brightspark
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- Thread starter Rick
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I'm a little stuck on 1 thing that i'm not sure on yet. I need to get some oil to the turbo, i've managed to get a rollerbearing turbo as these don't need as high pressure/flow of oil. I'm just not sure what pump to use.
The engine (been 2 stroke) has got a "2 stroke oil pump" I was thinking about using this but would need to increase the flow rate. I can't think of a cheap available electric pump that would be upto the job of circulating hot engine oil.
Any idea's?
The engine (been 2 stroke) has got a "2 stroke oil pump" I was thinking about using this but would need to increase the flow rate. I can't think of a cheap available electric pump that would be upto the job of circulating hot engine oil.
Any idea's?
Heres a pic of the scooter with engine.
I've sleeved the rear axle and welded it up, just waiting for a sprocket (got a chain today) so i can weld some fittings onto the axle to accept it. Also need to sort out a brake. The engines mounted onto the fram so its pretty much finished that side of things. Got the electric start working and rebuilt the engine.
Then its just exhaust and turbo side of things to sort out. I'm considering getting it running first without the turbo, but that would mean remaking the exhaust afterwards.
I've sleeved the rear axle and welded it up, just waiting for a sprocket (got a chain today) so i can weld some fittings onto the axle to accept it. Also need to sort out a brake. The engines mounted onto the fram so its pretty much finished that side of things. Got the electric start working and rebuilt the engine.
Then its just exhaust and turbo side of things to sort out. I'm considering getting it running first without the turbo, but that would mean remaking the exhaust afterwards.
The scavenge pump sounds more realistic, the PAS pump idea is good but pretty complex for the small amount of oil I want. I'd rather go electric with it.
Although, if you look just behind the sprocket theres a small white plastic drive, this is where the 2 stroke pump used to go, it doesn't turn very fast though, its probably reduced about 10:1.
pedrobedro
Man at Matalan
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I think you're on a loser trying to turbo charge a 2 stroke because of the way they work. The turbo will pull the fuel charge for the next stroke out of the cylinder on the overlap as there will be no back pressure. If you want to lubricate the turbo it would be easier to set up a separate supply for it and use pre mix for the fuel as they are two different types of oil. You could use the power steering oil tank and pump, they are not much capacity and a roller bearing shouldn't need too much lubrication.
didnt know it was a 2 stroke, the blokes right turbo'ing a 2 stroke is a specialist job, the exhaust on a 2 stroke plays a very imporant part of the power output, a turbo in the way is gonna make things difficult.
supercharing on 2 strokes is common on 2 stroke diesels, in fact 2 stroke diesels will not run without a blower, I say blower its the suck action that is required to remove the last burnt charge.
If you want more power, look into designing a better exhaust system.
supercharing on 2 strokes is common on 2 stroke diesels, in fact 2 stroke diesels will not run without a blower, I say blower its the suck action that is required to remove the last burnt charge.
If you want more power, look into designing a better exhaust system.
I'm not sure how the turbo will "pull" the fuel out. A turbo manifold normally has double the pressure of the boost in the inlet. So this will be around 1.2 bar. I'm actually more worried about the back pressure been too high. So will be reducing the exhaust port height and widening it most likely.
I've gone for the roller bearing for the fact that they don't need as much oil. I did have a journal as well but I'll struggle for flow/pressure. I modified the 2stroke pump, it was going to pump from a tank normal engine oil, and then return back to the tank. I wouldn't have tried to run the turbo on the 2 stroke oil
I wanted to try and use that pump for the simplicity, but even with the "regulator" fully removed it didn't have enough flow.A PAS pump is a good idea, but a little bulky, I really wanted something small and electric.
I've done a fair bit of 2stroke tuning in the past. I made 19bhp on my "RS50" overshadowed by a local guy who made 27
.The bottom end gets the intake mixture first so it is forced into the top end. But at no extra pressure than normal. Although a turbo works slightly different and increases density of the air before it enters the engine.
