Talking about your wage with co workers

[Nick67GT]

Well according to this the average hourly rate in the west midlands is £8.88

https://www.payscale.com/research/UK/Location=Birmingham-England:-West-Midlands/Salary

Like I said though, just a stop gap, £10 is the absolute bare minimum I will work for

Our illustrious HR department (or business prevention department as they became known) would use similar published data, as in the link above, when profiling for recruitment.

It didn’t matter what (relevant) experience or qualifications a candidate had, their initial screening of applicants was based purely on whether or not the 3rd Party data (industry standard salary for that role) matched what the applicant was looking for.

They would simply reject any applicant who did not fall within the published bands.

So it was no small surprise when those who were considered worthy of being released for second interview by the likes of myself, were at best ‘average’.

And you could research this for recruiting in any country, for any any job title, in any profession.

I looked up my job title and location once and after discovered my package and benefits were pretty damned generous, thanks largely to the old school Personnel (sorry, HR) Manager who recruited me in the first place, before the fluffy clowns got hold of the system and messed it up royally.

Bit off topic, for which I apologise, but I had continual fights with these buffoons to try and get them to understand why experience was worth paying for and retaining thereafter.

 

[Climber]

I’m not sure where to begin with that logic - while some part of it may be true, ie the part that lots of people don’t “think” they can have such a job - the plain fact is that “most” jobs paying that kind of salary demand a certain level of experience which “most” people don’t have.

There are of course exceptions where you can earn fantastic money without this, but as a general rule this is perfectly true. Surely the fact that the top paying jobs account for a small percentage of the population tells you that these jobs are not common?

I don't dispute top jobs aren't common, and I appreciate many require relevant experience, that's why I referenced guidance at an early age.

 

[Climber]

I must have worked for a few people your brother gave career advice too!

Seems to me blagging it, always pays more than real skills!

I think that's how the world of big corporates works. It's the reason it never even crossed my mind to join it. I have always been self employed, and have only ever had clients who are either self employed, or owners of fairly small businesses. Office politics and other corporate BS would do my head in.

 

[daleyd]

I don't dispute top jobs aren't common, and I appreciate many require relevant experience, that's why I referenced guidance at an early age.

So I’m a bit lost as to the point your trying to make? That anyone could have a “top job” given the right advice, early enough?

Well it’s an idea I suppose (And not one that I particularly disagree with, what I do disagree with is that there is some magical advice which is available to do this) , but one that relies on a lot of assumptions.

• The advice/guidance you give is still valid at some unspecified time in the future, for an example see jobs in IT in the mid 90’s (well paid and lots of them) to the same in 2000’s (money through the floor and lots of people doing it).
• That the young person you are giving the advice to is capable of carrying it through, or indeed even wants to be considered for a “top job” at some unspecified point in the future.
  
• Given that a good portion of the jobs at 70k plus are positions where some kind of high level education and ongoing professional training are required (doctors, lawyers, pilots, accountancy, engineering etc) the plain fact is that they are not open to anyone - so of the top 5% of positions a much smaller number of those would actually be open to anyone. In fact about the only job I can think of paying that sort of money that you don’t actually need any qualifications or experience for is an MP.

From a personal point of view, my advice to my own children when they get to that stage will be something along the lines of “do something that gives you satisfaction, that hopefully you will enjoy. If your good enough at it and have the right work ethic forget about the money, enjoy what you do first and foremeost”. If after all of that they become driven by money alone, to the extent that they regard someone who doesn’t earn the same as inferior, then on some level I will have failed.

 

[armalites]

@Climber i never knew what I wanted to do when I left school I still don’t at 35

If stripped of everything tomorrow I could turn my hand to anything and succeed as I have drive and passion both can’t be taught

The last one was the main recruiting point of nasa

All of this is as important as any qualifications, my eldest lad knows what he wants to do but he is a grafter and will try anything. He turns 16 in the next week, owns 3 Land Rovers, a Fordson Major,3 pit bikes and has his own tools. All of this done with his own money, he has a job and also does work for 2-3 other people in the village. He's waiting for his provisional licence to arrive so he can take his tractor test.

