One of the last machine tool manufacturers

[MattF]

Sh1t floats to the top, or so they tell me.

I'm sure there are quite a few who would argue that point, after a throne session.

 

[m_c]

I have to argue about not wanting to teach, the problem is the constant watering down by governing bodies. I know for a fact that a major exam board didn’t get enough top level passes to suit the government figures, so they’ve rewritten the exam to be easier. Those that work hard, pay attention and just “get it” no longer get any form of respect, instead the dross is bumped up. To seemingly everyone else’s level so that it looks better on a spread sheet.

I have a constant argument in every educational establishment I’ve worked- aspiration is not aptitude, and just because you want to be an engineer doesn’t mean you will be, and yet we are pushed year on year to have top levels of passes. I don’t entirely blame the college management, they have to dance to the tune played by the government, written by someone who’s never done any sort of vocational job and who simply cannot see why people SHOULD fail engineering courses. I’ve seen some absolute dross get a qualification they never earned, simply because to fail them would result in a spanking from the government

I could have a good rant about this in the motor trade, but I'll resist, and say I very much agree with your post.
Multiple choice 'exams' have replaced a large amount of written exams for level 3 qualifications.

The biggest issue colleges have, is they don't get paid for apprentices that fail, so they'll do everything they can to get them to pass.

 

[DanZac]

I could have a good rant about this in the motor trade, but I'll resist, and say I very much agree with your post.
Multiple choice 'exams' have replaced a large amount of written exams for level 3 qualifications.

The biggest issue colleges have, is they don't get paid for apprentices that fail, so they'll do everything they can to get them to pass.

I 100% agree with everything that both @m_c and @Tinbasherdan have said, however just to add to that and as someone that works in the Apprenticeship delivery space, some of the failure with Apprenticeships must lay within the workplace.

If we look historically. As an Apprentice you would have been allocated an Apprentice Master, who would have been solely responsible for your training and ensuring that you met the required standard.

Certainly within my area of work that is no longer the case, and in the majority of cases the workshop floor see that training as being the collages responsibility.

Whilst the Apprentice attends day release one or two days a week, to learn the theory of their trade, the remainin days should be being utalised for training within the workplace. Something which I see little of, with the majority of our apprentices just used as another pair of hands, or a bit of extra labour.

Whether that is a result of lack of workforce, a result of accumulated dumbing down of skills meaning that the workforce themselves don't have the knowledge and skills to pass down, or the "it's not my job to teach them mentality" which seems prevalent in today's society, or other reasons, i don't know.

But I do know, that whilst a lot of the failure can be placed at the hands of government and the collages, some of that responsibility is also ours to own as the people that do have the skills to pass on, but often seem reluctant to do so.

 

[northwest]

If we look historically. As an Apprentice you would have been allocated an Apprentice Master, who would have been solely responsible for your training and ensuring that you met the required standard.

Certainly within my area of work that is no longer the case, and in the majority of cases the workshop floor see that training as being the collages responsibility.

It's this blame culture we seem to have incubated. If the candidate fails no one single individual can be identified to blame, it's "the system" innit!

 

[GRW]

I could have a good rant about this in the motor trade, but I'll resist, and say I very much agree with your post.
Multiple choice 'exams' have replaced a large amount of written exams for level 3 qualifications.

The biggest issue colleges have, is they don't get paid for apprentices that fail, so they'll do everything they can to get them to pass.

It seems to me the whole FE & HE system has been hijacked & corrupted, with (as always) Money overwhelming any intentions to actually educate & produce graduates "fit for purpose" in the work environment.

All that seems to interest them is bums on seats (while Govt seems happy to go along with it - I suspect because young unemployed people are a vote killer, so better to hide them in pointless "Education" for as many years as possible.
(I doubt if more than a tiny percentage of "graduates" go on to earn a salary where they are required to repay Student Loans - so effectively most are on a hidden high-cost Benefit anyway, while the College/Uni provides very poor VFM to the taxpayer in return).

The Colleges/Universities will it seems put on just about any Course, regardless if its actual use to either the Student or an Employer.... to get a bum on one of their seats - and its turned into a massive Industry that produces 100 or 1000x more "waste" than it does people prepared for (& to) work.

