Motor parts direct gas

[tom-madbiker]

hi all just thought this was worth a post im currently getting my gas from the above 20 litre bottle of mix is 70 inc vat collected you have to buy the bottle then just exchange also they do oxygen and fuel gas and argon its from southwest gas supplies comes in 10,20 or 30 litre bottles

 

[Tiggy_dorset]

I exchanged my 20 litre pure argon yesterday at a SWG supplier yesterday- worked out £90 inc vat
I think the price can slightly vary between different agents though.

 

[PTvor]

I recall that aqualung cylinders had to be tested every three years and sometimes they'd fail. What's the deal with these bottles?

If you pay for the bottle then exchange, you are presumably not exactly buying the bottle. They don't fill your bottle by the sound of what you say, but they take it in return with a fill charge for a full bottle. So is this really a sort of one off, non-returnable deposit rather than buying the bottle?

With an aqualung cylinder, they definitely check whether it's within test then fill and return your bottle, but all they need is a suitable compressor; it's different with an industrial gas.

What pressure do they fill to?

 

[Tiggy_dorset]

The agents keep some full bottles in stock, or can get the next day. They simply exchange the empty for a full at the cost of a refill. If I were to return the empty and no longer wanted any more bottles, they will/should refund the deposit I paid when I got my first bottle

 

[PTvor]

So this is SouthWest Gas Supplies, also known as SGS gases.

You don't buy the bottle, you pay a deposit which is unconditionally returnable - doesn't expire or go down with time. In my case for a 20L bottle of argon mix it was £84 inc VAT. The refill charge is £59 inc VAT. All this may vary a bit depending on what the agent wants to charge. They fill to a nominal 200 bar, which can be anywhere between 180 bar and 210 bar.

Oh they also do a cash-back for forum members first purchase, which is £10 for a 10L cylinder and £20 for a 20L cylinder. There's a thread on it.

 

[HMB]

I recall that aqualung cylinders had to be tested every three years and sometimes they'd fail. What's the deal with these bottles?

If you pay for the bottle then exchange, you are presumably not exactly buying the bottle. They don't fill your bottle by the sound of what you say, but they take it in return with a fill charge for a full bottle. So is this really a sort of one off, non-returnable deposit rather than buying the bottle?

With an aqualung cylinder, they definitely check whether it's within test then fill and return your bottle, but all they need is a suitable compressor; it's different with an industrial gas.

What pressure do they fill to?

Breathing gas cylinders have 2 checks. 2.5 yearly visual 5 yearly hydro. Normally wp is 230bar however can be 300. Tp is a lot more.

Rental cylinders all belong to the people your renting from. You pay a deposit and exchange the cylinder. It's never yours to keep

 

[PTvor]

Breathing gas cylinders have 2 checks. 2.5 yearly visual 5 yearly hydro. Normally wp is 230bar however can be 300. Tp is a lot more.

Rental cylinders all belong to the people your renting from. You pay a deposit and exchange the cylinder. It's never yours to keep

This isn't a rental scheme. You pay a deposit, which is probably at least a good proportion of the cost of a new cylinder and a strong disincentive to damage it. They will usually return the deposit. Undoubtedly there's some small print about the condition - it would be unreasonable to expect them to return the deposit if say, you'd drilled a hole in the cylinder.

I think there's no doubt that the cylinder is always the property of SGS gases. If you damaged the cylinder and they refused to return the deposit, I suppose it would still be their property, but the question of ownership would be academic as they'd hardly fight to get back a useless cylinder when they had the deposit. Since the deposit on a 20L cylinder is about £85 the question isn't likely to arise very often. I suppose there are other questions such as what would happen if SGS went bust? You could say you owned the cylinder then but once again it's academic.

What had me talking about aqualung cylinders was the talk of buying the cylinder from SouthWest Gas Supplies, in which case you'd have a responsibility to keep it in test, but that clearly isn't what happens.

 

[HMB]

If you buy or commission to be made a cylinder to hold gas under pressure. For its not for commercial use the rules and regs don't apply. However, getting it filled may cause you problems. Commercially however, if it's for a non breathing gas (and there are a few), it needs a 5 yearly inspection and hydro test. That will be stamped on the neck of the cylinder. Then you could ask a gas supplier to fill it. If it contains O2 or the likelihood of O2 being fed first it must be certified as being O2 clean

 

[addjunkie]

The pressure test cert is all part of bs5500 part 4 if memory serves me correctly. Its been a long time, and my brain is befuddeled these days.

 

[tom-madbiker]

thats about what i payed for the bottle initially and i did get the 20 quid back i just found it very useful as i have an account anyway for car bits so they deliver to my house which is handy my fills are a little more tho im sure i payed 70 inc vat last time i had it filled/exchanged

So this is SouthWest Gas Supplies, also known as SGS gases.

You don't buy the bottle, you pay a deposit which is unconditionally returnable - doesn't expire or go down with time. In my case for a 20L bottle of argon mix it was £84 inc VAT. The refill charge is £59 inc VAT. All this may vary a bit depending on what the agent wants to charge. They fill to a nominal 200 bar, which can be anywhere between 180 bar and 210 bar.

Oh they also do a cash-back for forum members first purchase, which is £10 for a 10L cylinder and £20 for a 20L cylinder. There's a thread on it.

 

[Chris Stevens]

Seems to me that unless your likely gas usage per year is very low indeed, that there isnt really much to be saved using the small non rental bottles? Would be interesting to see some accurate figures, as I think in some cases a size W rental bottle would probably be less money?

I looked at getting small non rental oxygen, and in terms of cost it wasnt a lot different to W full size rental, until cylinder deposit returned, when it would be a little cheaper.

 

[tom-madbiker]

i use about a bottle every 2 months but it is convenient as they deliver to me and they keep it in stock usually within 1 hr of my call they deliver to my door is boc that much cheaper i was quoted about 150 rental a year + fills +delivery/collection charge added to this if i collect both boc and air products are about a hr round trip

 

[PTvor]

I went with SGS because with the introductory discount, the price of the gas is attractive at least for the first bottle. It was convenient dealing with a motor factors a couple of miles away rather than setting up an account with BOC. Current circumstances are a bit awkward anyway, so I can't predict with any certainty how much gas I'll use in the next year, certainly some.

I'm anticipating that this bottle will last at least a year - a 20L bottle @ 200bar @ 10l/min is about 6 and a half hours' torch time. That's either years' worth, or a couple of days' use depending.

There's certainly nothing much lost by my using SGS, at least for the first bottle, and it's a decision which can always be reviewed.

Then as tom-madbiker says, a lot of it is going to depend on how you are fixed geographically.

 

[Tiggy_dorset]

I am in a similar situation whereas my gas usage cannot be guaranteed. I could use a bottle in a year, or I could use a bottle on one job (in which case I factor the cost of gas into that job). My SGS agent is walking distance from me. At present, I may pay a little extra overall, but the convenience of getting gas within 10 minutes is a big plus.