Second hand Gas bottles???

[swampy21]

Hey there, just after some advice on the above topic.

Just bought a new Mig and though I don't do much welding i'm gonna move from disposables to reffilable bottles.

Never used these before, and seems that a lot of people rent the bottles. However I've seen quite a few of these around second hand, both BOC style and pub gas style CO2 bottles.

Got a few Qs about these though:

Is there a reason why i should avoid buying a second hand bottle, over renting one?

Do bottles have to carry a certificate or anything in order to get them re-filled? if so what form does this come in? i.e markings/plate/paper certificate?

Also from what i can work out, argon is stored at higher preassure than co2 so if i buy an argon bottle i can then potentially use it for co2 or argon co2 mix. Is this correct.

Sorry for all the Qs, and thanks in advance for any help

Dan

 

[Drains]

In short - bottles are usually exchanged, not filled. If it's a pubgas co2 bottle, it'll be low ish pressure, get it from your friendly publican, nae bother.

If it's argon/co2 and you're using BOC but you have your own bottle then you do the rent new bottle, wait a week or two, take bottle off hire, end up with full bottle and no hire charge blag.

But bottles are not filled in an arbitrary, whatever you want fashion. They are colour coded for a particular mixture/gas and no supplier will change the content (they'd get locked up!)

Other suppliers. Air Products/BOC, same price mol. Other than them, I don't know. Search the threads on the site for suppliers and give 'em a tinkle. Depends where you live as to what's available...Put up your location and there are lots of folk here who could give suggestions.

Si

 

[Gasman]

YES,Any so called second hand bottles many of which are found in classified ads & auction sites are never the rightful property of those individuals selling them.

I would steer clear of stolen bottles most of which are out of test and potentially dangerous.

Certificates are held by the company who owns the bottle.
Pubgas often contains Nitrogen which is carp for welding also an adapter is required to fit a pub bottle to a welding regulator (if you can get pure CO2)

If you send a PM with your location I may be able to assist with a legal but sensibly priced solution.

 

[swampy21]

thanks guys,

I thought maybe there was something to watch out for with these.

I sent you a PM GasMan.

Are there any other alternatives to renting a bottle, cus if i'm only actually doing any welding about 3 or 4 weeks a year, it seems a shame to be shelling out 40quid a year or so for bottle rent.

Seems some places do a deposit system rather than bottle rent. Which ones are these likely to be?

Cheers

Dan

 

[aametalmaster]

I am in the US so things may be different over here but i just had some dealings on 2 used bottles.
#1 a large 150 size CO2 painted blue with a name cast into the neck ring and the ex owners company written on the bottle and it was 14 years out of test plus it was FREE. I took it to my local welding sales and they sent me to a guy that re tests them for 11 bucks, he re tested it and filled it with C02 with no questions asked.

#2 a small OX bottle about a foot tall. I bought it at a flea market 1,000 miles from my house. I took it to my LWS and asked if i could get it filled, he said do you want it today. It cost me 7 bucks to fill and again no questions asked. Now it has 1 year left on the test date and he told me where to take it again.

I have talked to several places that fill them and they all told me they don't check paperwork on the small bottles only on the big bottles factories and construction sites use and there is usally no problem filling them unless they are out of date. Just my .02....Bob

 

[gypo]

Hi

I had the same idea, I found me a 2kg Co2 bottle on ebay, good price and brand new and empty.....

After contacting the cylinder makers I found out though it was new it was actually made in 1994, never been tested since being made and it was made for use as a fire extinguisher.
What is the difference? They told me that the cylinder walls are thicker on the industrial cylinders to take the knocks that those type of bottles get. It was suggested that with a protective jacket there would be no problem using it for MIG welding.
Though the walls are thinner they tell me that there is no difference to the pressure the bottle would be filled to, something to do with size, valve thread and a few other bits....

Spent ages looking for someone to test and fill it for me, Energas said testing would be in the £100's, BOC didn't reply to my emails, Air Products responded with their own hire price list.

Then after a couple of months ringing round the country in desperation thinking I'd have to go and rent one from the big boys a company in Nottingham said they would test and charge it for me.

