Newbie

[Zoll99]

Hi I've never welding before and looking for some general advice. After alot of reading and search on the net I've decided MIG is probably best for me at the moment but I am unsure wether to go for gas or gassless welding. My main concerns are

Gas - uncertain of the running cost and buying gas bottles, this is new to me and is making me shy away from this at the moment

Gasless - this is my initial preference in that its cheaper to start up/ run as no gas to buy also no gas to maintain but has lower quality welds

I'm not looking to spend too much over £100 if possible so if anyone could recomend me a welder that would be great. General coments would be much appriciated.

 

[Robotstar5]

Hi, welcome to the forum, if you let us know what you intend welding, cars, gates etc we can recommend the best type of welder for you.
I'm afraid you will have to revise your budget though, not much about for 100 quid

 

[Zoll99]

Mainly for a hobby robot that im building (robot wars kinda thing) so am looking to weld box stainless steel 10mm x 10mm x 1mm and also attaching some thicker steel pieces to it if possible - maybe 3-5mm.

I may also be doing some car body repair work on an old car over the summer if I get any good at it.

Buget can go up but I'd seen some cheapish second hand ones on ebay are these no good?

 

[Furry Freak]

As a newbie myself (pretty much) I am going to be slightly radical and suggest that with what you are proposing, I wouldn't bother. I would save my money and rivet your robot together.

Let me explain. I'm really not wishing to appear rude. One of the greatest advantages that I found when I started last Summer was having a really good welder. I went sort of bottom end of professional market rather than top end of hobby if you get me. I spent £500 on a Butters mig. All I had to do was learn to weld. I didn't have to spend time trying to understand how to get the settings right (OK - the rest of you know what I mean by that rather simplistic comment?) It was like learning to drive - in an automatic - no gear changes to worry about.

Now, a mig that will be trouble free, and easy to use, and LEARN on for £100, which is gas-less so even harder and not brilliant for bodywork sounds like a recipe for frustration to me. There may be someone on here who would do the welding for you or maybe you could look at hiring a mig. Or borrowing one. I completely understand the predicament that you are in, but I thought I would give an objective view. This forum is one of the most supportive that I know and someone more experienced may be along any second with a solution.

I sincerely hope that it doesn't cause offence.

FF

 

[Zoll99]

Thanks for the advice Furry Freak thats kinda what i was looking for. However I would really like to learn to weld so as I start a job in september (currently uni student hence being a bit skint...) would you reccomend saving up £500 say and buying one like yours?

 

[Furry Freak]

Well, look. You needn't spend £500 to get a decent set. That is for sure. There are better welders out there than me that can make a 'cheapie' do wondrous things. But my advice would be determine WHAT you need, then find out HOW MUCH that would be and than that's your budget to work towards. Setting budget and then saying what functionality you need is sorta the wrong thing to do. Unless someone specifically recommends a cheaper welder (someone you trust - on here for example) then avoid auction site stuff without advice. Have a look at the Clarke range in Machine Mart to see what you can get for your money. Then shop around. There are people on here (weldequipe for instance) who may be able to help you in squeezing best value for money out of the piggy bank.

I bought a £500 set because I am not a student and I have the income to be able to do that. It was a luxury. But it has been a fantastic set. I have been welding all weekend, making a 4x4 rear storage frame for a mate and it has just run and run. No jams, no funny noises, no blockages - just great wire delivery all weekend. Just as well. with all the design work-arounds that we had to do, if we had needed to keep fixing the set every ten mins he'd still be here now! I use a Y sized bottle on a great deal from BOC and there is hours and hours of welding in that. I have never tried the little bottles but I imagine that I'd fine those pretty tiresome. You can get a BOC account and when you don't need the bottle you can return it and pay no rental. Not telling you that it's cheap but it is one of the factors in producing good welding - in my view.

