New to welding and struggling

[Jumpinjacks]

Hi,
I have a snap on 130 mig welder that I have had for ages, I have only just got around to giving it a go. A friends work buddy gave me a quick lesson on his welder which was a snap on 150 mig. And he said I could weld very good with it, so I went home happy, and then had a go with my welder. And I couldn't get the hang of it, I need to get used to what settings to use I think, his welder was very smooth and he did all the settings for me.
I have tried adjusting the settings to what it says in the tutorial but my wire speed will not go that low for the material I am using.
I am using 18 guage steel. My welds on the steel sheets don't seem to bad, I had the setting on 1 max and wire speed on level 1.
I am needing to weld patches in the floor and arches of my suzuki samurai. I had a go with it and seem to burn through the arches very quickly, even when turning the power setting down to 1 min and wire speed right down.
I was trying to weld straight lines, but it wasn't possible due to it burning straight through too quickly, so for a small patch I tried I had to keep doing small blobs, which was messy.
Where am I going wrong?
I know I probably need more practice and the suzuki's steel is very thin. But I have to get it done. So could do with any help
Thanks.

 

[octo0072000]

holes

what wire are you using should be 0.6 and argoshield lite gas
or are you useing gasless wire makes a big differance take your welder to you mate and let him set it up for you and test it out

 

[gavuk]

I am needing to weld patches in the floor and arches of my suzuki samurai. I had a go with it and seem to burn through the arches very quickly, even when turning the power setting down to 1 min and wire speed right down.
I was trying to weld straight lines, but it wasn't possible due to it burning straight through too quickly, so for a small patch I tried I had to keep doing small blobs, which was messy.

Thanks.

when you switched to the "thin metal technique" of pulsing the trigger you should have reset to a higher setting again,the control being as much to do with timing the trigger is pressed, as using a low current,set up some practise joints and try it.Should be able to do it with 0.8 or 0.6mm wire with co2 or argonmix,with practise

 

[PaulMcElhinney]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BsDxqb2p5OM

1. Watch this youtube clip. I bought the DVD. It's brilliant, he's an excellent tutor.

2. Only weld about three quarters of an inch to an inch at a time. Then stop, let it cool down to the point where you can touch it then do the next inch. Whether you're doing runs or pulsing this should prevent you from blowing holes. If you can clamp a piece of copper, aluminium, or brass behind your joint do. It will take heat out of the joint and provides a backing that will assist with keeping the weld pool in the right place. Also as a novice you will have a tendency (like me) to be tentative = slow torch speed. Practice moving the torch faster on scrap.

3. I too am a novice so if a more experienced welder disagrees with me I bow to your greater knowledge. However these are my experiences of butt welding 1.0mm sheet steel.

Good luck. Don't give up. If you make a mess cut it out and start again on your next day off. Just think, worst case scenario is that you'll have a car like Fred Flintstone. Look how popular he was...

Regards,


Paul.

 

[Engineer]

Contrary to popular belief it is much harder to weld with a MIG thats not very good quality. If you can weld OK with your mates set it seems to suggest your "Snap-On" 130A set is like to be the problem..................if its anything like the one I had many years ago, they are very poor!

 

[gavuk]

. If you can weld OK with your mates set it seems to suggest your "Snap-On" 130A set is like to be the problem..................if its anything like the one I had many years ago, they are very poor!

I had a snap-on 130amp for a while ,also badged as boc or cebora ,they are not normally a bad set ,much more likely that you have set it up badly or your technique needs refining,get your mates mate to pop around and help you set up ,what wire and gas are you using?...were you taught on the same thickness material?....too early to blame just the machine ,blowing through or blobby welds could be operator or machine and buying a "better" welder may not cure your problems

 

[Jumpinjacks]

what wire are you using should be 0.6 and argoshield lite gas
or are you useing gasless wire makes a big differance take your welder to you mate and let him set it up for you and test it out

I am using 0.8 wire and have argon c02 deposible gas bottle.

 

[Jumpinjacks]

I think the welder is ok to be honest, I think its just me not setting it up correctly, and that I need more practise. I guess I am trying to run before I can walk with going straight into welding to the sj.
Thanks for all the advise, I will give it a go again soon.

 

[gavuk]

Pauls video shows the guy welding for no more than a 3 count,probably only 1/4-1/2"...to use the thin metal technique ,and considering you are using 0.8mm with co2,it sounds like you need the 1max setting then use the trigger to control the overall temp.If you start the next spot, by pointing the wire at the the end of the last weld, you should overlap,and be pointing at a now thicker material.I find counting helps with how long to keep the trigger pressed,and where possible start the new spot before the last one has cooled from orange to black......Good luck I'm sure if you can get someone to watch you again you will crack it

 

[R Kraft]

Disposable gas bottles,often don't put out any gas,or run out before you can get started.
Robert

 

[Wozzaaah]

Contrary to popular belief it is much harder to weld with a MIG thats not very good quality. If you can weld OK with your mates set it seems to suggest your "Snap-On" 130A set is like to be the problem..................if its anything like the one I had many years ago, they are very poor!

That'll be it then, nothing to do with the fact he's barely ever used a welder before and the only tuition he's had is a quick lesson from his mate.
Nothing wrong with those machines other than the torch is a bit of a crap design. They're made by a well-known Italian manufacturer and the model has been around for decades and is still available now. Oh, and they have copper windings too!

