Sliding gate advice

[dan.taylor.1]

Hi folks,

I've been asked to quote for a sliding gate by a customer, I've never done one before and not really sure how they work or are constructed. Can those in the know point me in the direction of some useful sites or give any advice!

Cheers,

Dan

 

[Brad93]

Hi folks,

I've been asked to quote for a sliding gate by a customer, I've never done one before and not really sure how they work or are constructed. Can those in the know point me in the direction of some useful sites or give any advice!

Cheers,

Dan

There’s a few different types. Cantilever or rail on ground

 

[dan.taylor.1]

It would have to be cantilever I think Brad as unfortunately the customer was having the drive tarmacced the day I went to measure up, would have been better if they'd called before hand.

It's a 3.8m wide drive, so would need to be maybe 4.5 on the gate plus the extra for the cantilever.

Its the runners and posts I'm not sure of.

 

[bletchmonster]

Hello Dan. The rolling gear suppliers will often advise what gear you need and how to size the foundation. Use good quality rollers and don't scrimp on the spec. Rolling gate gear can have a habit of failing after a surprisingly short time if not well on top of its job!

 

[bletchmonster]

Oh, and if it's automated, unless you're well into that, get a professional installer to deal with that side as the safety issues are a minefield.
I used to do my own gate automation but now stick to the fab side as I didn't feel I was sufficiently on top of the legislation.

 

[KemppiFrog]

If you can do it with a ground rail, it is far easier. I use the half round rail with matching wheels and put the wheels in the bottom tube, usually 80X40. But, very much depends on the scale of things. Mine are domestic and usually rectangular. If a bit commercial, then lots heavier. One plus is that the loads on posts are way less, as the weight is on the wheels, not twisting the posts.

 

[KemppiFrog]

Oh, and if it's automated, unless you're well into that, get a professional installer to deal with that side as the safety issues are a minefield.
I used to do my own gate automation but now stick to the fab side as I didn't feel I was sufficiently on top of the legislation.

Me too, used to do a lot of automation, but non now.

 

[winchman]

If its automated run away now.
Far to many accidents and liability for my liking.

 

[Brad93]

https://www.fhbrundle.co.uk/groups/13C__Sliding_Gate

I really like the telescopic gates but most of the ones I see are usually broke. Haha

 

[500e]

As said don't skimp on rollers it is surprising how the wind affects them the catcher\ guide needs to be wide enough to cope with the gate in windy conditions.
Will try & post some photos of a few we have done in the last 12 months

 

[dan.taylor.1]

Don't worry, definitely manual, not even contemplating powered as I know there's too many hoops to jump through hse wise.

Ground rail isn't an option as they've just had the drive tarmacced and the guys doing it told me the gas main, water main and sewer pipe are really close to the surface...

What's that, utilities not adhering to their own rules, no....!!

So cantilever it is. There's tons of space inline with the gate for it to slide into when open. Anyone got any manufacturer details of the roller gear?

The gate will be an arch top, so looking st it the gear will have to be at the back of the gate.

 

[KemppiFrog]

Don't worry, definitely manual, not even contemplating powered as I know there's too many hoops to jump through hse wise.

Ground rail isn't an option as they've just had the drive tarmacced and the guys doing it told me the gas main, water main and sewer pipe are really close to the surface...

What's that, utilities not adhering to their own rules, no....!!

So cantilever it is. There's tons of space inline with the gate for it to slide into when open. Anyone got any manufacturer details of the roller gear?

The gate will be an arch top, so looking st it the gear will have to be at the back of the gate.

The utilities would have to be really close to the surface for the rail fixings to be a problem, like 50mm.
Arched top and cantilevered... What fun!

 

[Olderisbetter]

Interesting reading, I am just trying to plan out a sliding gate but i want automated so i guess quite a bit of planning is involved i was hoping to put any posts in the ground at the same time as my new wall footings go in ..

 

[Wedg1e]

I look after a number of jackleg cabins for the MOD that are split into two rooms, one of which is lined with lead for use as a radiography bay.
There's a sliding door between the two rooms, also leaded of course. The door is propelled by a floor-mounted CAME BX-series (I think) and is mounted to the wall (sheet steel behind the lead) using linear rails top and bottom, the Hepco style with Vee edges and wheels either side.
Great for accuracy and low friction, but not so great for another thing: there's no bloody provision for expansion and contraction. As the seasons change the cabin and door expand and contract, so sometimes it'll jam, either tripping the motor current limit or blowing the fuse.
The motor's inside the x-ray room, as is the door...