I know small businesses now do not value or "rate" Graduates - they see them as blank canvasses who are no better than if they'd taken on a school leaver - just older!

When they killed off Apprenticeships In favour of Further Education, it was a death knell for a business getting useful young staff IMO. A smart kid today is way better off trying to get a Trade apprenticeship (if he can find one) in Electrician/Plumber etc - where he gets 1-day a week in college to get his "bits of paper" - and he/she will have a skill that has plenty of demand, gives them job mobility, and will earn a good one a decent living.

We are effectively seeing that most people under say 40yo now are about as much use in the workplace as a chocolate welding torch. No concept of any responsibility, work ethic and zero motivation etc. There are of course "good ones" but they are sadly few.

 

[Roger440]

This is so sad, but completely predictable unfortunately. The bit which kills (killed) UK engineering and manufacturing are always overheads.

These take only 2 forms really, taxation and wages. All the rest is predictable and can be budgeted. New machine? Cost it, split that over X number of years, look at its productivity and you have the unit cost to factor into every job.

Taxation, wow, how do you account for that? Especially with Rachel from accounts keep changing the rules. Business rates are another mental cost. This takes no account of productivity/profitability against the required space to operate. It really should. As noted above, it takes a lot of space to cast a massive closed ended cylinder, you simply cannot cannot do this is the space that an office desk occupies.

Corporation tax is another one which is heinously unbalanced, if you're a global organisation you can have paper based loans from another part of the company and offset payments against your profits before paying tax. It amount to money laundering. The small business based solely in the UK cannot do this. Should be a much smaller percentage and be based on turnover.

Wages are a huge cost. Not so much that they are high per-sé, but the employer's costs that go with a wage are at an altogether silly level. Employer's NI, Holiday pay. Sick pay, Pension contributions - this lot really adds up. My wife is a Payroll Manager so I get to see this first hand, and in a manufacturing company, not some desk-jockey organisation. And the workforce at her place have a large Polish contingent, strange that. (They make extrusions from billet, like greenhouse frames etc)

With all this cost it is a real disadvantage compared to some far-eastern places where people work for a bowl of rice a day, factories are not taxed to oblivion and so on. Small wonder the UK based companies are closing, the game is far too unbalanced.

I realised how skewed the corp tax situation was, when, and it was a while ago, i found out our 5 man business was paying way more corp tax than Starbucks.

Ive become ever more cynical since. Especially the way everything is skewed in favour of corparates.

 

[8ob]

Industry here is drowning in red tape and BS, Even decent unskilled labour is hard to find despite there being 9m of working age economically inactive, unfortunately this place has become a parasites paradise. Going to take some quite radical and very unpopular changes to turn things around.

Bob

 

[Martin Hocking]

Coborn seemed like an interesting company.

I’d never heard of them, and after watching the video on their LinkedIn profile which is this one-

I was still none the wiser really (I am under 40 though )

A bit of a further mooch on their YouTube channel makes it a bit clearer-seriously posh cnc cutter grinders for proper hard materials. I’m still not totally sure who there core market was, they seem to mention the gemstone industry. Although I thought gem diamonds were cut by hand which was part of why they are so expensive.

In any case it’s a bit of a shame they’re no longer a going concern.

Who are the last uk machine tool manufacturers then?
Cowells albeit at the small scale end I suppose…

 

[bricol]

We are effectively seeing that most people under say 40yo now are about as much use in the workplace as a chocolate welding torch. No concept of any responsibility, work ethic and zero motivation etc. T

In 30 yrs of engineering I've seen plenty above 40 who have been exactly the same - do the barest minimum required to not get shown the door - and apparently for some, that is the way to work - the theory being why enrich the bosses?

 

[northwest]

that is the way to work - the theory being why enrich the bosses?

I have seen this over and over. I once worked for an "administration" company, walking into businesses on a Friday lunchtime, gathering up the staff and telling them all to leave, they are all redundant and the company is "in administration". Made a lot of money but it turned me into a monster, anyhow the workforce in every instance had been actively undermining the company, not everyone but enough to cause a rupture to split and bring the company down. In every case a blind hatred of the bosses "making money"? It always confused the hell out of me. It has now become a way of life and manifests itself in so many facets of everyday life that it has now become the norm. It is very depressing to look at.