Newbie needing help with welding setup (MIG)

[Jack-96]

Hello everyone!,

Hi, My name is Jack and I am new to the forum so please dont hesitate to to tell me off if im the wrong place haha! but I know you probably get this a hell of a lot but I am a complete and utter newb with welding and I don't know anyone who welds or has any knowledge of welding so I decided to join this welding community and see if I can get some help!. So to all those willing to read my rant thankyou!.

Anywho I am needing helpful advice for a MIG welding setup, it will be inside a rented garage (off of a friend) but it has no electric there whatsoever and I am planning on having a motorcycle project in there, so probably wont need to weld anymore than 4-5mm thick mild steel ?. So with there being no electric ill need to run a MIG welder and probably some other power tools off of a generator. I wanted some help deciding on the set I buy before I buy it so I dont make any expensive mistakes. trouble is i dont want anything fancy or expensive so looking to purchase both genny and mig for around 300-400 pounds, I have browsed ebay and amazon and have found a couple I like, so welder wise it would be between a Draper 150 AT Turbo for 185 pounds or a cheap and cheerful MIG 130 Amp Welder for 88 pounds (links are at the bottom for more information) and what sort of generator would I have to buy for it to be able to run? I kind of understand the aspects needed for the welder but the generator needed to power it im completely lost.

Any information would be a massive help so thankyou to anyone who replys! and any more information needed please just ask!

Cheap and Cheerful!
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Gasless-M...092613?hash=item4653b52ac5:g:V~EAAOSwMtxXvmeo

More expensive but good brand
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Draper-MW...185950?hash=item3ce394515e:g:xR0AAOSw8lBTq83M

Possible Genny ?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Kraftech-...311098?hash=item3f4323107a:g:awAAAOSwux5YKZic

 

[Omniata]

Errrmmm, I bought a Draper and a Chinese, I'd rate the latter over the former.

Regarding generators, neither will run well off one.
I'm sure other members could give best advice on what works and what doesn't with a generator.

If this is something that could go longer term, that is welding other things, I'd advise saving more and buying a decent bit of kit once, rather than several wasted purchases.

 

[Jack-96]

Thankyou for the advice Omniata, and it probably wont go much further than small jobs here and there and small bike parts and panels in the garage so probably wont go crazy and as this is my first welder.
Thankyou!

 

[cumbriasteve]

Welcome to the forum, I am afraid neither of those would be my choice, there are much better hobby machines out there and those two may be cheap but there are reasons for that.

Sorry I can't help with the genny question, it's better answered by those with the know how of what is required to work well.

 

[rich1608]

As CumbriaSteve says, I wouldn't get either of these, the best of the budget machines is Clarke most of which are well made (in Europe not China) and have excellent spares availability. Resale value is better too.

Don't bother with that generator as it's a 3-phase machine so although the total power is 6500 watts the power you can draw from a single phase will be a lot less. I think the general rule is that if the welder draws say 3KW maximum you would need a generator with an output of twice that, ie 6KW. I hope this helps!

 

[Jack-96]

As CumbriaSteve says, I wouldn't get either of these, the best of the budget machines is Clarke most of which are well made (in Europe not China) and have excellent spares availability. Resale value is better too.

Don't bother with that generator as it's a 3-phase machine so although the total power is 6500 watts the power you can draw from a single phase will be a lot less. I think the general rule is that if the welder draws say 3KW maximum you would need a generator with an output of twice that, ie 6KW. I hope this helps!

Thanks Rich1608, I shall keep an eye out for a nice Clarke then thankyou for the advice and ahhh I see! all very good points! well thats helped me a hell of a lot already! so potentially looking for a single phase genny that produces double or more than the welder.
Thankyou thats helped quite a lot!

 

[Jack-96]

Welcome to the forum, I am afraid neither of those would be my choice, there are much better hobby machines out there and those two may be cheap but there are reasons for that.

Sorry I can't help with the genny question, it's better answered by those with the know how of what is required to work well.

thankyou cumbriasteve, and i had a feeling that would come up haha, all very good points which i shall listen too, so what machines would you recommend ? as rich1608 sais Clarke looks like a good brand, and thats alright, its a pretty tricky question to answer!
Thankyou!

 

[cumbriasteve]

I think the fact you are using a Gennys stops me making a suggestion.... sorry about that but I dont know

thankyou cumbriasteve, and i had a feeling that would come up haha, all very good points which i shall listen too, so what machines would you recommend ? as rich1608 sais Clarke looks like a good brand, and thats alright, its a pretty tricky question to answer!
Thankyou!

I have the Clarke 135 so would be happy saying they are ok.

I am afraid your budget will I think make it very difficult to get anything unless it's a used set up.

I know very little about gennys but have noticed they come up for sale quite often on the facebook pages in the local agricultural groups.

 

[Cobbler]

One thing I would add to what's already been said, I would steer clear of the Clarkes budget range. The low settings are on the high side according to the specifications for car work. Also they are a bit unproven as yet. I've not heard of anyone on here that has tried one yet, they may well be fine. If you look at M. Marts catalogue & go for any of the ones marked Italian made, you won't go far wrong.

