Silly idea of the day - pop riveted boat building ?

[CompoSimmonite]

I've always fancied a micro canal boat (and thus towable / easy to launch) and reckon 8' is the shortest I could make one yet still be able to sleep inside as a single berth or for 2 people to day cruise.
For some reason today I've been thinking of this again and am wondering about building one out of aluminium rather than steel. It's just a silly Friday type idea but basically all joints overlap with Sikaflex-221 or similar sealant and sealed pop rivets.
What is peoples opinion of this type of construction ?
Looking at US sites about aluminium boats pop rivets seem to be frowned upon with solid rivets being the method used.

 

[Bobtail4x4]

wont the pop rivets leak?

 

[CRB]

If the little ball ends do not seal then you have a Jaccuzzi on her maiden voyage. That may be why there is a concern, and the subsequent penchant for solid rivets.

 

[Rocketman]

Just put in the search engine 'pop rivet aluminum boat' and there is loads of info/threads on it. Seems a bit old fashioned from a few I quickly read. One guy was saying they stop doing them in the 60's and welding took over.

 

[hotrodder]

Pop riveting is like hoovering instead of vacuuming... POP is a brand name that's become synonymous with blind rivets. Cheap/nasty ones at least [/pedantic]

Closed end (sealed) blind rivets would fix leaks via the hole left from the mandrel. POP, Advel and probably a bunch of other brands make this style in a variety of materials including pure ally and AlMg5 bodies with a choice of mandrel material

 

[cumbriasteve]

I used to be involved with boating (sea) but never any ali one's, I did look very briefly into them due to their easy launch and the speed that could be obtained without the need of a massive outboard that gave you swollen wotsits every time you lifted it off the transom.

I think it is common to use marine grade ali for the build, that may however just be essential for the coastal side of boating and may not be needed for freshwater.

Solid rivets are the norm and as such they are easy enough to do, I watched a couple of guys with a good set of formers and each rivet was done with 3 hits.

Welding of course is so much nicer unless you are very brave... in Australia in the 80's, as an advertising gimmick for a marine adhesive, a firm built one with adhesive holding 25mm overlaps, no welds and no rivets...they then put a 50hp Mercury engine on the back and tore around for a couple of hours in a well known shark area with four blokes pretending to smile and have total trust in the glue....I think they survived.

 

[sardine]

If you get someone else with a boat to declare it as their "tender" no licence is required on the canal.

 

[CompoSimmonite]

Pop riveting is like hoovering instead of vacuuming... POP is a brand name that's become synonymous with blind rivets. Cheap/nasty ones at least [/pedantic]

Closed end (sealed) blind rivets would fix leaks via the hole left from the mandrel. POP, Advel and probably a bunch of other brands make this style in a variety of materials including pure ally and AlMg5 bodies with a choice of mandrel material

I'm used to sealed rivets (got several boxes) after years of Land Rovers For a boat I think a stainless mandrel would be needed.

This isn't a serious idea but just yet another mental exercise (I'm not well enough to physically do much at present)

 

[Rocketman]

I used to be involved with boating (sea) but never any ali one's, I did look very briefly into them due to their easy launch and the speed that could be obtained without the need of a massive outboard that gave you swollen wotsits every time you lifted it off the transom.

I think it is common to use marine grade ali for the build, that may however just be essential for the coastal side of boating and may not be needed for freshwater.

Solid rivets are the norm and as such they are easy enough to do, I watched a couple of guys with a good set of formers and each rivet was done with 3 hits.

Welding of course is so much nicer unless you are very brave... in Australia in the 80's, as an advertising gimmick for a marine adhesive, a firm built one with adhesive holding 25mm overlaps, no welds and no rivets...they then put a 50hp Mercury engine on the back and tore around for a couple of hours in a well known shark area with four blokes pretending to smile and have total trust in the glue....I think they survived.

Actually in this day and age now I would think there are plenty of epoxies that would do the job. Lets face it the tech has been used in cars for some time now.

 

[CRB]

Actually in this day and age now I would think there are plenty of epoxies that would do the job. Lets face it the tech has been used in cars for some time now.

My thoughts too, Audi wheels were glued but then they decided to put superfluous fixings in too, because a focus group thought it looked safer.

MZ Skorpion frame was glued, and then they put a fixing through it....see above.

 

[Rocketman]

Hey CRB don't forget the Lotus Elise chassis, that must have been back in the mid 90s when they started doing that.

Dyatech bikes too, though they tended to fail after a few years

 

[ajlelectronics]

Pop riveting is like hoovering instead of vacuuming... POP is a brand name that's become synonymous with blind rivets. Cheap/nasty ones at least [/pedantic]

I didn't know that, so thankyou. I hate the "hoovering" word, so I must stop the "Pop" ;-)

 

[lotus 30]

Have a look at albatross marine on his web site then go to face book to see how albatross boats were made you can get blank pop rivets but they corrode use solid rivets when you get into it it is quite rewarding

 

[hotrodder]

I'm used to sealed rivets (got several boxes) after years of Land Rovers For a boat I think a stainless mandrel would be needed.

This isn't a serious idea but just yet another mental exercise (I'm not well enough to physically do much at present)

Sorry, should've been clearer that the sealed blind rivet thing wasn't directed at you as you mentioned 'em in the OP. I Spelt Avdel wrong too

Stainless and ally don't always play nicely together hence the corrosion thing mentioned. Aluminium/aluminium blind rivets would be better from a corrosion POV, probably still not as good as solid rivets though due to the crevices at the mandrel end? Shear and tensile strength are a chunk lower for say a rivet with both an AlMg body and mandrel which might be a non deal if the dia is increased? Solid rivets would be cheaper and better looking IMO

Hey CRB don't forget the Lotus Elise chassis, that must have been back in the mid 90s when they started doing that.

Dyatech bikes too, though they tended to fail after a few years

IIRC Lotus claimed that either 'glue' or the Ejot fasteners were good enough on their own but they complimented each other... the fasteners help alignment/prevent creep while the adhesive cures?

 

[Robotstar5]

Range Rover bodyshells are held together with self piercing rivets, so no mandrel hole to leak - link

 

[langy]

If you want to set rivets you just need an air chisel and a mandrel, I bought a cheap air chisel and modified one of the bits to an inverted dome shape, I use a heavy block behind them and a quick buzz with the gun and its sets the rivets real tight.

 

[langy]

Regarding glueing the aluminium I use Fusor 127, it's a 2 pack bonding glue which sets hard, it's impossible to get apart once set

 

[outofthefire]

We build ally wagon bodies with sealed rivets and Sikaflex type sealer, they don't leak and they are pretty much impossible to take apart without destroying the panel. If your design's right i'd trust them to work.

 

[Kent]

I don't know what your bit of canal is like but on the Leeds-Liverpool you have novices in blooming big steel barges and allsorts of submerged nasties. sounds like sleeping in a coffin to me. Some of the damage I see on my mates hire fleet makes a launchable ali barge a non starter from the off for me personally. I have been in many Ali boats from super speedy American bass boats to basic dories, I like them but I think as a small barge that you can put in on a slipway? bad idea! Always fancied building my own centre console sea angling boat though (one day perhaps) looking at prices it could be quite a profitable business to take up in.

 

[Kent]

Regarding glueing the aluminium I use Fusor 127, it's a 2 pack bonding glue which sets hard, it's impossible to get apart once set

Could you post were to get it and a cost please? Am looking for something like this for a job