sealey electromig????

[oliver mc kenna]

hi folks.
i'm just in the process of starting up a small bodyshop and have come across the sealey electromig 195amp,can anyone tell me if they are any good.budget is tight and other models like ceobra are too expensive,as you probably know mig brazing is getting to be a must for bodyshops but i,m i wasting my money on this machine.also i,ve picked up a new butters 211,i know its a high amp machine for my work but i do have uses for that power range,can anybody tell me if its any good i havent used it yet.

 

[weldequip]

They are really an entry level machine for MIG brazing. Wire feed assembly & general build quality are the usual Sealey but the electronic control panel is pretty neat & easy enough to use.
It has programmes for Brazing, Aluminium & Stainless; select the material & wire size and it automatically sets the amperage & gas type. 'Semi-Synergic', compared to the Cebora's full Synergic system.




weldequip

 

[irondarren]

weldequip do you really need a synergic machine for doing mig brazing? or would a good solid mig unit work. I know there is a big advantage to the cebora synergic pulse machine in terms of heat distortion. Is it really that much improvement or can you get similar results with a lot of manuel tweeking of a standard mig

 

[weldequip]

You'd be OK with a step-controlled machine if it had volts/amps meters so you knew exactly what amps each setting gave you, or without meters but with a chart showing each settings amps.
I think Boron & galvanised steels cricital temperature range is between 45-65 amps, something like that, before you destroy the strength/corrosion properties.
weldequip

 

[oliver mc kenna]

thanks weldequip,
by saying the wire feed etc is the usual sealey does that mean its suspect in reliability terms or smoothness of weld or is it fairly ok.i know at the current price of £900 inc vat it has to be an entry level but would it be value for money or would i be best stay away?there's 2 other bodyshops in my area and they would be inerested in something like it if it would do the job reasonably well without giving trouble.the ceobra seems a great machine but at a much higher price,since they're all electronic would they all go bang after a few years in bodyshop conditions(dust etc).also if anyone can shed any light on the butters 211 is it any good?
many thanks

 

[Wozzaaah]

I have a Butters 211 and it's quite a nicely built machine, the wire-feed assembly is of decent quality and the internals seem pretty solid. However......I abused mine by running it too high for too long and the thermal sensor failed. Butters sent a replacement FOC even though it was out of warranty but it also blew a capacitor. Butters again sent me a replacement FOC so 10/10 for service! I still heve the butters but have now got a Portamig 361 which is more suitable for me.

If you're looking at something like the Butters 211 a better bet would be the portamig 211, better duty cycle and the lowest setting is 20A compared to the Butters' 30A. Lots of Portamig owners on here and never a bad word said about any of the machines!
Woz

 

[oliver mc kenna]

cheers ,appreciate your reply however i've already bought the butters but nice to know its a reasonable machine

 

[Wozzaaah]

It's a lovely smooth machine on lighter stuff but I was doing a lot of work with 6mm plate and although it will weld 6mm ok it won't do it for long before the thermal overload cuts in. It really wasn't the right machine for me and had i come across this forum before I bought it I probably would have chosen something else but, hey, isn't hindsight wonderful? . The digital amps/volts meter is a bit gimmicky really as you can't see what it's reading when you're welding .

 

[irondarren]

digital meters are ok but as you say wozzaaah you cant read them when welding. my little inverter fusion unit has digital outpput reading, cool to watch when someone else is welding with it, watching the amperage drop off when the rod sticks and it over amp itself when you start to arc up as the electronic wizardry trys to make it easier to weld.

 

[weldequip]

thanks weldequip,
by saying the wire feed etc is the usual sealey does that mean its suspect in reliability terms or smoothness of weld or is it fairly ok.

Sealey are at the forefront of box-moving & don't supply anything of true quality (in my opinion!). If you are really serious of doing professional, modern bodywork repairs you should be looking at something like the Cebora 2035/M system. They also now do a 'budget' version... the Tri-Star.
If it's mainly older vehicles (5-6+ years) that you repair then your Butters 211 will do the job just fine.
weldequip

 

[oliver mc kenna]

i take it the tri star brazes boron etc. would it be good value?how about the 180amp telwin semi synergic is it a re-named sealey?in the butters web site click on the 211 and it says 'has stainless weld and mig brazing capabilities' how realistic is this bearing in mind steels like boron are'nt that widesread really bar a few models up to the last couple of years

 

[irondarren]

I would have thought if you are welding up cars for MOT's as yet none of the boron steel cars should need MOT welding done yet. But if your doing crash damage stuff then thats a different matter. wonder if there is a directory as such for which cars are boron steel

 

[oliver mc kenna]

it's crash repairs alright along with general bumps and dents etc but a lot of up to date cars arent a complete make up of boron and hss you'd actually be suprised when you replace front panels etc(a lot of which are bolt on elements mabe from plastic) to find standard metals.sills and b posts would be more common place to find hss or boron and sometimes rear quaters but your general small bodyshop wont as of yet be using an expensive synergic pulse welder,along with expensive wire everyday of the week yet alone get anymore money for using it,you can use a standard mig on a lot of areas still.i hope you all can understand where i'm coming from,i tend to buy good quality eqiupment but if i could buy a mig brazing welder ,that wont be used everyday for the near future, therefore not really
making much money without having to pay 1500 0r 2 grand i would be a lot happier.i know its needed in a lot of models this is why i want one but the economics have to work also

 

[irondarren]

This is the problem synergic machines are reasonably new and still very expensive, was just looking through the Esab site at the Aristo pulse units, lovely machines but i would hate to think what they cost.