Wow! I'd got there at last,
Testing was £15 and it won't need another for 5 years. Filling with Co2 was £5... and lasts for weeks. Now I'm considering buying one of their bottles £50 ish for a 50ltr Co2 and just £7 to fill it......
They do a Argon/Co2 mix bottle for a similar price but don't refill them... That costs £10 a time from another Notts based company...

So there are some good deals out there it just needs a determined person to keep going when everyone seems to frown on the privately owned cylinders and make it difficult for us.

I thought I'd done the wrong thing and would end up selling the bottle, now I still might sell it and get a couple of the bigger ones...

Gypo

 

[marknotgeorge]

You got any details of the companies in Nottingham?

 

[gypo]

Companies in Notts

Hi

Both these companies are based in Nottingham and they supply, retest
and fill cylinders.

- Gas Container Services Ltd. - 0115 9577778
- Jackson-Keay limited - 0115 9617113

Gypo

 

[scotb]

sh bottles

any suppliers in eccosseland falkirk?

 

[tazuk]

re gas bottle re fill

do any of these ????????????
i have a boc argon bottle about 3 feet high wot was gave to me will any of these re fill with co2 { can co2 be used for welding now ???? }or argon mix or is there any body in notts that will thanks as no lable on bottle now ps i have a clarke 195 tec also new to welding needing to learn
tazuk thanks ????????????

re quote below
Both these companies are based in Nottingham and they supply, retest
and fill cylinders.

- Gas Container Services Ltd. - 0115 9577778
- Jackson-Keay limited - 0115 9617113

Gypo

 

[gypo]

Hi

I doubt that any of them will fill with a gas they are not made for,,, something to do with the laws governing the filling and use of gas bottles ..... Something to do with safety :-)

But

Gas Container Services Ltd. - 0115 9577778
Fill and supply bottles of for a variety of gasses and so they might fill your bottle with the gas it is made for....

I don't know of any that will fill it without it being in date for test so have a look on the bottle for the test date before as the test costs about £15...

I found both very helpful when I called them so give them a call, I doubt either will try to sell you something you don't need. They were a great help to me on the phone and when I went round to see them....
Gas Container Services Ltd even delivered a bottle free of charge.

Yes Co2 can be used but Co2 & Argon mix would be better. Gas Container Services Ltd will supply that too....

Hope this helps
Gypo.

 

[Stuggi]

The Argon/Co2 game is pretty much rent or buy an exchangeable, like with the propane tanks (one company does it here in Finland, which is quite handy).

When it comes to Oxy/Ace. you can save a bit on old bottles, I sent in a '55 set for testing and filling, both cleared, and now they're certified for the next 10 years. The testing is gonna cost about a third of what rental over that period would have cost me, only problem is that it takes a couple of weeks to get them refilled, but since they're 5 feet tall tanks, I'm probably not gonna use all of 'em in 10 years!

 

[tazuk]

re co2 re fills

i also found in admag in nottingham there is a place in eastwood in nottingham { fire extinguishers }that re fill for £12;00 but you will have to call them first also thay only fill them on a monday thay will also sell you a bottle if you want


01773 715978
07808 002592

 

[powernut]

any idea for possible buying a large bottle of pure argon , as i can possibly buy a empty one stamped dated etc , but its empty for 80.00 ,,och , anyone know of a ossible company that will sell a large bottle of argon ,, south yorkshire area ,,

 

[Wozzaaah]

You don't BUY them, you RENT them.
Look in the sticky list for a supplier near you.

 

[powernut]

You don't BUY them, you RENT them.
Look in the sticky list for a supplier near you.

ive tryed to look , carnt seem to find a (air works suppiler near me for argon )
as i think ill buy this large one for 100 and i get a free dc tig welder lol

 

[Algy]

Buy/rent bottles

When I lived in the UK thirty-odd years ago, I seem to remember that you couldn't legally buy gas bottles, you HAD to rent.

You don't BUY them, you RENT them.
Look in the sticky list for a supplier near you.