I did think about a charger but its hard to find something suitable. To be honest big power isn't really needed. Its more the "ironic" aspect of it, and obviously we turbo cars pretty much every day of the week so it'll fit in well. Obviously the problem is the massive "overlap" I'll probably have to rework the exhaust timing to get it to work right.
Normsthename
Member
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You said that the engine was a 250cc.....
If its got an electric start and 5 speeds then it is actually a 200cc (196cc actual) engine from a Suzuki GT200 X5
The 250cc version (GT250 X7) was a six speed unit without an electric start.
If you look closely on the cylinder barrels, the cc is usually cast / stamped into the barrels
Hope this helps, looks like a great project!
Andy
If its got an electric start and 5 speeds then it is actually a 200cc (196cc actual) engine from a Suzuki GT200 X5
The 250cc version (GT250 X7) was a six speed unit without an electric start.
If you look closely on the cylinder barrels, the cc is usually cast / stamped into the barrels
Hope this helps, looks like a great project!
Andy
You said that the engine was a 250cc.....
If its got an electric start and 5 speeds then it is actually a 200cc (196cc actual) engine from a Suzuki GT200 X5
The 250cc version (GT250 X7) was a six speed unit without an electric start.
If you look closely on the cylinder barrels, the cc is usually cast / stamped into the barrels
Hope this helps, looks like a great project!
Andy
Ye, its actually a 200cc with .5 overbore. Figured this afterwards but forgot to put it up
Need to get the new pics up. I haven't got a CDI or rectifier unit and need a wiring diagram, thats whats holding me up now.
Not updated this.
I've got some wiring diagrams now, and the rest of the electric's, just need to make 2 looms, 1 for the scooter and another for the engine.
Heres a picture of how it stands, sorry its a crap pic, only 1 i took.
Engine is mounted, rear axle is welded, sprockets on, chains on, etc etc.
I've got some wiring diagrams now, and the rest of the electric's, just need to make 2 looms, 1 for the scooter and another for the engine.
Heres a picture of how it stands, sorry its a crap pic, only 1 i took.
Engine is mounted, rear axle is welded, sprockets on, chains on, etc etc.
Be interestin to see how you get on wit turbo, you'll have to fiddle with the a/r ratio a little.
I have experience of tuning and 'charging cars, but not so much bikes and 2 strokes, as I understand it the gas flows 2 ways in the exhaust fanimold on a 2 stroke, causing pressure and vacuum in the turbine housing side on the 'charger, is the oil seal arrangement up to the job on a unit taken from a car to stand vacuum, or are you planning on using a custom 'charger specially for a 2 stroke.
I have experience of tuning and 'charging cars, but not so much bikes and 2 strokes, as I understand it the gas flows 2 ways in the exhaust fanimold on a 2 stroke, causing pressure and vacuum in the turbine housing side on the 'charger, is the oil seal arrangement up to the job on a unit taken from a car to stand vacuum, or are you planning on using a custom 'charger specially for a 2 stroke.
I tune cars for a living. I'm a little worried my expensive wideband might get damaged during the setting up.
I've got a couple of idea's for adding extra fuel. Obviously the carbs bowls will need to have a line to allow for the pressure to be balanced as it comes on boost. I did think about connecting a pipe to the fuel tank to the "turbo side".
I've also thought about having an actuator operating a third carb, but this is only if I can't get the standard carbs to work right.
As for the exhaust side of things, Its going to be a case of "suck it and see". It doesn't have to work great, to be honest. So long as it makes boost it will make good power IMO. I spent many hours playing with different exhaust lengths etc, and had adjusters etc to allow them to be tuned. But with boost its so easy to get the 10% your spend hours trying to find on an n/a.
I'm going to go out now and see if i can figure this wiring out.
Regards
Ricky
chunkolini
celebrity artiste
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- Swansea
Mr Rick
You are now officially the town maniac. I picked up this title in my home town when I started going shopping on a tall bike. Well done.
