screw and nut 2 post car lift

[jacques@Mouton]

Hi.
New to the forum. I recently got a very, very old 2 post screw and nut type lift. I have been struggling to get any info on this kind of lift. After a lot of searching I came across this site so i thought I would ask a few questions. The guy that I got it from had it for years but only used it a handful of times. He mentioned that he had to do the main nuts a few years ago and that otherwise has been a good lift. I asked him what the lifting capacity was and he unfortunately didn't know but our vans where similar in weight and it had been lifting his no problem. I was hoping at the time id be able to get some info online about it but to date i don't know much about it. A few concerns I have after searching this site a learning more about this kind of lift is:
1. The nuts seem to be the wrong way and are in contact. From what Ive seen so far, the bronze nut should be on top with the metal nut under with a small gap to take the load off the safety nut. The guy sent me photos of before he did the nuts and it was like this as well. Is it wrong or are some like this?
2. The lift carriage of the lift (Not sure if that is the right name for it ) has play in it (front and back.) from what I can see it is the big roller that sits inside the carriage. Im not sure how much play is needed but there seems to be around 5mm of movement.
3. Does anyone know (by looking at the pictures) what brand this is or around about what its lifting capacity is? if I compare it to other 2.5 ton lifts, this one is very well built.(just needs some TLC) Im just not sure how much the nut and screw can take?

Any advise would be awesome.
Thanks

 

[charlysays]

This is sketchy territory. Looks like a nice setup you have there though
I can't advise on the brass nut Vs safety nut clearance , only that I would take them off and check them for wear again

With regards the carriage play, mine has always had around that much play from new in the carriages and it's never been an issue so it could be normal. Check everything for wear and damage though.

With two post lifts I like a belt and braces approach before going right under the car especially with long vehicles which might not balance well.
3-4 transmission jacks are a good move, or tall adjustable axle stands. That way you have one at each end to stop any rocking and one or two jacks left to use to lift and lower parts like subframes etc.

Does your lift have lockouts for the carriages? They're small ledges inside the columns with a mechanical stop on each carriage which hooks onto them.Without those it's pretty dodgy and I would absolutely not go right under the vehicle until it was also supported by four tall axle stands.

Also ensure the arm locks work properly. Those are the cause of most lift disasters.

 

[jacques@Mouton]

This is sketchy territory. Looks like a nice setup you have there though
I can't advise on the brass nut Vs safety nut clearance , only that I would take them off and check them for wear again

With regards the carriage play, mine has always had around that much play from new in the carriages and it's never been an issue so it could be normal. Check everything for wear and damage though.

With two post lifts I like a belt and braces approach before going right under the car especially with long vehicles which might not balance well.
3-4 transmission jacks are a good move, or tall adjustable axle stands. That way you have one at each end to stop any rocking and one or two jacks left to use to lift and lower parts like subframes etc.

Does your lift have lockouts for the carriages? They're small ledges inside the columns with a mechanical stop on each carriage which hooks onto them.Without those it's pretty dodgy and I would absolutely not go right under the vehicle until it was also supported by four tall axle stands.

Also ensure the arm locks work properly. Those are the cause of most lift disasters.

Thanks for the feed back.
I think transmission jacks is a definitely a good idea. It doesn't have any form of safety so was also considering adding some sort of manual safety like a 16mm pin that when it reaches the work height it can be inserted. I know it wont help if anything goes wrong on the way up or down but better than nothing.

 

[charlysays]

Thanks for the feed back.
I think transmission jacks is a definitely a good idea. It doesn't have any form of safety so was also considering adding some sort of manual safety like a 16mm pin that when it reaches the work height it can be inserted. I know it wont help if anything goes wrong on the way up or down but better than nothing.

No probs.
Yeah they really make it a lot safer.
Your lift looks like it has an H beam on the floor though which is great for stability and strength.
With mine the towers just bolt directly into the floor and I dread to think what the pullout forces are on the rawl bolts with a long perhaps poorly balanced vehicle and a bit of rocking. It is twin hydraulic though and each cylinder has a valve in the bottom which closes if you try to lower the car too fast so I guess that is the lifting/ lowering safety there- if the hose connecting the cylinders/ towers bursts it'll drop an inch then stop.

