the snooper
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All cloak and dagger stuff, I bet there will be loads of underhand stuff we will never know about
- Thread starter Tigman
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Tinbasherdan
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There was big money in having the fastest crossing, to white star line management that was worth the risk of essentially running flat out into an ice field.
Another interesting point, the accepted manoeuvre round an obstacle, porting, was the one attempted around the iceberg. This involved turning hard starboard to clear the bow and as the bow drew level, put rudder hard to port to swing the stern out, all whilst running engines hard astern . Titanic had already been noted to be less responsive to her rudder during sea trials, however due to the push to get her to sea quickly the test crew were never allowed to attempt the same manoeuvre but with engines running full forward instead. Had it been tried there's a chance the crew would've been made aware of a slight change in procedure and things might've turned out different.
Another theory is that had she hit bow on she probably would've survived, merely crumpling the bow rather than springing plates
Another interesting point, the accepted manoeuvre round an obstacle, porting, was the one attempted around the iceberg. This involved turning hard starboard to clear the bow and as the bow drew level, put rudder hard to port to swing the stern out, all whilst running engines hard astern . Titanic had already been noted to be less responsive to her rudder during sea trials, however due to the push to get her to sea quickly the test crew were never allowed to attempt the same manoeuvre but with engines running full forward instead. Had it been tried there's a chance the crew would've been made aware of a slight change in procedure and things might've turned out different.
Another theory is that had she hit bow on she probably would've survived, merely crumpling the bow rather than springing plates
Apparently this was proven many years ago when forensic analysts looked at photos of the two ships and according to many of the experts they were renamed and swapped and documentation apparently came to light showing the ships had their names swapped.
The_Yellow_Ardvark
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The_Yellow_Ardvark
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@Tinbasherdan
They were brining more boilers on line all the time, bare in mind even the smaller single ended boiler took aprox 3 days to bring up to full working pressure.
During her sea trials, cut short by bad weather, she had not ever ran with full boilers in steam.
As some one said, ( to lazy to look) it was a matter a big publicicity to arrive early.
They were brining more boilers on line all the time, bare in mind even the smaller single ended boiler took aprox 3 days to bring up to full working pressure.
During her sea trials, cut short by bad weather, she had not ever ran with full boilers in steam.
As some one said, ( to lazy to look) it was a matter a big publicicity to arrive early.
normspanners
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Well I for one had not heard about the fires in the bunkers, if it was quite common for stored coal to spontaneously combust one would have thought the last place one would have wanted the coal was against the hull and you would also think pumps would have been installed to quench or a least cool any fires whilst they where digging out even for the firemen's sake must have been unbearable down there
And that was another rather obvious blunder saying no firemen had survived but had sent them back to britain asap to keep them quiet.
And that was another rather obvious blunder saying no firemen had survived but had sent them back to britain asap to keep them quiet.
The_Yellow_Ardvark
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@normspanners
Just a few bits of information, coal bunkers fires are a pain to put out. In the days of steam the best was to use the coal.
Water being pumped in was ok if the bunker was below 1/3 full. If above that the water would cause the ship to be unstable.
A thing you are drilled about when on board a ship.
The dust when set could form a solid barrier stopping any water getting to the heat.
Today coal carrying ships will now pump, from under the coal an inert gas to drive out the oxygen. Normally CO2 or nitrogen, both can be detected, if they were to leak out of the bunkers or hulls.
The term Fireman is a hard thing to pin down. In the Americas a fireman on a ship wold be a man feeding the boilers with coal. In Europe the same man doing the same job was a stoker.
Both sides used the term "Trimmer" was some one shift coal from bunkers to boilers.
Every man on a ship has his main duties, chef, carpenter electrician. But in Europe your secondary duties could be "Fire Man" The person to dress up and fight a fire. In the Americas he is called a fire fighter.
So reading the to official reports it can be seen how it can be confusing.
But it is true White star got the surviving crew back home, they also banned them from talking to anyone about it. To stop bad press or the wrong information being spread.
Like today, if you are a whiteness and are attending court you are not allowed to discuss the case.
After Titanic the Olympic and Britannic and taken in hand for a double bottom, the bulkheads extended to the weather decks. Oddly White Star took the decision to fit extra life boats. Making the davits capable of handling 2 life boats.
Just a few bits of information, coal bunkers fires are a pain to put out. In the days of steam the best was to use the coal.
Water being pumped in was ok if the bunker was below 1/3 full. If above that the water would cause the ship to be unstable.
A thing you are drilled about when on board a ship.
The dust when set could form a solid barrier stopping any water getting to the heat.
Today coal carrying ships will now pump, from under the coal an inert gas to drive out the oxygen. Normally CO2 or nitrogen, both can be detected, if they were to leak out of the bunkers or hulls.