You will get nowhere fast (literally, maybe 20 feet?) acting like this, just make sure you are recorded on video at the first test rides, if it works they will be a global scream.
Foolishness and engineering in one project? I doff my manky hat.
You will be a legend.
Chunko'.
You are now officially the town maniac. I picked up this title in my home town when I started going shopping on a tall bike. Well done.
You will get nowhere fast (literally, maybe 20 feet?) acting like this, just make sure you are recorded on video at the first test rides, if it works they will be a global scream.
Foolishness and engineering in one project? I doff my manky hat.
You will be a legend.
Chunko'.
Hi again, well sounds like you have a good idea.
This guy has managed it, only using small values of boost pressure, and looking at the dyno test it has big flat spots, but thats the nature with 2 stroke.
Looks like the turbo is on the end of the expansion chamber and vent direct to atmosphere.
Obviously works at low boost.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2683135400295297703#
This guy has managed it, only using small values of boost pressure, and looking at the dyno test it has big flat spots, but thats the nature with 2 stroke.
Looks like the turbo is on the end of the expansion chamber and vent direct to atmosphere.
Obviously works at low boost.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=2683135400295297703#
Sorry I went to do a bit more on it but found an oil leak, which meant the engine has to stay on its side while the sealant has gone off.
So I had to do some work and more
Haha, Have you got any pictures/links to the bike, sounds a laugh
Its hard finding time, but there's not "that" much left to do now.
So I had to do some work and more
Haha, Have you got any pictures/links to the bike, sounds a laugh
Its hard finding time, but there's not "that" much left to do now.
chunkolini
celebrity artiste
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- Swansea
Mr Rick
I apologise to your family for exposing you to this nonsense. if they disown you it is your problem. However I predict that this nonsense will suit you. See below.
Godzuki Son of Godzilla, my second tall bike
A quality bike, has covered over 1000 miles, touring, poncing about, downhill racing, a reliable stead.
Why is this a good idea? cheap and quick, a classic bike can be built in a day, see Godzuki, costs 'F' all and if it dont work you can laugh not cry.
Cider may have gone up by 10p per pint but it still does the job. Beer drinkers do not have the imagination to do this stuff.
The Ratweiler, a gruesome piece of junk, took about 45 minutes to build. Was recently donated to my Mate's boy, he was told he was being given a disc braked front suspension mountain bike built by a famous bike builder. His father is a smart ****. Te He He
Last shot, Chunko riding Godzuki into the 20 foot deep bomb hole, check out the concerned look on the Blonde's face, Chunko then jumped out of bomb hole, railed the berm, cleared the doubles then crashed into the nettles cos' he was laughinh too hard.
The great thing, all of these bikes took less than a whole day to build.
You have been warned.
For more information go to www.rat-patrol.org and check out the uk pages.
Yet again sorry to your family,
Chunko'.
I apologise to your family for exposing you to this nonsense. if they disown you it is your problem. However I predict that this nonsense will suit you. See below.
Godzuki Son of Godzilla, my second tall bike
A quality bike, has covered over 1000 miles, touring, poncing about, downhill racing, a reliable stead.
Why is this a good idea? cheap and quick, a classic bike can be built in a day, see Godzuki, costs 'F' all and if it dont work you can laugh not cry.
Cider may have gone up by 10p per pint but it still does the job. Beer drinkers do not have the imagination to do this stuff.
The Ratweiler, a gruesome piece of junk, took about 45 minutes to build. Was recently donated to my Mate's boy, he was told he was being given a disc braked front suspension mountain bike built by a famous bike builder. His father is a smart ****. Te He He
Last shot, Chunko riding Godzuki into the 20 foot deep bomb hole, check out the concerned look on the Blonde's face, Chunko then jumped out of bomb hole, railed the berm, cleared the doubles then crashed into the nettles cos' he was laughinh too hard.
The great thing, all of these bikes took less than a whole day to build.
You have been warned.
For more information go to www.rat-patrol.org and check out the uk pages.
Yet again sorry to your family,
Chunko'.