I just bought cheap trans jacks off ebay for about £70 each and they've been good for the use I give them for many years.

The pin sounds like a good idea tbh. If you don't do that modification I would not go under there unless it was firmly on tall axle stands

 

[frank horton]

Mines a Hoffman,the working nuts are plastic not bronze….
I would say that the bronze nuts are the one"s that does the lift and the steel are for safety…..
Think about it, would u want a steel nut wearing out the lift screw….bronze are almost self lube…
As for the wobble on the carriage….mine has about that on front to back and side to side…..
Not sure but it looks like a Laycock lift….it was what I had until upgraded to Hoffman…
built like a tank…..not a Russian tank tho…..

As an add on….mine used to get a dribble of heavy gearbox oil every other day or so, depending on use….
Now have a good supply of spray m/cycle chain lube that will get used instead….

 

[jacques@Mouton]

Mines a Hoffman,the working nuts are plastic not bronze….
I would say that the bronze nuts are the one"s that does the lift and the steel are for safety…..
Think about it, would u want a steel nut wearing out the lift screw….bronze are almost self lube…
As for the wobble on the carriage….mine has about that on front to back and side to side…..
Not sure but it looks like a Laycock lift….it was what I had until upgraded to Hoffman…
built like a tank…..not a Russian tank tho…..

As an add on….mine used to get a dribble of heavy gearbox oil every other day or so, depending on use….
Now have a good supply of spray m/cycle chain lube that will get used instead….

Thanks. I was also wondering about using cutter bar oil, but spray on chain lube would probably work better. It does make sense to have the bronze nut taking up the load. I still want to check wear on the nuts so will try swap them over aswell.
Im also trying to find out what its lifting capacity would more or less be. The frame is mad over kill but i dont know what the thread size translates to in terms of lifting power. This one the screw is 48mm in diameter. Does a 2 ton have a smaller screw diameter when compared to a 4 ton or do they all have around the same size screw but the frame/ structures are not as well built?

 

[DAPPH]

It looks like it's a factory made item, I would have expected to see it stamped somewhere with " SWL 3 T " or similar and a serial number

 

[jacques@Mouton]

It looks like it's a factory made item, I would have expected to see it stamped somewhere with " SWL 3 T " or similar and a serial number

Ive search everywhere on the lift. There is no information regarding who made it or capacity. the motor is a Lafert and its a 3kw.

 

[DAPPH]

Ive search everywhere on the lift. There is no information regarding who made it or capacity. the motor is a Lafert and its a 3kw.

Just did a search Lafert seems to be Italian

 

[Matchless]

Is the safety nut held in any way so it cannot rotate? my old Consul lifts had a square steel plate held onto the safety nut with countersunk screws, the square plate fitted inside the columns and then you could set a gap between the main nuts and the safety nut, if the main nut failed the carriage dropped down onto the safety nut, without a gap you would not know if the main nut had failed, also you could check the lift on the safety nut to check for wear,

 

[m_c]

Does your lift have lockouts for the carriages? They're small ledges inside the columns with a mechanical stop on each carriage which hooks onto them.Without those it's pretty dodgy and I would absolutely not go right under the vehicle until it was also supported by four tall axle stands.

Also ensure the arm locks work properly. Those are the cause of most lift disasters.

Screw lifts never have safety ratchets, as there is no need for them, due to the lifting mechanism being purely mechanical.
You'll only find ratchets on hydraulic lifts.

As for balancing, provided you put a vehicle on correctly, and don't try doing anything stupid, it won't fall off.
The tales of disaster always have some level of stupidity and/or incompetence involved.

The two 2 post incidents I was aware of with one of my previous employers, one involved blocks of wood where the vehicle slid off, and the other incompetent maintenance where one arm failed completely due to the idiots that are Gemco not picking up that the ramp was running solely on the safety nut.
Our workshop almost had a similar issue due to Gemco, who bypassed the safety nut cutout after they were called out due to a 2 post ramp getting stuck. Their 'engineer' never checked why the cutout had failed, just bypassed it and said the ramp was 'fixed', thankfully the next engineer picked up on it at it's next inspection before it failed completely.