Do I have any concerns whether he will get on in the world? Absolutely not. The job he does at the weekend sometime works out at £15/h if the weather is good and he can get it done quick.

 

[reb78]

Our illustrious HR department (or business prevention department as they became known)

Haha - we have several of those in our place, HR are just one tier of it.....

 

[Climber]

All of this is as important as any qualifications, my eldest lad knows what he wants to do but he is a grafter and will try anything. He turns 16 in the next week, owns 3 Land Rovers, a Fordson Major,3 pit bikes and has his own tools. All of this done with his own money, he has a job and also does work for 2-3 other people in the village. He's waiting for his provisional licence to arrive so he can take his tractor test.

Do I have any concerns whether he will get on in the world? Absolutely not. The job he does at the weekend sometime works out at £15/h if the weather is good and he can get it done quick.

I completely agree. Many of the most successful people I know haven't had a University education, and some of the most useless people I know have a Masters.

 

[premmington]

So I’m a bit lost as to the point your trying to make? That anyone could have a “top job” given the right advice, early enough?

Well it’s an idea I suppose (And not one that I particularly disagree with, what I do disagree with is that there is some magical advice which is available to do this) , but one that relies on a lot of assumptions.

• The advice/guidance you give is still valid at some unspecified time in the future, for an example see jobs in IT in the mid 90’s (well paid and lots of them) to the same in 2000’s (money through the floor and lots of people doing it).
• That the young person you are giving the advice to is capable of carrying it through, or indeed even wants to be considered for a “top job” at some unspecified point in the future.
  
• Given that a good portion of the jobs at 70k plus are positions where some kind of high level education and ongoing professional training are required (doctors, lawyers, pilots, accountancy, engineering etc) the plain fact is that they are not open to anyone - so of the top 5% of positions a much smaller number of those would actually be open to anyone. In fact about the only job I can think of paying that sort of money that you don’t actually need any qualifications or experience for is an MP.

From a personal point of view, my advice to my own children when they get to that stage will be something along the lines of “do something that gives you satisfaction, that hopefully you will enjoy. If your good enough at it and have the right work ethic forget about the money, enjoy what you do first and foremeost”. If after all of that they become driven by money alone, to the extent that they regard someone who doesn’t earn the same as inferior, then on some level I will have failed.

+1 for all of the above

 

[armalites]

https://www.theguardian.com/inequal...tains-highest-earners-feel-about-their-income

All reporting is biased no matter how unbiased they claim to be and it is completely unsurprising the Guardian managed to find some top earners who think they should pay more taxes.

 

[daleyd]

All reporting is biased no matter how unbiased they claim to be and it is completely unsurprising the Guardian managed to find some top earners who think they should pay more taxes.

Yes, I just thought it was a mildly interesting take on the subject, I'm certainly not under any illusion that any media outlet has their own angle to put on things.

 

[armalites]

It is surprising how low relatively the number is that gets you into the top 1%

 

[JLP]

I previously worked at a place where everyone knew the salary of people on the same level as them and that of their supervisor. The only guy we didn't know his salary had been there 40 odd years and was like a welding yoda, if he didn't know it or couldn't explain it to you then no chance in hell it was possible. We all respected him for that and knew damn well he was on more than our supervisor but nobody ever knew the exact amount.

The fact we all knew each others wage just lead to a complete nightmare because everyone would complain about those who didn't pull their weight and wouldn't even make half the components you could in a given timeframe. Ended up with everyone working at the slowest mans pace and completely ran the company into the ground

 

[premmington]

So I’m a bit lost as to the point your trying to make? That anyone could have a “top job” given the right advice, early enough?

Well it’s an idea I suppose (And not one that I particularly disagree with, what I do disagree with is that there is some magical advice which is available to do this) , but one that relies on a lot of assumptions.