The term Fireman is a hard thing to pin down. In the Americas a fireman on a ship wold be a man feeding the boilers with coal. In Europe the same man doing the same job was a stoker.
Both sides used the term "Trimmer" was some one shift coal from bunkers to boilers.
Every man on a ship has his main duties, chef, carpenter electrician. But in Europe your secondary duties could be "Fire Man" The person to dress up and fight a fire. In the Americas he is called a fire fighter.
So reading the to official reports it can be seen how it can be confusing.
But it is true White star got the surviving crew back home, they also banned them from talking to anyone about it. To stop bad press or the wrong information being spread.
Like today, if you are a whiteness and are attending court you are not allowed to discuss the case.
After Titanic the Olympic and Britannic and taken in hand for a double bottom, the bulkheads extended to the weather decks. Oddly White Star took the decision to fit extra life boats. Making the davits capable of handling 2 life boats.
Wendelspanswick
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It reminds me of the family of a friend who rented out part of their farm to a company that had industrial sized wood chippers. They created a humongous pile of wood chippings on the farm which caught fire a few summers ago, the fire brigade poured water on it for 2 days solid and then gave up!
In the end it took about 4 months for it to stop smouldering, apparently the smoke and stink alienated all their neighbours. They also got hammered by various authorities including the local authority who deemed that the wood chippings business was a commercial activity and not agricultural so hammered them for business rates on the property.
In the end it took about 4 months for it to stop smouldering, apparently the smoke and stink alienated all their neighbours. They also got hammered by various authorities including the local authority who deemed that the wood chippings business was a commercial activity and not agricultural so hammered them for business rates on the property.
Badger1bear
If your not on fire, then your too far away
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Damn my boy, I found your knowledge on the Titanic enjoyable to read
I like anything like that
The_Yellow_Ardvark
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@Badger1bear
Thank you.
Thank you.
Tinbasherdan
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That's because vark was an original crew member......Damn my boy, I found your knowledge on the Titanic enjoyable to read
Lufbramatt
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On a similar note there was a really interesting documentary on BBC 4 tonight about the Queen Mary, worth looking up. Didn't realise she accidentally rammed a destroyer in 1942, sliced it clean in half, but had to carry on sailing as they were still in danger of being caught by u boats. Sobering stuff.
The_Yellow_Ardvark
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@Tinbasherdan
No, not true.
I was Bos'win on the Ark.
I thought Nelson was a bar steward, but Noah was worse. On watch 40 days and nights.
Talk about watch on stop on.
No, not true.
I was Bos'win on the Ark.
I thought Nelson was a bar steward, but Noah was worse. On watch 40 days and nights.
Talk about watch on stop on.
The_Yellow_Ardvark
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@Lufbramatt
It was the Olympic who sliced the Nantucket Lightship in half, did not even know.
It was the Olympic who sliced the Nantucket Lightship in half, did not even know.
Cobbler
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It was owned by his ancestor, it was the White Vark Line
Lufbramatt
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normspanners
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Thank you for the info I was referring to the stokers as 'firemen' as the documentary did ie men who stoked the boilers as per a train stoker,
No--------
he was an advisor in the original enquiry------please get it right !!
No-------- he was an advisor in the original enquiry------please get it right !!
The_Yellow_Ardvark
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@Lufbramatt
Thanks, reading it now.
Thanks, reading it now.
The_Yellow_Ardvark
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@normspanners
Yes, I was.
But that is what annoys me about shoes like that, the latch onto one bit of information and build a theory round it.
It is interesting that on some on the 3 sisters photographs the negatives, glass slides and the photos wee "touched up".
classic one is in one image the Titanic name is in the wrong place. It was painted in afterwards, the negative came to light in the 1980's. Oh yes that is often quoted as "proof" that the titanic was swopped with the Olympic.
They now are saying that it may be the case on the show that 2 two main images may have the same thing happened to them.
Will be interesting to wait and find out.
Yes, I was.
But that is what annoys me about shoes like that, the latch onto one bit of information and build a theory round it.
It is interesting that on some on the 3 sisters photographs the negatives, glass slides and the photos wee "touched up".
classic one is in one image the Titanic name is in the wrong place. It was painted in afterwards, the negative came to light in the 1980's. Oh yes that is often quoted as "proof" that the titanic was swopped with the Olympic.
They now are saying that it may be the case on the show that 2 two main images may have the same thing happened to them.
Will be interesting to wait and find out.
the snooper
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so what are we saying here, have I got this right? that the ships name plates were swapped and it wasn't actually the titanic that sank ? if that was the case it would have been all over the news when they found the titanic on the ocean floor because only the titanic had all 4 funnels working the other although it had 4 one was a dummy, titanic had more boilers
