Pulse

[MadforFishing]

Hi Guys,
Really nice forum!I am new in welding so just want to ask
what is really the difference between the Fusion 200F and the Fusion 200PHF?
I do know that there is a difference in terms of the Pulse!
What that mean in terms of Tig Welding!

Thanks

 

[cumbriasteve]

Not a clue but welcome to the forum at least

 

[MadforFishing]

Thanks cumbriasteve!
Just a correction Fusion 200HF and Fusion 200PHF

 

[hotrodder]

Pulsed TIG splits the welding into a peak (or pulse) used to weld and a background current that lets the weld pool cool/freeze. Typically used for thin and/or heat sensitive materials like stainless for example. It's a useful tool but it also introduces a whole bunch of other variables. Lots of threads on the topic, search the TIG forum for 'pulse' and you'll get a couple of pages worth, a good one here... http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=16277&highlight=pulse

 

[Ragnarok]

just had a look at the specs and the PHF has a few things the HF doesn't, like slope up, pre gas, plus of course pulse, useful things, i always have a bit of pre flow about 1 second, and i always use slope up if i'm not using foot pedal, the PHF is well worth the extra £30 in my opinion

 

[MadforFishing]

Ragnarok and the rest thanks for replies.I am a DIYER.I do saw the differences .
A friend of friend offer the HF model really cheap. Something like £450 and even less.It used only once and my friend was there. Unfortunately the Guy lost his job and he has to sell most of his stuff.I saw the receipt bought for £665.00 .
Not know enough and the missing function comparative the PHF model so not really know if it worth!

 

[MadforFishing]

I do apologies Guys!
Just realize I am in the wrong forum Section!
Hope the admin to forgive me!

 

[Ragnarok]

it really depends what jobs you want it for the 200hf would probably be a decent basic tig and £450 is pretty cheap, but the 200phf would be a much better machine over all in my opinion, but of course at £450 you could add a foot pedal and it'd still have only cost you about £600 and you'd be able to slope up with that, really depends what you want to do with it, as hotrodder said pulse is good on stainless, especially welding near edges or on thin metal, and it reduces distortion.

lots of other options out there too!

 

[MadforFishing]

you see my dilemma Ragnarok!I will do some stainless Steel stuff.
I have a boat and I want to make some alterations in certain part of it!Also some railling in my house and some general DIY stuff.
. My budget is pretty low cannot afford something like the £650.
£400-450 is my limit.I do read some reviews about the IFL and they seems that they make pretty decent machines.Not really want to go to the China side.Hope you understand!
Any suggestions?
Am I losing a lot without the pulse function from your experience?

 

[Ragnarok]

pulse isn't essential, handy but you can do with out it, the 200hf should do a fine job! pulse, pre gas and slope up are nice though, and a foot pedal is a very very good tool, remember you need quite a few other bits when you're first starting though, an electronic helmet is a huge help, and you need regulator, flow meter, tungstens and fillers, ect, so if the cost of the machine is all you can afford you can't afford it haha

 

[MadforFishing]

So I assume you will go for that price in this welder if you was in myside ?
Please also let me know.I check and some tig welders seems that you have to really touch the torch to the filler to be able to weld.Some others they can do the job, from some distance.This seems to actually effect the ceramic part of the torch!
Am I right?
If yes, in what side is the Fusion HF 200?
Thanks

 

[Delgado]

I know You said you didn't want anything chinese, but you could get a new 160a Rtech tig with pulse, and still have £100 left over to buy consumables, or you could get a 200a model for £450.

If you don't want to go that route then for £450 you don't really have that many options, You could get a new Themal arc 175te or an ESAB Buddy Tig 160, which are both basic TIG sets like the inverter fusion that you mentioned. Although as far as I can see they don't have a gas post flow setting (which is quite important, especially if you want to weld Stainless), which the Inverter fusion has, so it might be the better option.

With regards to pulse, IMO it's far from essential, but that's not to say that it doesn't have it's uses.