• The advice/guidance you give is still valid at some unspecified time in the future, for an example see jobs in IT in the mid 90’s (well paid and lots of them) to the same in 2000’s (money through the floor and lots of people doing it).
• That the young person you are giving the advice to is capable of carrying it through, or indeed even wants to be considered for a “top job” at some unspecified point in the future.
  
• Given that a good portion of the jobs at 70k plus are positions where some kind of high level education and ongoing professional training are required (doctors, lawyers, pilots, accountancy, engineering etc) the plain fact is that they are not open to anyone - so of the top 5% of positions a much smaller number of those would actually be open to anyone. In fact about the only job I can think of paying that sort of money that you don’t actually need any qualifications or experience for is an MP.

From a personal point of view, my advice to my own children when they get to that stage will be something along the lines of “do something that gives you satisfaction, that hopefully you will enjoy. If your good enough at it and have the right work ethic forget about the money, enjoy what you do first and foremeost”. If after all of that they become driven by money alone, to the extent that they regard someone who doesn’t earn the same as inferior, then on some level I will have failed.

I am gonna make a statement here.

"I think enterprise has a higher value than education"

Based on the fact only a few people get rich - million pound jobs in finance and law thru education.

But lots of other people have earned - lots more than anybody would have paid them - working for themselves.

Cutting your employers cut out of the equation - has to lead to higher incomes.

 

[Parm]

I am gonna make a statement here.

"I think enterprise has a higher value than education"

Based on the fact only a few people get rich - million pound jobs in finance and law thru education.

But lots of other people have earned - lots more than anybody would have paid them - working for themselves.

Cutting your employers cut out of the equation - has to lead to higher incomes.

Only a few folk get rich through education. More people make money through enterprise.

One of my good mates in West London is a bit flush. He worked hard running a small business. lots of sacrifice and often 7 days on the trot.

Got out of the business and used the money to move into the property game. Ended up with over 250 residential properties in west London

Moved out of this and is now buying commercial property, whole blocks and estates at a time.

Its no secret that hes made lots of money, he lives in a nice area, big house, few fancy cars etc etc.

But he hasn't let it get to his head, never any mention of what he earns, never any mention of what hes got or worth, never looks down at anyone, Never the flash bar steward. Just a regular normal bloke

 

[daleyd]

I am gonna make a statement here.

"I think enterprise has a higher value than education"

Based on the fact only a few people get rich - million pound jobs in finance and law thru education.

But lots of other people have earned - lots more than anybody would have paid them - working for themselves.

Cutting your employers cut out of the equation - has to lead to higher incomes.

I don’t think it has a higher value, but I’d certainly agree it’s of no lesser value. The 2 are not mutually exclusive either - lots of “educated” people have gone on to make successful businesses, it doesn’t simply follow that people who make a go at being self employed are the ones who didn’t do well academically - although you could argue they have more to gain by throwing the dice so to speak.

Talking about working for yourself and being self employed is another topic really, this was about salaries compared to other people in the workplace which kind of implies employed people.

 

[Appyasme 3]

Just go on benefits.You get it all .I over heard recently that a person claiming caring allowance was off to Tenerife.Who is the MUG.

 

[Robotstar5]

I have always been self employed and "wages" are sort of irrelevant, I just take what I need to do the things I want. There is no point in killing the golden goose unnecessarily.

Bob

I wish my old boss had done that, he took more than his company could afford resulting in the company being wound up owing lots of suppliers, but he would always have another company running in the background which would buy the assets at a knock-down price and carry on, usually from the same premises, this happened 3 times while I worked there.

 

[Robotstar5]

Just go on benefits.You get it all .I over heard recently that a person claiming caring allowance was off to Tenerife.Who is the MUG.

Did they book with Thomas Cook?

 

[TechnicAl]

Just do on benefits.You get it all .I over heard recently that a person claiming caring allowance was off to Tenerife.Who is the MUG.

Carers allowance isnt much so they must be going on the cheap.......they can still look after someone there

 

[Appyasme 3]

Did they book with Thomas Cook?

I hope they did.Still they will propably come back first class as they know how to scrounge.