New workshop

[Jpwd3]

Hi,

I m looking to turn an old barn into my new workshop and I'm looking for some advice about how best to go about it.

The barn is steel framed around 10m x 17m and 10m high. The roof and upper part of the walls are cement / fibre with a number of translucent inserts, the lower part of the walls is brick. One wall is a little damp, but I think this is backseat the gutter has a number of holes, I think that once repaired the wall will dry out.

The floor is concrete but I suspect that it has no DPC (it was a lambing shed). The main door is 4m x 6m with wooden sliding doors that have seen better days. There is a small er door at the other end of the barn, the door is currently missing although I have boarded it up. The space above the door to the eves is Yorkshire boarding. There is (or will be) single phase power.

I guess my main question is how I might best avoid or deal with condensation. Since boarding up the small door just before Christmas I haven't had any significant condensation but I suspect that's due to the weather rather than anything else, although I haven't yet dared to move any machines into the barn

I can't (afford) to insulate the whole barn and I’m not particularly fussed about needing to heat the space. I did wonder how commercial workshops / tyre places etc manage condensation on tools etc when their whole space is open during the day and then closed at night.

I guess I could consider building, insulating and heating a smaller space (perhaps underneath a mezzanine) for my tools and then use the rest of the space for vehicles, bigger projects and storage etc. I'd prefer not to do this but could go down this line if necessary.

Picture as it stands at the moment:


Any suggestions would be appreciated.

 

[gaz1]

which ever way you choose theres a cost involved

mezzanine floor and insulating that can be considered but your still dealing with a cost of buying it and insulating it out

as goes for heating what is your most easiest option on materials to get wood gas or diesel or electric

as goes for insulation its roll wire ties and a white sheet for reflection purpose when using lighting

concrete sides are hard to heat up insulate board, roll insulation or straw bale look up straw bale houses r rated at 27 but factories can use them they just need rodent protection

 

[Maxakarudy]

I have a similar barn 25mx13m, not as tall though, I've got 100mm insulated roof panels, that I'm going to use to section off a 9m x 6m area so I can keep expensive machines
dry & heat the area I spend most of my time in. Spray foam is ideal, but expensive.
Is it for business or liesure work?

 

[Jpwd3]

In terms of heating the easiest is electric although diesel could be a possibility.

It does sound like I need to partition, insulate and heat part of it - it might also add another layer of security.

I hadn't considered straw insulation - all my neighbours are arable farmers so there not a shortage locally - but as you say rodents would be a concern.

This is definitely hobby purposes only.

What I don't understand is how commercial garages etc. that re unheated avoid condensation issues.

 

[Olderisbetter]

My mate has a large barn which has four shipping containers in and a porta cabin, one container is workshop the other three are safe storage and the porta cabin is a posh warm workshop, the rest of the barn is indoor space with a car ramp that he only uses in warmer weather

 

[Jpwd3]

My mate has a large barn which has four shipping containers in and a porta cabin, one container is workshop the other three are safe storage and the porta cabin is a posh warm workshop, the rest of the barn is indoor space with a car ramp that he only uses in warmer weather

I did wonder about containers - again they would provide additional security and I guess if appropriately sited the space in between could roofed, insulated and heated.

 

[knighty]

I think once the space is big enough you don;t really get condensation

I think/guess there's not the temperature swings smaller areas have

my workshop is about that size, brick walls, insulated roof (but couple of leaks), it's bloody freezing in the winter... but there's never been a drop of condensation in there

I once left a 15kw electric heater on full blast 24 hours a day for a week (forgot it was on) it did literally nothing to warm the place up so it's not like it's warm in there :-o

 

[DanZac]

What I don't understand is how commercial garages etc. that re unheated avoid condensation issues.

They dont. Every where I've worked, from aircraft hangers down, suffers to some degree. Unless your prepared to heat the whole place its impossible.

The best bet is to put the machinery in a heated area (or one that you can at least keep warm) and ensure the rest of the space is well ventilated.

