removing a wonky helicoil

[premmington]

I must add there is defined workshop culture to "snapped bolts" in our workshop!

The person who has just "F##k#d up". Stands back on screams out obscenities. Everybody stops what they are doing and wanders over and crowds round the offending vehicle, offering verbal sympathy, mixed with advice and general ****-taking!

But then the amassed group starts stripping things out of the way, out from tools boxes come drill guides and sharp centre punches. More banter and ****-taking is forthcoming about eyesight issues about starting the drilling in the centre of the broken bolt. Then everybody takes turns with the drill, even a second person offering extra pressure on the back of the pistol drill while someone gets it in the right position. It becomes a group effort. Sharpening drills and adding coolant.

Before Xmas one of the younger fitters, snapped a tap in alloy engine mount. One of the older lads wondered over and I heard him say. "Child what has that lump of alloy ever done to you? Remove the mount, put it in the vice on my bench! Then you can watch a master remove it, in front of your very eyes"

 

[PhillipM]

What are the pros and cons of a helicoil over a solid insert?

You need take away less parent material to fit it, they're usually hardened and polished to a better level than inserts due to being wound wire so they continous treated - so if it's a bolt that's replaced often there's longevity benefits, and being basically a wire spring, they can move and conform to the thread form slightly (given tapped threads are usually deliberately not a perfect fit to allow for lead and radius errors), which reduces the stress on the first few loaded threads as it spreads it down the rest of the engagement - reducing the chance of deformation of the lead threads under high torque.

 

[Big Pete]

A major aid to fitting helicoils is to use a proper helicoil tool, which is a way more advanced device than the effort than comes with the recoil kits. They also cost a fortune. A halfway house which works pretty well and helps a lot is to use a bolt (with the right pitch obviously) with a ledge filed into it to grab the tang. Oil the bolt, wind on the wire insert of choice, screw into hole, wind bolt back out. BTW, don't use a stainless bolt. The bolt threads support the wire insert and help a lot in preventing threads hopping, or cutting their own thread in the ally. It also means you can use a spanner or any other suitable device to drive it home. I tend to use a socket heat cap screw, which are easy to set using an allen key and require almost no clearance at all.

 

[premmington]

A major aid to fitting helicoils is to use a proper helicoil tool, which is a way more advanced device than the effort than comes with the recoil kits. They also cost a fortune. A halfway house which works pretty well and helps a lot is to use a bolt (with the right pitch obviously) with a ledge filed into it to grab the tang. Oil the bolt, wind on the wire insert of choice, screw into hole, wind bolt back out. BTW, don't use a stainless bolt. The bolt threads support the wire insert and help a lot in preventing threads hopping, or cutting their own thread in the ally. It also means you can use a spanner or any other suitable device to drive it home. I tend to use a socket heat cap screw, which are easy to set using an allen key and require almost no clearance at all.

Good advice... This is how I was shown to do it.



.

 

[doubleboost]

Good advice... This is how I was shown to do it.



.

 

[PhillipM]

Given how easy that tap went through and how much play it had when he backed it out, I'd guess he's drilled that way oversized for a decent thread form.

 

[BrokenBiker]

nice video john, hadn't seen that one on your channel. that is how I do it. I haven't got a genuine helicoil kit, just a cheap one off ebay but the tools are the same and the inserts are the same, same pitch on the tap and same drill size etc

 

[doubleboost]

Given how easy that tap went through and how much play it had when he backed it out, I'd guess he's drilled that way oversized for a decent thread form.

Correct size drill & new tap the insert was a good fit the bolts torqued up & did not wobble in the holes

 

[PhillipM]

Correct sized drill doesn't mean it's drilled the correct sized hole

 

[doubleboost]

Correct sized drill doesn't mean it's drilled the correct sized hole

It was the best I could for free hand drilling

 

[brightspark]

Correct sized drill doesn't mean it's drilled the correct sized hole

if u want it that acurate and perfectly round then drill undersize and ream it

 

[doubleboost]

Starts at 2.00

 

[normspanners]

(Oh... Anything from Wurth is expensive)

Wurth is GOOD gear but you are right expensive!!
I am lucky my friend and engine builder has every timesert in stock

 

[Robotstar5]

Timesert kits from Wurth are expensive.

(Oh... Anything from Wurth is expensive)

A bit OT but our fastener stores were maintained by Wurth at my last place, they came in once a month and checked stock, sent a "shopping list" to my boss to be signed off then bought the stuff in on the next visit and re-stocked the stores.
After one visit my boss was on holiday so the list was sent to me for sign off (accounts wouldn't have clue what a bolt was ) so I had a look at it and wondered why we needed a box of 1000 M3 washers as I knew we didn't use that many so checked the racks and we still had 2 unopened boxes!, I spent a couple of hours doing a full stock check and found a lot of stuff we didn't need including things like a box of 200 M16 Nylocs which we have never used. The list was reduced to about 20% of what they wanted to supply, the order turned up in the post and we were asked to do our own ordering in future

 

[BrokenBiker]

A bit OT but our fastener stores were maintained by Wurth at my last place, they came in once a month and checked stock, sent a "shopping list" to my boss to be signed off then bought the stuff in on the next visit and re-stocked the stores.
After one visit my boss was on holiday so the list was sent to me for sign off (accounts wouldn't have clue what a bolt was ) so I had a look at it and wondered why we needed a box of 1000 M3 washers as I knew we didn't use that many so checked the racks and we still had 2 unopened boxes!, I spent a couple of hours doing a full stock check and found a lot of stuff we didn't need including things like a box of 200 M16 Nylocs which we have never used. The list was reduced to about 20% of what they wanted to supply, the order turned up in the post and we were asked to do our own ordering in future

our entire stores are maintained by Cromwell, and its much the same thing. if something goes down and need a new part that we don't normally stock, we will try and find a decently priced part that fits and does what we need it to. then Cromwell get their hands on the order form, find a more expensive part that is slightly different, then charge us for re-submitting the original when their part doesn't fit/work

 

[Robotstar5]

our entire stores are maintained by Cromwell...

Most of our stuff comes through Eriks I think that's mainly for convenience as our accounts dept. don't want loads of small suppliers. It's the holy grail of local suppliers to get on our preferred supplier list

 

[BrokenBiker]

Cromwell is a strange one, they supply us with massive amounts of kennedy tools from their own supplies, but anything else is sourced elsewhere, even if they have it in their catalogue

 

[Spark plug]

Most of our stuff comes through Eriks I think that's mainly for convenience as our accounts dept. don't want loads of small suppliers. It's the holy grail of local suppliers to get on our preferred supplier list

I like Erics but my boss doesn't so it makes my life hard sourcing parts from all over the place and probably costing more.

 

[premmington]

I like Erics but my boss doesn't so it makes my life hard sourcing parts from all over the place and probably costing more.

We have a Erics in the town I live in! Just found it out form the website link above. Learn something new everyday.