FF

 

[busa]

Some very good advice there Furry Freak, Ebay and local ads are full of cheap welders being sold by people who have attempted to take up welding 'on the cheap' only to become frustrated and disillusioned right from the start. Acceptable welds can be made with budget gear but when learning there is no doubt that better equipment will make for a smoother learning curve. Unfortunately welding is one of the trades where you most definitely get what you pay for.

 

[Zoll99]

How would something like http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/135te-turbo-mig-welder/path/diy-mig-welders be?

 

[Robotstar5]

How would something like http://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/135te-turbo-mig-welder/path/diy-mig-welders be?

A nice hobby welder (check out Weldequip shop at top of page) will do what you want although thicker material will need some edge prep.

 

[Zoll99]

So would something like the Clarke 130EN MIG Welder from weldequip be a good buy for me to start? How much would I have to spend on gas hire ect to get started and how much would I need to spend on saftey gear bearing in mind I dont really have any at the moment.

 

[BChild]

Some very good advice there Furry Freak, Ebay and local ads are full of cheap welders being sold by people who have attempted to take up welding 'on the cheap' only to become frustrated and disillusioned right from the start. Acceptable welds can be made with budget gear but when learning there is no doubt that better equipment will make for a smoother learning curve. Unfortunately welding is one of the trades where you most definitely get what you pay for.

One of the best posts I've read for a long time

M2pW

Buy cheap and the learning curve is frankly a bloody nightmare however there are chaeper MIGS out there that can and will do the job - anything weldequip sells is going to be a good bet

 

[Zoll99]

what about http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CLARKE-PRO-GAS-GASLES-150-AMP-PRO-GARAGE-MIG-WELDER_W0QQitemZ180495779917QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_3?hash=item2a0663084d it seems quite cheap?

 

[Robotstar5]

what about http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/CLARKE-PRO-GAS-GASLES-150-AMP-PRO-GARAGE-MIG-WELDER_W0QQitemZ180495779917QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_3?hash=item2a0663084d it seems quite cheap?

Good DIY welder, £5 cheaper if you go to an MM VAT free day or contact Weldequip (shop at top). If you want to use gas, factor in the cost of regulator.

 

[Zoll99]

I've just realised I cant plug a welder 16amp directly into a 13amp socket and guide anywhere on how to install a 16amp plug?

 

[Wozzaaah]

Yes you can, it might pop the 13a fuse if you use it on full power for any length of time but it will work fine.
A 16a supply needs to be installed by a qualified electrician as it's covered by that pesky part P but basically you take a dedicated supply from a spare 16a mcb directly to a 16a 'ceeform' socket (blue, round caravan type) and it doesn't form part of a ring main or radial circuit.
One MCB - one socket, no spurs or anything else off that supply.

 

[BChild]

Yes you can, it might pop the 13a fuse if you use it on full power for any length of time but it will work fine.
A 16a supply needs to be installed by a qualified electrician as it's covered by that pesky part P but basically you take a dedicated supply from a spare 16a mcb directly to a 16a 'ceeform' socket (blue, round caravan type) and it doesn't form part of a ring main or radial circuit.
One MCB - one socket, no spurs or anything else off that supply.

Can I have several 16A sockets on one ring main (provided only one is ever used at a time) my Garage is 11m deep and I'd like to avoid using ext leads if I can

 

[Robotstar5]

Can I have several 16A sockets on one ring main (provided only one is ever used at a time) my Garage is 11m deep and I'd like to avoid using ext leads if I can

If you use the correct cable size & protection you can use more than one

 

[Zoll99]

Ok thanks for all the comments really useful, not quite made up my mind yet but narrowed it down to about 3

Clarke 130EN MIG Welder

Portamig MIG Welders 185

LORCH M-PRO 170 Synergic MIG Welder

I know they cover a huge range in price so its a choice between getting the clarke now saving up a few months for the portamig or saving up even more for the lorch. I want an easy smooth learning curve so am prepaired to spend more on a welder it this will help me.

 

[Zoll99]

Anyone know whent he next MM vat free day is or where I can find out? Thanks