 

[Jack-96]

I think the fact you are using a Gennys stops me making a suggestion.... sorry about that but I dont know

I have the Clarke 135 so would be happy saying they are ok.

I am afraid your budget will I think make it very difficult to get anything unless it's a used set up.

I know very little about gennys but have noticed they come up for sale quite often on the facebook pages in the local agricultural groups.

yes the budget is quite low which dosent help haha and ive been reading up on the clarkes and they do seem pretty good for how cheap they are compared to others and as for the genny ill keep an eye out for any used ones as there are a few decent ones out there and seeing as its just going to be a hobby build i wont be thrashing it.

 

[Jack-96]

Keep an eye on gumtree / local papers etc
I got my clarke 151en for £120 (IIRC) basically unused, the guy bought it while his 135TE was in for repair and decided he preferred the 135 for some reason (familiarity)
Runs off a 13Amp plug, but not sure how much it needs off a genny, initial arc up might be a fair bit

Bargain! and i guess its just down to personal preference i suppose, and i would love to be able to plug my welder into an extension cord and weld in my back garden but the neighbours would go blind haha and seeing as i have pretty much no garden, quite a low fence and no shed i cant really do it it home

 

[tazz]

ME BECAUSE OV THE MONEY YOU GOT ID GO FOR A SECOND HAND HONDA GENNY ;} BUT MAKE SURE IT IS KICKIN OUT WHAT IS SHOULD BE FORE YOU HAND OVER THE CASH N SAME WITH THE WELDER SECOND HAND BUT TRY BEFORE YOU HAND OVER THE MONEY SOMEIT WITH A EURO TOUCH
GUMTREE A GOOD PLACE TO START
GOOD LOOK

 

[Jack-96]

ME BECAUSE OV THE MONEY YOU GOT ID GO FOR A SECOND HAND HONDA GENNY ;} BUT MAKE SURE IT IS KICKIN OUT WHAT IS SHOULD BE FORE YOU HAND OVER THE CASH N SAME WITH THE WELDER SECOND HAND BUT TRY BEFORE YOU HAND OVER THE MONEY SOMEIT WITH A EURO TOUCH
GUMTREE A GOOD PLACE TO START
GOOD LOOK

ive decided to buy a new small 90 amp Clarke MIG102NG because its only for small hobby welds but still stuck on genny :/ and yea the honda gennys have great reputation but i need to work out what volts/amps/watts the welder needs/has before i can pick a genny and i cant work out what the welder will need power wise for initial spark and constant to work out what W/KVA/KW the genny has to put out ..... gaahhh xD

 

[cumbriasteve]

I am afraid if you are as you state possibly welding 4 to 5mm at times the Clarke 90 will not be a good buy, you will be very limited with a machine as low powered as that and it's not suitable for that use especially on anything where weld strength is safety critical.

I can see you buying two mig's, the second one after you realise the first one was not the right choice, don't worry though, you will be in good company, a lot of us have done it, the trouble is it's an expensive learning curve.

 

[123hotchef]

I am afraid if you are as you state possibly welding 4 to 5mm at times the Clarke 90 will not be a good buy, you will be very limited with a machine as low powered as that and it's not suitable for that use especially on anything where weld strength is safety critical.

I can see you buying two mig's, the second one after you realise the first one was not the right choice, don't worry though, you will be in good company, a lot of us have done it, the trouble is it's an expensive learning curve.

very true I have brought 3 now!

 

[Cobbler]

Personally I would not buy the 102ng, because it's no-gas only. The gasless wire doesn't give a nice clean weld & can be tricky to use on thin material such as car work. With this one you haven't got the option to use gas, either co2 or argon mix. We've all tried the gasless at some time & all now use gas! The gasless has its uses, but I would not use it if I could help it.

 

[cumbriasteve]

Personally I would not buy the 102ng, because it's no-gas only. The gasless wire doesn't give a nice clean weld & can be tricky to use on thin material such as car work. With this one you haven't got the option to use gas, either co2 or argon mix. We've all tried the gasless at some time & all now use gas! The gasless has its uses, but I would not use it if I could help it.

I was going to argue with you but it seems Machine Mart have no idea what they are selling, a deeper check proves you are correct and yes I agree a gasless only mig is something I would personally never have.

 

[123hotchef]

I have a 90en Clarke mig it can do both gas or gasless you just reverse the torch and earth return over it was my first mig welder I still have it with gasless only wire now for emergencies away from home as it is small and easy to move around

 

[Cobbler]

I was going to argue with you but it seems Machine Mart have no idea what they are selling, a deeper check proves you are correct and yes I agree a gasless only mig is something I would personally never have.

View attachment 95263

Please don't argue with me Steve, I hate arguments. Pistols at dawn OK?

 

[cumbriasteve]

Please don't argue with me Steve, I hate arguments. Pistols at dawn OK?

As long as I can have the one with the bullet in it and you are blindfolded