 

[octo0072000]

I am using 0.8 wire and have argon c02 deposible gas bottle.

you may be better on the thin stuff with 0.6 wire as well as wire you need a 0.6 tip as well
again take your welder to your mate let him have a go and help ypu with the settings
watch a lot of you tube videos and check out the tutorials pages on here then practice practice practice on a bench
all metal must be cleaned till shiny useing grinding disc or flap wheel
have fun it's a big learning curve

 

[Robotstar5]

Oh, and they have copper windings too!

 

[david500]

Get hold of a lump of brass, Can get nice strips or flat bar off ebay quite cheap,Or find something around the house.
Put it tight behind the steel your welding. You Wont blow through then, Also can fill small holes the same way, just weld straight onto the brass and into the surrounding metal! Steel wont stick to it and it wont melt.
This is assuming the steel is at fault and not your technique or welder.
Although it might stop you melting your Zuki while your learning?

All welders should have a nice bit of brass in their toolbox

 

[Drains]

Oh, and they have copper windings too!

Also

This one could run and run.

And to the OP, 0.6 wire would be more forgiving, as would a proper gas bottle

 

[Engineer]

That'll be it then, nothing to do with the fact he's barely ever used a welder before and the only tuition he's had is a quick lesson from his mate.
Nothing wrong with those machines other than the torch is a bit of a crap design. They're made by a well-known Italian manufacturer and the model has been around for decades and is still available now. Oh, and they have copper windings too!

Main problems with the cheap sets I have seen seems to be plastic wire feed tensioning mechanisms, which when combined with ultra cheap wire feed motors, and plastic wire liners, adds up to all sorts of feed problems, does tend to make things really difficult for a beginner.

I started with a new crap set, (Snap On 130) and started to think that all the problems I was having were down to me (which seems common to many posting on here). However I then went to work at a place where I could use proper industrial 3 phase machines.

Pretty much as soon as I started to use the 3 phase sets all the previous problems were gone, and I was able to produce some reasonable standard work, including quite a lot of repairs on rusty old cars.

 

[Drains]

Engineer, I think you need to stop seeing things so black and white. There are certainly some very nasty cheap DIY Mig sets with poor tensioners, poor liners, poor motors and often, importantly, inappropriate current/wire speed feedback control; but there are also nice, not quite so cheap DIY mig sets. There are particular brands which have a reputation for being best used as boat anchors, there are others which people recommend on the basis that they do what they are meant to. I used a sub 200A Clarke set for many years and made a living from it. It gave very good quality welds, was totally reliable, and I believe is still going strong in a mates workshop. I bought it in 1999. Don't knock it.

It's a complete waste of time for you to recommend that people buy professional 3-phase copper wound sets when they a) don't have the budget, b) are not about to spend x-thousands of pounds fitting 3 phase and c) don't need plant that can deliver 300+amps when all they want to do is nail up some bodywork or a bit of 3mm thick SHS.

If you really want to be helpful, find out a bit about which DIY makes and sets are worth recommending and recommend them; and if you can't do that, stick to what you know - whatever that is.

 

[Jumpinjacks]

Engineer, I think you need to stop seeing things so black and white. There are certainly some very nasty cheap DIY Mig sets with poor tensioners, poor liners, poor motors and often, importantly, inappropriate current/wire speed feedback control; but there are also nice, not quite so cheap DIY mig sets. There are particular brands which have a reputation for being best used as boat anchors, there are others which people recommend on the basis that they do what they are meant to. I used a sub 200A Clarke set for many years and made a living from it. It gave very good quality welds, was totally reliable, and I believe is still going strong in a mates workshop. I bought it in 1999. Don't knock it.

It's a complete waste of time for you to recommend that people buy professional 3-phase copper wound sets when they a) don't have the budget, b) are not about to spend x-thousands of pounds fitting 3 phase and c) don't need plant that can deliver 300+amps when all they want to do is nail up some bodywork or a bit of 3mm thick SHS.

If you really want to be helpful, find out a bit about which DIY makes and sets are worth recommending and recommend them; and if you can't do that, stick to what you know - whatever that is.

Here here
I do want to know which starter diy sets are best to learn from.

 

[gavuk]

I've used or owned a snap-on 130a,a sealey 130a(red) and a clarke 150a and apart from the added amps of the clarke i couldn't fault any of them ,they all worked on co2,and 0.8mm wire mainly for car work.The clarke's and the portamigs are without doubt the forum favourites for learners...If you know how to weld,its possible to pick up good used examples of more industrial machines or used diy machines,but most learners prefer to buy new ,i think,because of the guarantee ....avoid Sip or at least read what other members think before buying

 

[DaveM-sport]

I bought a fancy 3ph. 500A set as more or less my first welder
But the fact I already had the power supply and will be welding fairly heavy stuff regularly makes it more justifiable.

I would agree to a point with engineer though. On smaller sets that my mates have it always took a few minutes to get the knack of it. I started off welding some 10-15mm thick steel rims on our industrial loader that I was widening to fit bigger tyres and only bit of bad weld was when I forgot to turn on the gas.

Going trying some old body panels this evening though to see how I get on although with 1.2mm wire in it at the moment I'm not expecting much.