 

[Ragnarok]

well, £450 is pretty decent for an almost new machine that usually sells for £650 new, and inverter fusion are a good make.
that isn't quite right, with tig welding you have the tungsten in the torch (non consumable) and then the filler wire in your other hand, you never want to touch the tungsten to the filler rod, with some with some machines (or settings) you have to touch the tungsten to the base metal to establish an arc, this is called scratch start or lift start, the other option is high frequency start with this the tungsten should never touch anything, you just hold the tungsten over the base metal and press the torch button and the arc jumps the gap, the inverter fusion 200hf has high frequancy start, if you are using scratch start or lift start the tungstens will need resharpening a lot, with high frequancy they should last quite a while between sharpening, assuming you don't touch the tungsten to the filler wire, base metal, puddle or anything in which case they will need resharpening.
there is a tutorial on tig welding on this site http://www.mig-welding.co.uk/tig-tutorial.htm seems like it'd be worth a look the guy in the tutorial is using an inverter fusion 200HF too.
also this site http://www.weldingtipsandtricks.com/ welding tips and tricks has really nice videos explaining all the tig settings and showing tig welding being done, so you can see what it should look like.

 

[Ragnarok]

Although as far as I can see they don't have a gas post flow setting (which is quite important, especially if you want to weld Stainless), which the Inverter fusion has, so it might be the better option.

the inverter fusion does have post flow 0-25sec it doesn't have pre flow, post flow is essential the tungsten would be ruined after each weld with out it stainless would also be ruined with out some post flow.

 

[MadforFishing]

Delgado I do know the R-Tech stuff.
Pretty decent machines and according some members,excellent after sale service! Really important and professional.From my point of view if I avoid China I will be really glad.
Ragnarok,is it a yes from your side about the HF Model?
Really count your opinion !

 

[Delgado]

the inverter fusion does have post flow 0-25sec it doesn't have pre flow, post flow is essential the tungsten would be ruined after each weld with out it stainless would also be ruined with out some post flow.

Please re-read my post.

 

[Ragnarok]

if it has to be non chinese for £450 you don't have many options haha so that inverter fusion would look like a good one, assuming it's not been dropped or abused, but you say it's only been used once, and it's a friend selling it so it should all be good, don't forget about all the extra cots though like argon can be expensive if you can find local rent free and you don't do a lot of welding thats fine it's usually aout £50 deposit on the bottle and £40 a fill but they don't last long, when i first got my tig i got an adams gas rent free cylinder and used it up in about a week, then i went to boc and got a full size cylinder, which works out much cheaper if you are using more than a few rent frees a year, but boc rental is quite expensive, can remember off the top of my head but i think it's around £100 a year plus £80 a fill and £12 collection, a helmet cheapest ones suitable for tig are about £60, tungsten are about £10-20 a pack depending on size (you'll probably want 2 packs 1.6mm and 2.4mm) stainless filler rods are about £50-100 a pack, so when you've got all your basic kit you're defiantly going to have spend over £700 including the machine assuming it has a regulator and torch with it for the £450.

my opinion is that the inverter fusion 200hf would be a good basic tig (shame it's missing pre gas and slope up), but it's also always nice to have a new machine so you know it's been looked after and it has a warranty if anything does go wrong, and as mentioned there are a quite a few good machines out there, many people recommend the r-tech and the tec arc, i was considering an r-tech myself when i got my tig, and again with the plasma, they're very tempting at half the price of the big brands haha

it's up to you whether or not you want used or new, but if you know it's an almost new machine with the invoice and someone you know selling it, and it all works as should (might even have some warranty left?) sounds like a good deal to me.

 

[MadforFishing]

I assume you speak about the Post Gas Timer?
Forgive me really not an expert so all this things seems weird to me.
All I do understand that the Fusion HF 200 has a good thing for the Tungsten .No Pre Gas Timer but not essential!

 

[Ragnarok]

Please re-read my post.

ahh very sorry you were talking about the other machines not having post flow

 

[Ragnarok]

I assume you speak about the Post Gas Timer?
Forgive me really not an expert so all this things seems weird to me.
All I do understand that the Fusion HF 200 has a good thing for the Tungsten .No Pre Gas Timer but not essential!

yes post gas timer also known as post flow means that the shielding gas continues to flow after the weld has finished, allowing the weld and tungsten to cool before being exposed to the atmosphere.
the high frequency start is good for the weld as well as the tungsten life as lift or scratch start can contaminate the weld with tungsten.