 

[jacques@Mouton]

Is the safety nut held in any way so it cannot rotate? my old Consul lifts had a square steel plate held onto the safety nut with countersunk screws, the square plate fitted inside the columns and then you could set a gap between the main nuts and the safety nut, if the main nut failed the carriage dropped down onto the safety nut, without a gap you would not know if the main nut had failed, also you could check the lift on the safety nut to check for wear,

on this one, the bronze nut is acting as the safety with nothing to stop it from rotating. the main nut however, is not bronze, (looks like regular mild steel) but has a keyway cut into it to slot into the carriage which stops in rotating.

 

[minimutly]

Mines a Hoffman,the working nuts are plastic not bronze….
I would say that the bronze nuts are the one"s that does the lift and the steel are for safety…..
Think about it, would u want a steel nut wearing out the lift screw….bronze are almost self lube…
As for the wobble on the carriage….mine has about that on front to back and side to side…..
Not sure but it looks like a Laycock lift….it was what I had until upgraded to Hoffman…
built like a tank…..not a Russian tank tho…..

As an add on….mine used to get a dribble of heavy gearbox oil every other day or so, depending on use….
Now have a good supply of spray m/cycle chain lube that will get used instead….

I have a laycock, good and bad in equal amounts - needs the nuts inspected, and ideally the bigger pulleys I have waiting fitted. In truth I'm more likely to scrap it...
Anyone got a drawing of the Laycock lift?

 

[Johnnybravo]

I lived in South Africa 20 years ago. My father in law had a garage with three of those lifts installed. Garage and Equipment used to supply the nuts.( They were between Ellis Park and the Troyeville hotel, down the road from where the bearing place was on the main road) From memory there was about 10-12mm gap between the main nut and the safety nut when new nuts were installed. Both nuts were manufactured out of bronze. Cannot remember exactly but I think the main nut was keyed and the safety nut was dowelled to it.

 

[jacques@Mouton]

I lived in South Africa 20 years ago. My father in law had a garage with three of those lifts installed. Garage and Equipment used to supply the nuts.( They were between Ellis Park and the Troyeville hotel, down the road from where the bearing place was on the main road) From memory there was about 10-12mm gap between the main nut and the safety nut when new nuts were installed. Both nuts were manufactured out of bronze. Cannot remember exactly but I think the main nut was keyed and the safety nut was dowelled to it.

Yes this is basically the same. The main nut is keyed to the carriage. The main nut however seems to be a mild steel and not bronze. I'm wondering now if maybe the bronze nut is press inside a mild steel case with the keyway. I'll have to take it apart to see.

 

[jacques@Mouton]

So I got the 2 nuts out to take a look at the condition for some peace of mind. The nut on top turned out to be plastic or nylon but not metal. the bottom is brass according to the previous owner who change the nut himself (He had someone make one for him). The main (plastic nut) doesn't have any up and down movement but does have side to side movement. I compared movement between the 2 nuts and the brass one has zero movement in any direction. i tried to measure the threads and it seems like the plastic one has deeper cut threads.
1.Is this normal or some degree of normal / abnormal wear? The threads still look fine.
2.Is it acceptable to have the main nut changed to bronze or should i just keep it plastic?
below is a picture of the plastic nut.
Any advise would be great.
Thanks

 

[Matchless]

My nuts were always brass, I had Consul mk2 lifts, they had two nuts each side with a 6-10mm gap, lots of nuts here...... https://garageequipmentdirect.co.uk/contents/en-uk/d47.html I have just seen some plastic nuts listed on Ebay, not sure I like the idea!

 

[500e]

Had a 4 post Laycock Coronation lived outside for years and used for steam and pressure washing only had one set of nuts.
It was fairly bomb proof except for limit switches.

 

[m_c]

I did have the thought earlier, will this ramp have a safety nut?
It's not UK/EU based, and likely old enough where a backup system wasn't required.

It would be good to see some photos of how the nuts are arranged.

 

[minimutly]

I did have the thought earlier, will this ramp have a safety nut?
It's not UK/EU based, and likely old enough where a backup system wasn't required.

It would be good to see some photos of how the nuts are arranged.

You have to have a safety nut, otherwise it could kill you....