 

[gaz1]

In terms of heating the easiest is electric although diesel could be a possibility.

It does sound like I need to partition, insulate and heat part of it - it might also add another layer of security.

I hadn't considered straw insulation - all my neighbours are arable farmers so there not a shortage locally - but as you say rodents would be a concern.

This is definitely hobby purposes only.

What I don't understand is how commercial garages etc. that re unheated avoid condensation issues.

yours has a high concrete wall so less issues with rodents but great for keeping in top heat but means square bales

Straw bale insulation offers high R-values, typically ranging from R-30 to over R-40 for a standard wall assembly, due to its excellent thermal resistance per inch (around R-2 to R-3 per inch), providing superior insulation compared to conventional walls and reducing energy costs significantly.

i do know of an alternative for insulating the base area but i would advise either breeze block or concrete base wall first before its used

breeze block and thermalite blocks are ok however they have issues with water thermalite being the better insulator just crap on fastening to them

 

[AVI_8]

What a great size workshop that’s going to be, should be easy enough to build an insulated stud partition room within the workshop to house your tools, with regards to heating the workshop, an indirect space heater vented outside would get the inside temp of the workshop up to a reasonable level on the coldest days, but that temp won’t last long when it’s switched off, I’ve one of those, it’ll get my 8 x 9 x 4 metre workshop from freezing to 10 degrees in about 25 minutes, yours is much larger so it would take longer, I tend to use it first thing to make the environment nicer to start work then when I’ve started working don’t really notice the cold, you’ll never maintain heat in that area for any time but to get it reasonable to start work helps if you’ve just come from a warm house.

 

[zzr1200]

See if you can obtain an old end of life 40ft Reefer Container Box, the style that takes a clip on fridge pack, instant maximum insulation, the only thing you may need to do is install a personal door.

Google Search

 

[jmp49]

Nice sized space, I have a barn workshop converted from a open sided barn originally & a few smaller outbuildings that were for pigs etc originally, and I havent even contemplated insulating or heating the big barn because the fuel costs would be insane and I'd rather spend that on fun stuff like new tools instead. The little workshops have diesel heaters, but I only put them on when its really harsh or to stop the water freezing inside the workshop, which only happens with sustained negative temperatures.
But this xmas I got some usb powered heated thermals that I wear under trousers and a hoodie, so I havent fired up the heating at all in any of the smaller workshops, and condensation doesnt seem as bad as a result. As I start to get stuck in, I find myself turning the usb thermals off anyway. It got to -7c outside at night here the other day, but unless the doors are left open for significant amounts of time, inside the building will stay 7-8c unless it sustains for weeks on end. Same for the big barn but a couple of degrees lower.
The only time I really needed to heat the big barn in winter was to spray family cars, and I found the best solution to that was to put up a chinese inflatable paint booth inside the building, and feed the booth warm air from a diesel heater instead of the fresh air fan blower. I wear a airfed mask spraying anyway because its 2k so less ventilation concerns. Its also cleaner, and fits in a old ibc tank up on the pallet racking when not in use.

Think I would be tempted to put a container in your barn just from the security aspect alone, its going to be really difficult to make that building secure, if you get solid doors, someone will just cut in through a side wall above the block level or down from the roof, or just borrow a handy jcb or tractor and drive through the blocks. Steel container and a suitable lock should slow someone down, and because its already inside your building nobody will ever have any business to be near it to do it, so you can put some some cameras to detect people while theyre breaking into it and alert you so you can take remedial action. Even the best most secure building will only ever buy you time to get remedial action sorted, its just a question of how much time you need to be able to respond.

 

[zzr1200]

Similar story here...

 

[gaz1]

you have to decide on door access



picking only one helps to warm a place up but dual opening doors are difficult to seal but can be sealed with rubber but wont fully seal at the top

however an internal door will seal up much better

as goes for storage racking is a good reference its also a good way of creating a room that can be heated with 3m wide access with doors if you want

if done within the middle and pointing outwards will give storage access on both sides