to supply the hitch and loader with enough fluid to manage to lift this combination. Any suggestions on what tractor he should be looking at hes concidering anything from deere to valtra to landini/mccormick so i dont think budget is much of an issue.