Old 3 phase socket to new

[brnomauser]

I'm hoping someone can advise me. I need to convert an old 3 phase socket, I guess via a trailing lead, to a new 63amp 5 pin one. This is to power the marquee at our wedding. It's at my uncles so can't just replace the socket.

The socket in question is black, with a screw up ring to secure it. Does anyone know what this type is called, and where I could get the male end? Also, when wiring 5 to 4 pin, do I leave off the neutral pin right?

Thanks for any help

 

[madkayaker]

if its 4 pin then there is no neutral ad unless the load it totally balanced e.g. a motor then you will need a N. you will struggle to get a plug for it as they have been out of date for 30+ years. there is no easy fix I'm afraid with out wiring in a new 5 pin plug and i would guess that the rest of the installation is old so might not be that safe

 

[brightspark]

I'm hoping someone can advise me. I need to convert an old 3 phase socket, I guess via a trailing lead, to a new 63amp 5 pin one. This is to power the marquee at our wedding. It's at my uncles so can't just replace the socket.

The socket in question is black, with a screw up ring to secure it. Does anyone know what this type is called, and where I could get the male end? Also, when wiring 5 to 4 pin, do I leave off the neutral pin right?

Thanks for any help

old sockets were called reyroll not much chance of getting the plugs now . just change the wall socket and plug to a new one .i are u just going to use 1 phase and neutral at 240v to supply the tent or split the load up using the 3 phases and neutral ???also at 240v .just noticed as said above the old socket 4 pin probs 3 phase only no neutral and probably old wiring . it would need investigation before u proceed any further

 

[brnomauser]

I'm only running 3 phase to it because I need 20kW and it's 60m from the nearest plug, which just so happens to be 3 phase. It will then be split into single phase(s). It will be powering some lighting, fridges a music syetm and a water heater to name a few. Does it really need the neutral for them? It powers a thicknesser and big saw bench at the moment. Is it really not enough?

Rewiring his barn is not really an option

Edit - do I need neutral to split it?

 

[madkayaker]

if your asking if the single phase things are needing a neutral you should take a step back and ask your self if your up to the job

 

[brnomauser]

hmm, I guess I am. I haven't really had a good think about it, but thinking back I guess single phase has to have a neutral. So that means putting a new plug in or it won't work will it... Will the supply in have a neutral?

 

[madkayaker]

if the existing socket is 4 pin probity not

 

[awemawson]

Or a 415v to 240v transformer.. Powered off two phases you will have 240 single phase. The transformer should isolate (ie be wound with a primary and a secondary, so not an autotransformer) and you ground one output leg locally - that leg becomes your neutral . 30ma RCD needed in circuit to ensure wedded bliss lasts longer than half way through the reception!

If unsure, don't do it

 

[Luke]

if your asking if the single phase things are needing a neutral you should take a step back and ask your self if your up to the job

Valid point!

If you try and run 230v appliances of a 3 phase supply, without a Neutral, you will end up with 415 ph-ph, and an expensive repair/replacement bill!!

 

[madkayaker]

that is an option. what ever you do an RCD is a must



the one above lukes post that is

 

[Luke]

Or a 415v to 240v transformer..
If unsure, don't do it

That's an option.

As would be creating a star point, if you could be sure the phases are balanced, which they won't be.

Based on the OP's requirement of 20kW, and the previous posts, neither appears to be a practical solution.

Bearing in mind you will have a marquee full of guests, this is one not to get wrong!!

 

[brnomauser]

Thanks guys. Just to clear things up - I'm not overseeing it. I'm having a marquee company provide/plug in the 3 phase cable and distribution board. He said it needs to have a 5 pin 63 amp socket, so I said I'd make sure it had one. Now it seems that may not be possible. I've just got the phone number of an electrician who knows the wiring so will call him tomorrow.

awemawson - could your solution be the answer to needing 20kw of power 60m from the nearest socket?

 

[brnomauser]

ok just saw your post Luke. Sounds like that still isn't a possibilty. And depending on what the sparky says, the whole thing might be a dead end

Genny it is I guess. Along with the noise and expense

 

[Pete.]

Why not just hire a towable generator for the day? No need to buy cable or pay a sparky then just plug it into your board and start the engine.

 

[madkayaker]

the socket will need to be 30mA ＲＣＤ protected and might need a local earth spike as SOME of the distribution boards have earth monitoring kit on them. you best option might be to run new circuit from the meter to were needed as 63/ph is a big ask on an old installation. ask the hire company if they realy need 63/ph or if they can do it with less as presuming they are going to split down to single thats a total current of 189A or 43KW!

 

[Luke]

Sounds like the best idea, especially given 60m cable run!

 

[awemawson]

Thanks guys. Just to clear things up - I'm not overseeing it. I'm having a marquee company provide/plug in the 3 phase cable and distribution board. He said it needs to have a 5 pin 63 amp socket, so I said I'd make sure it had one. Now it seems that may not be possible. I've just got the phone number of an electrician who knows the wiring so will call him tomorrow.

awemawson - could your solution be the answer to needing 20kw of power 60m from the nearest socket?

Yes if your generator is up to it and the transformer also. This summer my 100kva generator will be towed into the middle of a (currently waterlogged) field and used to power my wife's birthday bash, however I will only be using one of the phases as I consider 415v a tad dodgy in such conditions. As an aside I replaced the old style connector on this genny some years back for the new style 125a Commando sockets - blimey they are pricey!

 

[madkayaker]

generators work better if you balance the loads best as possible have done a few temporary installations off generators for road work sites etc and done correctly they are as safe as a fixed installation . the sets i currently work on would need a lot bigger that 125A plug!

 

[brnomauser]

well I'd be hiring it, and a distribution board... can I not just plug plain jane 240 into this?

 

[Pete.]

You can hire 3phase gennies with 240 outlets. Our towables have three 32A 240 sockets on them.