 

[Wedg1e]

If its automated run away now.
Far to many accidents and liability for my liking.

Shouldn't be a problem with proper guarding, proximity/edge contact sensors etc., they only move at a snail's pace.
The ones I've worked with, the finesse was all in the setup and programming (ramp-up/down, personnel access width on a vehicle gate, auto-reverse etc.).
The scariest sliding door I ever saw was in Dhahran, Saudi; 24 tonnes balancing on 2 wheels on a railway track with a single nylon wheel holding it at the top - and chain drive! Designed and built in the US of A
Biggest I've seen recently is 130 tonnes on a blast-proof radiography bay; it's 4 feet thick.
There's a lead-lined door around Southampton somewhere that weighs 60T and it swings on hydraulic rams, takes about 5 minutes from closed to open. If you got between it and the wall it opens against you wouldn't be worrying about Covid-19

 

[theoss]

If you ask BFT they should provide a link to a bit of a design package they have which will tell you the concrete requirements for the foundation pad for a cantilever gate.

Safety wise there can be no unprotected pinch points. Protection can be mechanical or electrical (or both). For example infill meshed over. The whole area of travel needs to be considered. On completion a force test is required with a special instrument.

Gone are the days of one pair of safety photocells, although still plenty around.

 

[theoss]

Shouldn't be a problem with proper guarding, proximity/edge contact sensors etc., they only move at a snail's pace.
The ones I've worked with, the finesse was all in the setup and programming (ramp-up/down, personnel access width on a vehicle gate, auto-reverse etc.).
The scariest sliding door I ever saw was in Dhahran, Saudi; 24 tonnes balancing on 2 wheels on a railway track with a single nylon wheel holding it at the top - and chain drive! Designed and built in the US of A
Biggest I've seen recently is 130 tonnes on a blast-proof radiography bay; it's 4 feet thick.
There's a lead-lined door around Southampton somewhere that weighs 60T and it swings on hydraulic rams, takes about 5 minutes from closed to open. If you got between it and the wall it opens against you wouldn't be worrying about Covid-19

Do you know of the one on Cardington hangers? Used to be a Rotinoff wagon on tne steam rally scene which was used to close the doors after the mechanism failed

 

[Wedg1e]

Do you know of the one on Cardington hangers? Used to be a Rotinoff wagon on tne steam rally scene which was used to close the doors after the mechanism failed

No... in fact I think I've only ever driven past Cardington once, though I can't think where I'd have been going to/from... [runs off to Google Earth EDIT - probably Sandridge]
I thought most of the big WW2-era doors had hand-cranks with reduction boxes, I know the Cardington sheds are big, mind...! 1920s, or earlier?

 

[KemppiFrog]

No... in fact I think I've only ever driven past Cardington once, though I can't think where I'd have been going to/from... [runs off to Google Earth EDIT - probably Sandridge]
I thought most of the big WW2-era doors had hand-cranks with reduction boxes, I know the Cardington sheds are big, mind...! 1920s, or earlier?

I have been at a few RAF fields with the big hand cranked doors. Quite easy to get them moving....less so to stop.. One of the fitters said that if they fell on you, the draft would blow you out safely. 'Yeah, you can try it first' was my response.

When I was doing automated doors, they were still evolving. Started with just the photo cells, then torque settings in case something obstructed out of the cells line. Not contact strips yet then. The hydraulic sets always had adjustable PRVs, so a type of torque limit.
Interestingly, virtually all the kit came from Italy, even if it was labeled Bosch. Exception was Came. Best by far was FAAC, at a price.
KF

 

[theoss]

Re cardington. It whats the owner of the wagon told me (hes sold it abroad now). He showed me pictures of the hangers being used by the building research establishment to test timber buildings for resistance against fire and explosives. Wagin had been previously used to test airfields.

Re gates. I used BFT mostly and came. Last one I fitted was a BFT deimos slider with torque controls etc. Firms are picking up work binning old systems since gatesafe and door federation compliance cannot be achieved. I had a requirement at customer request for safety edges in 2006 but they were hard to find except the expensive type used around robotics.

Im looking to restart in automation but time probably isn't right and im not fully conversant with the type of safety edges required. i was sent a catalogue with 200 pages

There is currently a lot of talk about a company called roger technology..