Legal reqirements

[hunter27]

Hi
My son`s car failed its mot on two rusty spots to the rear side of the sills, the garage said they would patch them for £45. and as I was busy at the time they did the job and passed the car (I wished I had done it myself).

The job is a mess the patches are small but being on the side of the sill and as it is a 2 door Micra the large flat panel behind the drivers door is badly distorted where they have seam welded the patch and is sticking out to a point.

What are the regulations for patches on cars chassis and panels in the UK can they be stitch welded, or spot welded or do they have to be seam welded.

I only want to know for future as when I get the time I will probably fit complete new sills and try to sort out the distorted panel.
Thanks for any help.
Pete

 

[irondarren]

Ok i get the feeling any repairs to a seal, which on a micra is structural has to be fully seem welded, but im not sure. Someone like Malcolm would probaly know the answer as he plays with cars, and has done a good few restoration projects. But i will do a net search and see what i can find

 

[irondarren]

http://www.crescentmotoringservices.com/motmyths.html#welding
Hunter i did a quick net search and found this.

Now if this guy is right then as i susspected it must be continous, so you would have a case against the garage that did the mot if it was stiched.

Hope it helps

 

[malcolm]

My approach is to fully seam weld patches. Though if you are replacing a sill and have flanges that would originally have been spot welded then a plug weld is a good enough equivalent to a spot weld.

There are ways of avoiding distortion though. I'll write up a page at some point, but the important thing is not to let the panel get hot. Tack everything up then weld an inch at a time, the first inch at the top of the repair and the next inch on a side. Then take a break for 10 minutes to let everything cool before the next couple of inches.

The garage will have done it in one go, getting the whole panel hot. It will have expanded in the heat and buckles when it cooled.

 

[hunter27]

Hi Irondarren
And thanks for the quick reply, I may have used the wrong word with seam welding as I did mean continuous, I am not trying to get at anyone he did a continuous weld but I guess it was the apprentice that did it badly buckling the adjoining panel.

I only want to make sure I did it right when I got the time.
It used to be all right to braze or stitch weld cars body panels but I had heard that this was not allowed now and its years since I have done any welding on cars.
Pete

 

[hunter27]

Thanks Malcolm
You are probably right about them doing it all at once. I will keep my eye out for it.
Thanks again l
Pete

 

[murex400]

When ever I have had to weld a car I have always let the new piece in where possible.
Welding over the top of a hole is just a waste of time and that’s all the garage will have done. It also looks much neater

 

[hunter27]

Hi Murex400
Thats exactly what they have done.I completely agree with you.
Thanks Pete

 

[premmington]

I've been in many a row with a MOT tester about sill replacement, about how much weld!

Bottom line is... Patches must me welded all round!

Sill replacement.. My personal feeling is it you put more on than the manufacturer, it will be stronger. As many sills are only spot welded in places.

But I now weld an inch leave an inch along the top edges of new sills. Saves all the arguments...

http://www.remmington.plus.com

 

[hunter27]

Hi Preemington
That`s what I will do when I get round to it. It does seem to be a bit of a grey area.
Thanks Pete

 

[Ossian]

Any repairs to cars panel work within 30cm of a safety critical component eg suspension, steering, seat belt mounting point etc
have to be to a standard the same as the manufacturers.

Where spot welds have been used by the manufacturer you can use spot welds, seam welded sections require a seam weld and patch repairs require a seam weld.

So if you are fitting a cover sill, where the panel was originally spot welded ie along the bottom lip and top lip at the door it is normally ok to spot weld but all other areas require a seam weld.

Any outwith a specified area ie 30cm or more from a safety critical component you can repair however you want, cataloy, chewing gum paper mashie........ personnally I prefer to weld these as well

 

[Lippyp]

I plug welded the new sill on my chevy with a couple of areas of seam welds at the ends. The inner sill was seam welded on (butt welded) as was the patch on the floor. The inner kickpanel was seam welded where it was cut off and plug welded on the flange where it was originally spot welded, same with the bottom of the door pillar that was replaced. The whole lot was then seam sealed, painted and undersealed on the back.